Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[capt_oats]

@well fan for life referenced this in the match thread earlier but I thought I'd stick the post in here because it's more to do with 'A Thread For All Seasons' than it is a routine Celtic win...

I'd posted a running total of REPORTED fees we've brought in since Hutchison took over and the subsequent shift to fan ownership here just after the Scott transfer at the end of January so with the 'club record' fee for Turnbull that bumps the player trading revenue up further.

I'm not an accountant and I'm not doing a fucking audit so any of the joyless "no chance did we get X for that guy" c***s can do one...yes, some are probably contingent on add ons being activated and all that but I've lifted the reported fees from a quick Google and in the case of Pearson, Johnson, Heneghan and Bowman a rough guess based on the numbers that appeared in the accounts.

20/21 - David Turnbull (Celtic) - £3m - Transfer
19/20 - James Scott (Hull City) - £1.5m - Transfer
19/20 - Reece McAlear (Norwich City) - £250k - Transfer
19/20 - Jake Hastie (Rangers) £350k - Development Compensation
19/20 - Stuart McKinstry (Leeds United) - £400k - Transfer
18/19 - Ryan Bowman (Exeter City) - £30k - Transfer
18/19 - Cedric Kipré (Wigan) - c.£1m - Transfer
17/18 - Louis Moult (Preston North End) - £500k - Transfer 
17/18 - Ben Heneghan (Sheffield United) - £350k-ish - Transfer
16/17 - Marvin Johnson (Oxford United) - £750k-ish including sell on - Transfer
16/17 - Stephen Pearson (Atletico Kolkata) - £100k - Transfer 
16/17 - Ben Hall (Brighton) - £210k - Development Compensation
14/15 - Lee Erwin (Leeds United) - £500k - Development Compensation

Total = £8.94m

Kyle Semple also moved to Rangers and for 'a five figure fee' but I've left that one off as I don't think I've seen that number anywhere else beyond Reddit and The Twitter. There's also the ongoing Cadden dispute as well I guess.

The first sale under Robinson was Heneghan - so during his tenure the club has brought in a reported £7.38m through player trading.

Edited August 28, 2020 by capt_oats

[Phillips455]

56 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

@well fan for life referenced this in the match thread earlier but I thought I'd stick the post in here because it's more to do with 'A Thread For All Seasons' than it is a routine Celtic win...

I'd posted a running total of REPORTED fees we've brought in since Hutchison took over and the subsequent shift to fan ownership here just after the Scott transfer at the end of January so with the 'club record' fee for Turnbull that bumps the player trading revenue up further.

I'm not an accountant and I'm not doing a fucking audit so any of the joyless "no chance did we get X for that guy" c***s can do one...yes, some are probably contingent on add ons being activated and all that but I've lifted the reported fees from a quick Google and in the case of Pearson, Johnson, Heneghan and Bowman a rough guess based on the numbers that appeared in the accounts.

20/21 - David Turnbull (Celtic) - £3m - Transfer
19/20 - James Scott (Hull City) - £1.5m - Transfer
19/20 - Reece McAlear (Norwich City) - £250k - Transfer
19/20 - Jake Hastie (Rangers) £350k - Development Compensation
19/20 - Stuart McKinstry (Leeds United) - £400k - Transfer
18/19 - Ryan Bowman (Exeter City) - £30k - Transfer
18/19 - Cedric Kipré (Wigan) - c.£1m - Transfer
17/18 - Louis Moult (Preston North End) - £500k - Transfer 
17/18 - Ben Heneghan (Sheffield United) - £350k-ish - Transfer
16/17 - Marvin Johnson (Oxford United) - £750k-ish including sell on - Transfer
16/17 - Stephen Pearson (Atletico Kolkata) - £100k - Transfer 
16/17 - Ben Hall (Brighton) - £210k - Development Compensation
14/15 - Lee Erwin (Leeds United) - £500k - Development Compensation

Total = £8.94m

Kyle Semple also moved to Rangers and for 'a five figure fee' but I've left that one off as I don't think I've seen that number anywhere else beyond Reddit and The Twitter. There's also the ongoing Cadden dispute as well I guess.

