Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[RandomGuy.]

1 minute ago, well fan for life said:

I think we've all fancied a go at a 3-5-2 

I know the exact man you need for the job...

[Blink182]

My latest worry is that folk think Tierney is going to make a difference. He's shown some promise but usually when coming on. Can't remember a game he's started and made an impact. 

That could be said for almost the entire squad tbh. 

But I don't think starting Tierney or McKinstrey is going to change the outcome of anything that we do currently. 

[Well Well]

4 minutes ago, Blink182 said:

My latest worry is that folk think Tierney is going to make a difference. He's shown some promise but usually when coming on. Can't remember a game he's started and made an impact. 

 

I Can't remember a time when Tierney started a game, he always seemed to be on the bench.

[Desp]

37 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Based on the fact that he knew what he was inheriting and that he's had 20 games in charge, I think he now needs to start shouldering responsibility, particularly as we are using the same formation, making the same subs who have no impact.

This is where my frustration is.  Yes, the squad he has is severely lacking in a number of areas, but Hammell has literally made the same mistakes game after game after game.  He was a professional footballer for the best part of 20 years.  If he doesn't understand game management and tactics after all of that, he never will.

Huge month for him.  If we don't beat County and end up out the cup by the end of January, it'll be tough to find a way back.  Which would be a real fucking shame, because it's Stevie Hammell! 

[Desp]

3 minutes ago, Well Well said:

I Can't remember a time when Tierney started a game, he always seemed to be on the bench.

I'm sure he's started others since, but he started when we absolutely battered Dundee Utd 0-0.  If KvV had his shooting boots on that days, it would have been a Ross County style scoreline.  It was a rare day this season when we actually looked like a decent side.

I don't think we can rely on him to start every game at this point in his career, but in a game like County on Saturday, when we should be on the front foot and taking the game to them, he absolutely should be starting.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

If we combined KVV and Shields into one person called Kevin Shields we'd have a mercurial baller who puts in a power of work and also writes a cracking shoegaze album.

[Desp]

4 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

If we combined KVV and Shields into one person called Kevin Shields we'd have a mercurial baller who puts in a power of work and also writes a cracking shoegaze album.

Connor van Veen would be fucking terrible.

[Wellup83]

55 minutes ago, Blink182 said:

My latest worry is that folk think Tierney is going to make a difference. He's shown some promise but usually when coming on. Can't remember a game he's started and made an impact. 

That could be said for almost the entire squad tbh. 

But I don't think starting Tierney or McKinstrey is going to change the outcome of anything that we do currently. 

He may well be better off the bench but crux of the matter is he could have come off the bench at half time yesterday. Instead, Hammell introduces him with 10 to play and the match effectively gone.

[eliphas]

23 minutes ago, Wellup83 said:

He may well be better off the bench but crux of the matter is he could have come off the bench at half time yesterday. Instead, Hammell introduces him with 10 to play and the match effectively gone.

A page or so back I was critical about Hammel not doing something drastic.

But, I don't think that's entirely fair on him yesterday. He saw Shields wasn't working. So, McKinstry came on at half time and did make a difference. We then score, around the hour mark when you likely would be looking to change it so he decide to see how it goes for a bit longer which I can half understand  (see my other comment earlier about wishing we'd stop actually scoring goals...). I'd argue this was the point where he needed to be bold and continue with the change to the 4-2-3-1 we ended up with. 

Tierney and Johnstone were stripped to come on a good bit before they actually did (I sit just behind the dug out so always have an eye on it). They had to wait for a Hibs corner to play out, then a a Hibs throw in near our box, then stand about while a Hibs player was down and then Van Veen was down holding his chest after that so had to wait again. 

 

[Pettigrew]

1 minute ago, eliphas said:

...then stand about while a Hibs player was down and then Van Veen was down holding his chest after that so had to wait again. 

 

And with that, the goals, the VAR checks, Hibs' timewasting,  the other subs...4 mins added time.  

[Namaste]

17 hours ago, wellboy1991 said:

As far as I am led to believe Penney hates the place and wants to leave.

His body language certainly seems to look like this. I think he has been rotten since the return after the WC.
 

Plus with Max coming on ahead of SOD today I would expect him to leave aswell. Mutual agreement deal to free via contract. 
 

A left back is someone we are looking at on loan I believe. Who it will be, f**k knows. 

Penney can't defend, that was evident before yesterday, so if he's unhappy, thanks for your efforts 

[Bobby_F]

2 hours ago, gullane said:

I respect we live in a democracy and fans are seldom slow in vending their anger and despair. A lot of us therefore should shoulder some responsibility for the form of Connor Shields. Yesterday, he suffered more abuse than Douglas Ross! Playing in a wide position not suited to him, and in a team that is not performing can't be good for his self confidence but repeatedly booing him and slagging him off online can't help either.

