Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Jastons6]

18 minutes ago, Handsome_Devil said:

We should use Celtic as a dress rehearsal for Rangers and rest everyone at Tannadice in between.

Rangers were shite yesterday. We can definitely beat them but likewise, we were shite on Saturday 

[tonicg]

The chance from the through ball to Robinson in the first half is still annoying me. It looked perfect for a strong, confident and in form striker to run onto it and hold off the defender to slot it home. Instead, Robinson is neither of those things and allowed the defender to get his toe in and knock it for a corner. It looked as if he was waiting for the ball to reach his right side which allowed the defender to make the tackle. He must be due a start from the bench soon. I know Bair was slow to get going last year but was it this slow?

Edited yesterday at 13:14 by tonicg

[joewarkfanclub]

1 hour ago, Handsome_Devil said:

The main problem is the midfield, drastic changes when we can't actually change much there due to the squad situation would be mental.

We should use Celtic as a dress rehearsal for Rangers and rest everyone at Tannadice in between.

I think the away game at Tannadice IS a chance to try out some of our squad players and maybe a slight tweak to the system.

I agree wholesale changes so close to the semi final might not be smart, but we could certainly be giving Kaleta and Koutroumbis a run out so they are ready if called upon.

Wont be a huge Motherwell support there given its sandwiched between a home game and the semi final. More leeway if it goes wrong, so less risk overall.

Unfortunately, SK isnt likely to do that, so we will just need to suck it up and hope he can get the performance levels back to where they need to be to get success out of this system.

 

[Dosser1886]

46 minutes ago, tonicg said:

The chance from the through ball to Robinson in the first half is still annoying me.

The attempted through ball that got blocked and led to their goal annoyed me more.

[well again]

1 hour ago, tonicg said:

The chance from the through ball to Robinson in the first half is still annoying me. It looked perfect for a strong, confident and in form striker to run onto it and hold off the defender to slot it home. Instead, Robinson is neither of those things and allowed the defender to get his toe in and knock it for a corner. It looked as if he was waiting for the ball to reach his right side which allowed the defender to make the tackle. He must be due a start from the bench soon. I know Bair was slow to get going last year but was it this slow?

Robinson is not in the same league as Theo Bair in my opinion.

[JohnMFC]

I feel like were at that stage again where we don't really know who our best striker is. Its the same vibe as roughly the same time last year when Bireth was injured and Bair hadn't kicked on yet. I feel like we're an in form striker away from being a really decent team, but I'm not too sure who its going to be that steps up. If any of them are capable of stepping up at all.  

I thought Saturday was an eye bleeder but it really could've gone either way. Someone behind me said that Higdon would've had a hat trick in the first half and I don't think that's a massive exaggeration either. In Robinson we've got a really hard worker but not a great player. There were times when he received the ball in the final third and looked like he was playing with roller skates on. In games like that, and there will be a lot of them in a season given how close most teams are in term of quality, we need someone in the final third who gets shots at goal. 

Bit of a rant tbh but that's how I'm feeling after having digested the weekends game. 

TLDR - We need one of our many strikers to not be shite. 

[Handsome_Devil]

2 hours ago, joewarkfanclub said:

I think the away game at Tannadice IS a chance to try out some of our squad players and maybe a slight tweak to the system.

...

Unfortunately, SK isnt likely to do that, so we will just need to suck it up and hope he can get the performance levels back to where they need to be to get success out of this system.

I'd be amazed if he doesn't rotate (heavily) at Tannadice. Rangers have a huge high-pressure game on the Wednesday that they will have to go 100% in while we, realistically/balancing risk-reward etc can be more flexible. It's unlikely to make a difference but we'll have chased Celtic all Sunday and will more of the same over a large Hampden pitch for possibly 120 minutes...if there's even the chance of gaining back a couple of percent on Rangers by being fresher, we should take it.

[Neil86]

5 hours ago, Allroy for Prez said:

Not point I waiting until after the semi, the changes where possible should be made next game. 