The first sale under Robinson was Heneghan - so during his tenure the club has brought in a reported £7.38m through player trading.

Also note that i know some of the players listed (Louis Moult for example) were near the end of their contract when they were sold/transferred. I bet we could have gotten more for Moult if he had an extra year or so left on his contract. Maybe we could have won the Scottish Cup that year if we had kept him.

 

An absolute fantastic job by the club in both developing players and then selling for an appropriate price.

(Now sign Alan Campbell on a 5 year contract ASAP).

Edited August 28, 2020 by Phillips455

[capt_oats]

Further to that, from memory these are the players we've brought in for 'nominal' fees.

• Mark O'Hara (Peterborough)
• Liam Donnelly (Hartlepool)
• Trevor Carson (Hartlepool)
• Elliot Frear (Forest Green Rovers)
• Ryan Bowman (Gateshead)
• Louis Moult (Wrexham)
• Marvin Johnson (Kidderminster Harriers)

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

9 hours ago, Casagolda said:

I think O’Hara is the particular square peg here.

He’s like the Scottish Andy Rose. He covers a lot ground, wins a few headers etc but ultimately, he’s a fairly limited footballer and one not particularly suited to the rather niche role of sitting in front of the defence. 

Defensively he doesn’t have the awareness or positional discipline. Nor does he have the passing range of a Gorrin or even Donnelly to build attacks.

His best attributes are his physical ones and they’re kind of wasted in the role he’s currently playing. 

I think O'Hara is a good cover player for all the roles in midfield even if he doesn't really excel at any of them.

Definitely lacking defensive instincts and he has been caught out at several corners, Glentoran almost scored an identical goal to Accies and he was alseep at the front post on both occassions.

I was surprised at how effective we looked with a back 5. And i think it will look even better when Carroll gets back. But playing a 3-5-2 means all our wingers are useless because I wouldn't trust any of them to play wing back and I don't think Hylton, Seedorf, Hastie or Robinson are going to contribute enough to be one of the 2 strikers.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

I like O'Hara a lot but I think he's worse than Campbell as both as a box to box and sitting midfielder. I'd probably be tempted to play Campbell further back in Donnelly's role until he's back to give O'Hara a bit less defensive responsibility and let him run about causing chaos.

[well fan for life]

5 hours ago, capt_oats said:

@well fan for life referenced this in the match thread earlier but I thought I'd stick the post in here because it's more to do with 'A Thread For All Seasons' than it is a routine Celtic win...

I'd posted a running total of REPORTED fees we've brought in since Hutchison took over and the subsequent shift to fan ownership here just after the Scott transfer at the end of January so with the 'club record' fee for Turnbull that bumps the player trading revenue up further.

I'm not an accountant and I'm not doing a fucking audit so any of the joyless "no chance did we get X for that guy" c***s can do one...yes, some are probably contingent on add ons being activated and all that but I've lifted the reported fees from a quick Google and in the case of Pearson, Johnson, Heneghan and Bowman a rough guess based on the numbers that appeared in the accounts.

20/21 - David Turnbull (Celtic) - £3m - Transfer
19/20 - James Scott (Hull City) - £1.5m - Transfer
19/20 - Reece McAlear (Norwich City) - £250k - Transfer
19/20 - Jake Hastie (Rangers) £350k - Development Compensation
19/20 - Stuart McKinstry (Leeds United) - £400k - Transfer
18/19 - Ryan Bowman (Exeter City) - £30k - Transfer
18/19 - Cedric Kipré (Wigan) - c.£1m - Transfer
17/18 - Louis Moult (Preston North End) - £500k - Transfer 
17/18 - Ben Heneghan (Sheffield United) - £350k-ish - Transfer
16/17 - Marvin Johnson (Oxford United) - £750k-ish including sell on - Transfer
16/17 - Stephen Pearson (Atletico Kolkata) - £100k - Transfer 
16/17 - Ben Hall (Brighton) - £210k - Development Compensation
14/15 - Lee Erwin (Leeds United) - £500k - Development Compensation

Total = £8.94m

Kyle Semple also moved to Rangers and for 'a five figure fee' but I've left that one off as I don't think I've seen that number anywhere else beyond Reddit and The Twitter. There's also the ongoing Cadden dispute as well I guess.

