Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Archie McSquackle]

15 hours ago, eliphas said:

Efford was on c2k a week from what I heard. Similar to Lamie. Saved about 100k per year between the two of them is the info I got which is no mean feat. 'Managing out' springs to mind. Haha 

Did you hear c2k a week each or 100k per year saving between the two of them?

2k a week means they're each on roughly 100k, 100k between the two of them means they were on 50k each or a grand a week which isn't that much of a surprise. Or is the saving likely to be net pay-off/residual wages to Lamie?

[wellboy1991]

I see Spittal, Kelly and Blaney all doubts for Saturday. With Wilko, Mika, Obika, Butcher and Souare out, our thin squad already looking thinner. 

 

[Allroy for Prez]

4 minutes ago, wellboy1991 said:

I see Spittal, Kelly and Blaney all doubts for Saturday. With Wilko, Mika, Obika, Butcher and Souare out, our thin squad already looking thinner. 

 

Fucking hell! Spittal in particular being out is a genuine disaster! No ready made replacement either. This is where having someone like McKinstry might be a good option? Kelly out is also not ideal.

Is Blaney a perma crock too? With McGinn suspended I’ve no idea what kind of team we’re going to be able to put out. 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

They're probably fine right now, we're just assuming that at least 3 will be hobbled by St Mirren players.

[wellboy1991]

10 minutes ago, Allroy for Prez said:

Fucking hell! Spittal in particular being out is a genuine disaster! No ready made replacement either. This is where having someone like McKinstry might be a good option? Kelly out is also not ideal.

Is Blaney a perma crock too? With McGinn suspended I’ve no idea what kind of team we’re going to be able to put out. 

Aye that’s a tough one. 
 

We could put a decent first 11 out potentially but other than that our bench will look extremely light with only Ferrie as an attacking option. 
 

Midfield three of Slatts, Miller and Paton behind Bair/Shaw.

 

Tuck SODs in the McGinn slot and have Spencer RWB with Gent or McGinley (shudder) in the LWB. 
 

Edit to add - or put Davor into the midfield. 

Edited September 13, 2023 by wellboy1991

[Neil86]

20 minutes ago, Allroy for Prez said:

Fucking hell! Spittal in particular being out is a genuine disaster! No ready made replacement either. This is where having someone like McKinstry might be a good option? Kelly out is also not ideal.

Is Blaney a perma crock too? With McGinn suspended I’ve no idea what kind of team we’re going to be able to put out. 

Not too surprised by Spittal tbh, he landed heavily on his knee I think against hearts and hobbled out the last 25 minutes. Was genuinely surprised Miller went off instead of him at the time.

IF they are all out,

Aston

spencer sods mugabi casey gent

miller zdrawski slattery

paton

bair

[capt_oats]

2 hours ago, Allroy for Prez said:

Is Blaney a perma crock too? With McGinn suspended I’ve no idea what kind of team we’re going to be able to put out. 

Blaney's been available of 8 of our 9 fixtures so far this season and 16 of the 22 games we played while he was at the club last season.

I'm not sure what makes you think he's a "permacrock".

[MP_MFC]

9 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Blaney's been available of 8 of our 9 fixtures so far this season and 16 of the 22 games we played while he was at the club last season.

I'm not sure what makes you think he's a "permacrock".

Probably confusing him with Moult...

[Allroy for Prez]

21 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Blaney's been available of 8 of our 9 fixtures so far this season and 16 of the 22 games we played while he was at the club last season.

I'm not sure what makes you think he's a "permacrock".

Apologies, my perception was he hadn’t played much and now he’s unfortunately injured when it looks like he could now be called on. 

[Allroy for Prez]

13 minutes ago, MP_MFC said:

Probably confusing him with Moult...

The same Moult that’s played in every game for Utd this season? 
 

Did you mean Obika?  

[MP_MFC]

1 hour ago, Allroy for Prez said:

The same Moult that’s played in every game for Utd this season? 
 

Did you mean Obika?  

Must have missed his performance against Falkirk.

Obika is a crock too.

 

[CoF]

9 hours ago, well fan for life said:

We also paid actual money for Efford did we not?

I recall McGhee, around 2008, talking of his frustrations that we couldn’t afford £50k for a player he wanted. Given every single manager since him has said the playing budget is cut each summer I’ve always assumed we simply don’t pay for players so I’m always taken aback (in a good way) when I hear we’ve deemed a new player important enough to pay for them. 