Kaleta, Seddon, Jonny K all deserve a chance, Watt in for Robinson.

Why we signed the boy from Hibs I don’t know….

In Kettlewells defence, I think benching Sods and Wilson 2 weeks from a semi final after one bad TEAM performance, probably does him next to no favours in the long run. 

Unless of course, he rests them at Tannadice and either one of Johnny K, Kaleta or Seddon have an absolute stormer obviously.

 

[Vietnam91]

Without the midweek game I doubt we could have had a better dress rehearsal than Celtic, just on a tighter pitch. Add in an away game in Dundee on the following Wednesday then it does offer some decisions for Ketts.

With how weak our midfield was on Saturday I would expect us to opt for something similar to when we last played Sevco and 5-4-1 it. That would lend itself to Seddon starting, Lennon sitting deeper and Wilson more advanced just like in August. If it's not Seddon, do you opt for Tony for 60 minutes of disruption and physicality or maybe go with Kaleta on the opposite side who is speedy but also defensively minded. Tavares and Malwanhise offer very little with that setup other than late subs.

As the semi final is two games of football and two weeks of training away, I'm not convinced we'll have the squad we have today to select from. Nothing from the club about Ap Stam so far, so I'd favour him starting up front on his own with Robinson or Ebiye as fresh legs.

Don't envy Ketts having to juggle the experimenting and rest conundrum. Do it in a game you're not expected to win is low risk, but the exposure and lessons learned could be useful only a week later. Or at Tannadice while closer to Sunday's game it is against a contemporary in terms of performances and points haul.

While a six pointer vs Dundee United, I'm all for letting that one slip however it could very well be a third loss on the bounce going into the biggest game of our season so far, morale has to be a factor too.

I'm a big proponent that we should be 100% committed to cup runs as for only 90-120 of football (180 in Europe) offer the potential of a significant financial return.

Edited 21 hours ago by Vietnam91

[rowsdower]

Will we all accept the loss if we put out a weakened team against Utd, a close rival? That could potentially put us at 4 losses on the trot if the semi doesn't go our way, then we will be hoping St. J's new manager bounce is short.

Cycling out Robinson would make sense to me, but I'd do that anyway.

If we're managing minutes, should it be Miller that misses a game?

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

I hate to be pessimistic but thinking of how little chance we have of winning the club, I wouldn't want us to write off Dundee Utd, saving ourselves for the Sunday. As @rowsdowersays, it could result in four defeats in the bounce (that might happen anyway, TBF) and thinking of the winless run last season being triggered by Celtic and Rangers being two of three  spirited defeats, I'd like to do all we could to avoid that.

That said, there are probably a few players to be rotated in who are unlucky not to have had more game time, or who are pushing the starters closely at the moment anyway.

If three games in seven days, culminating in a semi-final is considered too much for certain players, could we think to rotate them against Celtic instead?

Edited 17 hours ago by crazylegsjoe_mfc

[Allroy for Prez]

16 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

Will we all accept the loss if we put out a weakened team against Utd, a close rival? That could potentially put us at 4 losses on the trot if the semi doesn't go our way, then we will be hoping St. J's new manager bounce is short.

Cycling out Robinson would make sense to me, but I'd do that anyway.

If we're managing minutes, should it be Miller that misses a game?

There’s no way we can write the Utd game off on the very slim chance we have of winning the semi. Even if we play our strongest team, and I’m not even sure Kettlewell knows that at the moment, the odds are so stacked against us we have to temper expectations there. 

What I’m certainly advocating is the team in certain areas, where possible, could do with a few folk being rotated. Some to try something else, others cos they’ve not been contributing.

There is obviously zero scope to do this in midfield, unless Sparrow isn’t injured. 

Edited 17 hours ago by Allroy for Prez

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

At our best last season, we had Miller excelling as a deep lying midfielder and Spittal doing so as an attacking midfielder. In moving Miller forward (as good as he has been) we have effectively weakened both parts of the midfield. I would still like us to move Miller back one and try to play forwards where he has been playing.