The first sale under Robinson was Heneghan - so during his tenure the club has brought in a reported £7.38m through player trading.

Staggering amount of money to bring in. Particularly as it wasn't that long ago we were seeing folk like Murphy & Reynolds leave for effectively f**k all.

Cannae be far off the amount needed for our Colossus Tony Straker statue now.

[capt_oats]

11 hours ago, well fan for life said:

Staggering amount of money to bring in. Particularly as it wasn't that long ago we were seeing folk like Murphy & Reynolds leave for effectively f**k all.

Cannae be far off the amount needed for our Colossus Tony Straker statue now.

Aye, I mean the summer before that list starts Shaun Hutchinson signed for Fulham on a free. That's a nice bit of context.

I was reading the interview Robinson gave to the AP the other night about The David Turnbull Legacy and everything seems to be pointing to the money being used for strategic reserves and infrastructure projects.

Quote

Motherwell do not own their training ground and Robinson and the board are keen to ensure Turnbull’s legacy is lasting.

“I could sit here and moan,” he said when asked about losing such a talented player. “It’s frustrating as a manager, every time you build a squad… Imagine we put all those players together? We’d be a good side.

“But nobody told me anything different when I took the job. That’s the model of the football club.

“We develop players. It’s the only way the club can survive. We have all bought into that, we are a development club.

“We got a huge fee for David, which is fantastic for the club, and we are into another round in Europe, so now we need to build on that.

“I’m not expecting any more in my budget. What I want is the infrastructure of the football club, I want the training ground sorted out.

“I think the club will back that completely because we do develop players. Having a better environment to do that has to be the goal.”

Link

That seems absolutely fine tbh, especially given the previous record fee saw McLeish effectively set fire to it by signing folk like John Hendry and Andy Roddie.

Edited August 29, 2020 by capt_oats

[Archie McSquackle]

I think O'Hara is a good cover player for all the roles in midfield even if he doesn't really excel at any of them.
Definitely lacking defensive instincts and he has been caught out at several corners, Glentoran almost scored an identical goal to Accies and he was alseep at the front post on both occassions.
I was surprised at how effective we looked with a back 5. And i think it will look even better when Carroll gets back. But playing a 3-5-2 means all our wingers are useless because I wouldn't trust any of them to play wing back and I don't think Hylton, Seedorf, Hastie or Robinson are going to contribute enough to be one of the 2 strikers.

Are we going to see Carroll back in time to play on the other side from O'Donnell?

[Archie McSquackle]

Oh well, that's us bottom of the league and likely to stay that way for a few weeks. Hopefully we can use the international break to turn things round.

[Casagolda]

On 28/08/2020 at 12:24, Casagolda said:

I think O’Hara is the particular square peg here.

He’s like the Scottish Andy Rose. He covers a lot ground, wins a few headers etc but ultimately, he’s a fairly limited footballer and one not particularly suited to the rather niche role of sitting in front of the defence. 

Defensively he doesn’t have the awareness or positional discipline. Nor does he have the passing range of a Gorrin or even Donnelly to build attacks. 

Please see goals number one and two on Sunday. 

Still not sure why we went out and paid actual cash money(and presumably a decent wage) to bring him back. He’s not necessarily a bad player but he doesn’t fill a specific role in the team or have the quality to improve it. He’s just another body to fill up the squad. 

I think we have a lot of decent players ‘on paper’ but some poor recruitment/lack of planning this summer has left the squad bloated in certain areas and badly lacking in others. 

Take full back for example. Last year we had Grimshaw and Carroll with Tait as cover for the full back roles. We lost Tait, Carroll’s crocked long term and yet we didn’t sign a single full back this summer. Robinson must have realised he’d fucked it and after 3 games he had to plead for the funds to get O’Donnell in on a short term contract. 

Then there’s the forward area, which is such a mess at the minute Robinson’s had to change formation. We have about 8 different options, some of which are clearly good players but Robinson doesn’t seem to have any real idea on how it’s all meant to fit together. 

I think if we could get Carroll and Donnelly back fit, that’d helped massively. Sadly, I don’t think that’s on the cards for either in the near future.