I know we dont often announce if we’ve paid a fee, but anyone got a list of who we know we’ve paid for? Off the top of my head (and I might be wrong on both accounts here) I can only think of Bowman and Tierney? I’m sure there’s more. 

I suppose the next question is, how many of them have been worth that extra expense? 

[Muzz1886]

Didn't we pay a couple of quid for Slattery and Kelly?

[capt_oats]

1 minute ago, Muzz1886 said:

Didn't we pay a couple of quid for Slattery and Kelly?

We spent over £500k on players that season (finished 5th and qualified for Europe tbf).

By my count the players we signed that season who were either under contract or would have required a development fee would have been:

Kelly, Slattery, Ojala, Johansen, Roberts, Tierney, Efford and Mahon.

I mean, ultimately of that intake we sold Woolery, Johansen and Van Veen so you'd think we'd have at least broken even on the £542k.

[eliphas]

9 hours ago, Archie McSquackle said:

Did you hear c2k a week each or 100k per year saving between the two of them?

2k a week means they're each on roughly 100k, 100k between the two of them means they were on 50k each or a grand a week which isn't that much of a surprise. Or is the saving likely to be net pay-off/residual wages to Lamie?

Both on 2k a week.  So that was 200k a season/year out the door for players Kettlewell had no intention of playing (partly the reason they were on the chopping block in the first place was because of the high wages vs others that SK rated)

Saved 100k essentially between them for this season.  Weighted I believe toward Lamie as he wanted to go play football so was happy enough to make a deal happen. Would have been more if Joe had decided to go and not wait it out. But to be honest he's well within his rights obviously so fair enough.

Edited September 13, 2023 by eliphas

[eliphas]

6 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

We spent over £500k on players that season (finished 5th and qualified for Europe tbf).

By my count the players we signed that season who were either under contract or would have required a development fee would have been:

Kelly, Slattery, Ojala, Johansen, Roberts, Tierney, Efford and Mahon.

I mean, ultimately of that intake we sold Woolery, Johansen and Van Veen so you'd think we'd have at least broken even on the £542k.

Aye we definitely shifted strategy a bit fee and wages wise. I'm ultimately fine with that to be honest if it's done carefully like we kinda did...kinda. Seems like we are going the opposite way again though and pleasing poverty etc  Hopefully doesn't bite us quality wise 

[Swello]

Unless they are doing something weird - both "wages" and "transfer fees" are part of the manager's playing budget - so I guess we shouldn't get too hung up on the transfer fee part as wages usually matter more - and the total cost of a player matters most.

Simplistically If we pay 50k for a player and then pay him 100k a year for 3 years the total cost of the player is less than a free transfer on 150k/year. (Joe Efford looks like bad value however you look at it and is probably symptomatic of some ropy decision making that had crept in)

[capt_oats]

1 hour ago, CoF said:

I know we dont often announce if we’ve paid a fee, but anyone got a list of who we know we’ve paid for? Off the top of my head (and I might be wrong on both accounts here) I can only think of Bowman and Tierney? I’m sure there’s more. 

I suppose the next question is, how many of them have been worth that extra expense? 

We've paid fees for a bunch of players, since around the time Hutchison took over. It's weird that it's become a trope on Motherwell Twitter that we haven't.

On top of the players I mentioned on the other page who were contracted when we signed them off the top of my head there's:

• Johnson 
• Moult
• Bowman
• Frear
• Carson
• Donnelly,

Plus Kelly, Slattery, Ojala, Johansen, Roberts, Tierney, Efford and Mahon who fall into the bracket of under contract at other clubs/would have required development fees when we signed them.

There may well be others.

Edited September 13, 2023 by capt_oats

[Archie McSquackle]

Johnson and Moult were successful acquisitions and we more than made our money back on them. We probably saw it as a promising business model but it hasn't really worked out that way since.

[Handsome_Devil]

7 hours ago, Archie McSquackle said:

Johnson and Moult were successful acquisitions and we more than made our money back on them. We probably saw it as a promising business model but it hasn't really worked out that way since.

Those of us of a certain vintage may remember a 1980s GLF interview with Tommy McLean when he said he'd have no trouble spending 500k (an absurd sum for us at the time, the Scottish record would only have been a couple million) on a player because that would guarantee you get quality. The implication being obvious.

Essentially that still applies today. When we pay more, be it wages or fees, our risk goes up substantially but our place on the food chain means it's only marginally more likely we're getting a good player than a guy we like the look of on a free/cheap wages.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Handsome_Devil