[camer0n_mcd]

The semi-final should take priority over the Utd game, Rangers have a very difficult game on the Wednesday prior away to Aberdeen and we should be doing anything to gain any advantage we can (even if it's a small) but the league cup is one of 2 realistic chances we have to win a trophy, the Utd game would usually be an important game but we can play the kids at Tannadice for all I care.

Edited 15 hours ago by camer0n_mcd

[wellboy1991]

44 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

At our best last season, we had Miller excelling as a deep lying midfielder and Spittal doing so as an attacking midfielder. In moving Miller forward (as good as he has been) we have effectively weakened both parts of the midfield. I would still like us to move Miller back one and try to play forwards where he has been playing.

It feels like such an easy fix for me. We are struggling with a two to Davor and Halliday. They just don’t and aren’t working together. We need Miller in the deeper role and controlling the game with a bit more pace from midfield. 

[Allroy for Prez]

9 hours ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

At our best last season, we had Miller excelling as a deep lying midfielder and Spittal doing so as an attacking midfielder. In moving Miller forward (as good as he has been) we have effectively weakened both parts of the midfield. I would still like us to move Miller back one and try to play forwards where he has been playing.

Agreed. I don’t know why we’re not doing that. 

[Handsome_Devil]

10 hours ago, Allroy for Prez said:

What I’m certainly advocating is the team in certain areas, where possible, could do with a few folk being rotated. Some to try something else, others cos they’ve not been contributing.

Definitely. Presuming they play against Celtic, the three for me who definitely don't play at united are the starting wing-backs v Rangers (at least on the assumption it'd be Wilson and SOD) and Miller. Sparrow being a question mark obviously makes that trickier.

The back three should be ok and I probably wouldn't change that now we need to adjust to McGinn being out. If he'd been fit I'd have rested him.

Beyond that, ideally we shouldn't be asking Halliday or Ap Stam to play that many minutes over a week either but re the former, we basically run out of options to rotate.

Losing three in a row into the semi isn't great and of course losing four into St Johnstone would very much echo last season...but we get to semi-finals so rarely we should be throwing everything at it imho, there's plenty of time to atone for three points given away at tannadice later.

[Feet in the Wishing Well]

Big week next week. 

We've had a good start to the season but as folk have said some 50/50 games have gone our way during that time.

I always liked the Stephen Robinson quote where he said "when we win 3 games in a row we're not world beaters and when we lose 3 in a row we're not a terrible side" and I think that applies now.

I think we'll go back to the 1 up that we were playing earlier in the season for all the games. Can see Robinson, Stama (if fit), Ebiye and Watt all getting 45 each across the first two games (obviously Watt only against Celtic) and whoever has looked the most likely getting the start on the semi.

Realistically it's two games we're massive underdogs in and one 50/50, if we take anything across the week we've done well. 

[Al B]

1 hour ago, Allroy for Prez said:

Agreed. I don’t know why we’re not doing that. 

imho, I think this season's whole remit is to not get relegated and sell Lennon Miller for as much money as we can possibly get.

Playing Miller deeper makes the team much better, but great players back there don't attract the same offers as great players playing where he is now.

I suspect, as obvious as his outrageous talent is, the things he does brilliantly back there don't really show up on a spreadsheet and as we all know, scouting (especially at the market level we're pitching to), isn't really done with eyes anymore.

[joewarkfanclub]

Just now, Al B said:

imho, I think this season's whole remit is to not get relegated and sell Lennon Miller for as much money as we can possibly get.

Playing Miller deeper makes the team much better, but great players back there don't attract the same offers as great players playing where he is now.

I suspect, as obvious as his outrageous talent is, the things he does brilliantly back there don't really show up on a spreadsheet and as we all know, scouting (especially at the market level we're pitching to), isn't really done with eyes anymore.

I think you are probably right.

But thats a mental reason to set up a football team in a way that weakens your team.