Otherwise I’m not sure what Robinson can do short term cause I certainly can’t see him getting any more money to spend. 

Edited August 31, 2020 by Casagolda

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

I think O'Hara has potential to be a good player. But he's not a holding midfielder, not as good a box-to-box midfielder as Campbell and not technically as good as Polworth. Which means for me he's probably first sub when Donnelly is fit.

This article here from getting moved to midfield at Dundee in the record shows he doesn't think he's a defensive midfielder either.

I think he has potential to be useful further up the pitch, but he doesn't have the capabilities to play in a role where he has defensive responsibilities. That's two weeks in a row he's switched off and it's cost us.

Quote

 

“There was no progress on a personal level, working on things I felt could make me better. I played more than 80 games and could count on one hand the number of those that were in midfield.

“And it was never a run. It was always a one-off and back out. And it was always in the defensive role.

 

I don't know what's happening with O'Donnell's contract, but if we were to get him and Carroll fit and playing as the wing-backs, McGinley in for Mugabi (he's done ok but lets face it, he'll never be first choice). Donnelly, Polworth and Campbell in midfield and then two of Watt/Long/Lang up front, I think that would be a good way to go. 

However, I think it's possible there are too many injury and short-term contract variables to ever see that team on the pitch at once.

[Casagolda]

12 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

I think O'Hara has potential to be a good player. But he's not a holding midfielder, not as good a box-to-box midfielder as Campbell and not technically as good as Polworth. Which means for me he's probably first sub when Donnelly is fit.

This article here from getting moved to midfield at Dundee in the record shows he doesn't think he's a defensive midfielder either.

I think he has potential to be useful further up the pitch, but he doesn't have the capabilities to play in a role where he has defensive responsibilities. That's two weeks in a row he's switched off and it's cost us.

I think @capt_oats mentioned it last season but to me, O’Hara looks like he’s is in the wrong Robinson team. 

Back in the thunderdome days when we were shelling high balls towards Moult and Bowman he’d probably do a job. Lots of energy, winning headers, getting forward to support and trying to land on 2nd balls etc, he’d fit in nicely.

In the current set up though, he doesn’t really look like he fits in anywhere. 

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

Coleraine away in the next round.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Coleraine have a striker who's primarily known for GAA rather than football.  should be interesting at least.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eoin_Bradley

[capt_oats]

3 hours ago, Casagolda said:

I think @capt_oats mentioned it last season but to me, O’Hara looks like he’s is in the wrong Robinson team. 

Back in the thunderdome days when we were shelling high balls towards Moult and Bowman he’d probably do a job. Lots of energy, winning headers, getting forward to support and trying to land on 2nd balls etc, he’d fit in nicely.

In the current set up though, he doesn’t really look like he fits in anywhere. 

I don't think that was me but it's pretty on the money. Either way the 'O'Hara is the Scottish Andy Rose' shout nails it.

Tbh, you look at the impact he had on the 2nd half in the 4-4 cup game against St Mirren and it's easy to see why we'd want him around the squad but I agree that if everyone's fit our first choice midfield will be Campbell, Donnelly and Polworth.

So...back 3's back (alright!)?

Edited August 31, 2020 by capt_oats

[thisGRAEME]

1 hour ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Coleraine have a striker who's primarily known for GAA rather than football.  should be interesting at least.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eoin_Bradley

We'll probably fucking sign him

[Gallus Numpty]

25 minutes ago, thisGRAEME said:

We'll probably fucking sign him

The last GAA player we signed didn't doo too bad. Well, except that time when...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/m/motherwell/3735714.stm

Edited August 31, 2020 by Gallus Numpty

[capt_oats]

I'd largely given 'Motherwell Twitter' a swerve after reading the absolute mile oots in @Desp's mentions post-Turnbull.

Anyway, I just noticed Burrows confirmed to one of his reply guys that there is a sell-on involved. So, that's nice.

Edited August 31, 2020 by capt_oats

[18May1991]

People badgering our CEO for details of a transfer fee/ agreement.... dear oh dear. 

[Doctor Manhattan]

3 hours ago, thisGRAEME said:

We'll probably fucking sign him

 Only if he can play anywhere across the front three.