I don't know much about his QOS career, other than he bagged goals. I wonder if he might start performing as a striker if we tried him as a six yard box poacher in a 3-5-2 or 4-4-2.

With regards to Steven Hammell, I think he needs to be backed by the board and fans. When we went 0-2 yesterday, I looked at him on the touchline and wondered what was going through his mind. Did he not know how to change things or did he feel he didn't have the bench to change it? My only gripe was the length of time it took to get Tierney actually on the pitch after deciding on the switch.

There were three or four passages of play yesterday when the team actually managed some good football. The individual errors at the back is what cost us the game. I agree with everyone else that the same back four can't start against Ross County next week.

What age is Gregor Stevens now? Is he a free agent?

FFS!

[Swello]

I take it Douglas Ross has been demoted to "far side linesman" - can't remember getting to shout at him at close quarters for a long time and now that's 2 weeks in a row...

[Phillips455]

1 minute ago, Swello said:

I take it Douglas Ross has been demoted to "far side linesman" - can't remember getting to shout at him at close quarters for a long time and now that's 2 weeks in a row...

Aberdeen must being paying him to do that for some reason.

[Kapowzer]

3 hours ago, Casagolda said:

I’m not sure if he’s the answer long term but if we get rid now, you’re basically just repeating the same mistakes of the summer. 

They picked Hammell, now they have to back him. Give him what he needs to do the job. By the time we sack him and fanny about getting in a replacement, we’ll have wasted the window(again). 

And more to the point, to appoint who exactly? An ‘experienced’ manager that’ll make us difficult to beat- so back to the low risk, percentage hoofball everyone complained about all last season. I mean we’re in a relegation battle with Killie and Ross County, they both have experienced managers who had a full summer to plan for this season and they’re every bit as shit as we are(if not worse).

Mind a lot of folk wanted Tommy Wright this time a few years ago anaw? Like he was some sort of get out of relegation free card. That worked out well for Killie. 

Things aren’t great but it’s time for cool heads and not rash decisions. The recruitment drive will be well underway, give Hammell what he wants and let him get on with the job he was deemed the best person to do in the summer but this time, give him the tools to do it properly.

Not sure if I agree Casa, maybe not fair to fully compare a new manager with 2 guys with over 60 years combined experience but when Gannon got punted Jack n Victor came in and took a bunch underperforming on what was to be a 12/13 game winning streak (maybe a draw or two in there - it was over 10 years ago). With the exact same players. Admittedly they downed tools to force a change.

The issue here isn't players trying to get him punted as we've witnessed in the past (Baraclough, McGhee, Alexander) they like us see Hammy like us with rose tinted specs as a nice guy, he doesn't strike me as an emotive guy. If it was downing tools we'd know we could get effort out of them with a change of direction. But its not, well I don't think, just a malaise and "it'll do" attitudes all over the pitch rather than any demanding higher standards. It was his job to snap this squad out of that because it was definitely something that's been a thing for a while.

I do feel bad for suggesting he returns to his previous role normally its the usual suspects on here/SOL governed by youth and lack of patience but when do we stop making excuses for him. The majority of managers inherit a shitshow, otherwise they wouldn't be hired. It's only occasionally and the minority of times someone is poached for over performing and getting success so the new guy gets a winning team (Clarke to Scotland ......).

I was loathe to compose my mammoth overnight message before. I still think in this league, something stupid like back to back wins is daft enough to put you back into contention for Europe, its that mental, it's just such a quality devoid bitty shitshow.

Busta made a point way back last season about Sol, if he had a Scottish name such as Dougie McGregor and wasn't so pretty he'd get much more heat. That was before some of his more recent performances. At least with Shields we accept he's playing out of position. If Hammy wasn't our post war appearance record holder he likewise would be getting much more heat than he's avoiding.

[eliphas]

It's maybe an internet/message board thing with Sol and the impression that's he's cast as this demi-god etc because where I sit at FP the 3 less than good centre halfs we have (Lamie, Sol, Mugabi) all get it equally as tight.

[well fan for life]

3 minutes ago, eliphas said:

It's maybe an internet/message board thing with Sol and the impression that's he's cast as this demi-god etc because where I sit at FP the 3 less than good centre halfs we have (Lamie, Sol, Mugabi) all get it equally as tight.

I think I speak on behalf of The Thread™ when I say we all think he's a handsome big c**t but he's absolute dugmeat at fitba.

[rowsdower]

I second the above on behalf of the thread. Is there something else we can get him to do?

Also, is he our biggest discrepancy between looks and talent? Who would the anti-sol be? Shaun Teale? Stephen Pearson? 

Edited January 9, 2023 by rowsdower

[gavin_3110]

11 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

Also, is he our biggest discrepancy between looks and talent? Who would the anti-sol be? Shaun Teale? Stephen Pearson? 

Willie Pettigrew a strong contender. 

[Kapowzer]

It was more about how the criticism took longer than it should have to land and stick with Sol, which for me is same as Hammy.