Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Luke92]

Rossiter is a total non-starter. Robinson has already said that if he is to bring anyone in it will be a striker or a left back. This is likely just Rangers fed speculation to stoke up SPFL interest to take him on loan. I've been unimpressed by him any time I have seen him and his injury record is appalling. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if a Championship team like Dundee Utd or someone take him.

The news regarding Turnbull is unexpected and a massive boast. I genuinely think we could have a top player on our hands. Wednesday was the first time I have seen Jake Hastie for a prolonger period too and I was really impressed, his ability to beat a man is great to watch. How refreshing is it to have young boys from the Motherwell area playing for the jersey? Honestly give me that over Vanarama non-entities any day of the week.

Wednesday reinforced to me the point that  in terms of techincal ability our Academy is producing some very good players. In terms of technique I think they are often better than the standard of player we have been rectruiting in the last year or so. There are some hidden gems for sure but I think the majority of the time the boys from L1, L2, Conference usually have better physical attributes more than anything else. My point is I think we should be trying to introduce the young guys earlier than we have been and supplementing these players with the natural attributes some of the boys elsewhere have. There is obviously some exceptions to this rule but generally speaking I think our youth are more techincally gifted than the level of player we are able to bring in.

Robinson can obviously point to the success of the young boys, Campbell and Turnbull but I genuinely think the likes of Turnbull would have made an impact last season. There has obviously been rumours about his relationship with Robinson, not sure how true these are to be fair. Interesting to hear Carson on the Si Ferry Podcast saying that him and some others had actually stressed to the manager last season that Turnbull should be in the team. I know there is a fine line managing young players but I would just like us to push these guys into the team a wee bit sooner.

[well fan for life]

6 minutes ago, Luke92 said:

Rossiter is a total non-starter. Robinson has already said that if he is to bring anyone in it will be a striker or a left back. This is likely just Rangers fed speculation to stoke up SPFL interest to take him on loan. I've been unimpressed by him any time I have seen him and his injury record is appalling. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if a Championship team like Dundee Utd or someone take him.

The news regarding Turnbull is unexpected and a massive boast. I genuinely think we could have a top player on our hands. Wednesday was the first time I have seen Jake Hastie for a prolonger period too and I was really impressed, his ability to beat a man is great to watch. How refreshing is it to have young boys from the Motherwell area playing for the jersey? Honestly give me that over Vanarama non-entities any day of the week.

Wednesday reinforced to me the point that  in terms of techincal ability our Academy is producing some very good players. In terms of technique I think they are often better than the standard of player we have been rectruiting in the last year or so. There are some hidden gems for sure but I think the majority of the time the boys from L1, L2, Conference usually have better physical attributes more than anything else. My point is I think we should be trying to introduce the young guys earlier than we have been and supplementing these players with the natural attributes some of the boys elsewhere have. There is obviously some exceptions to this rule but generally speaking I think our youth are more techincally gifted than the level of player we are able to bring in.

Robinson can obviously point to the success of the young boys, Campbell and Turnbull but I genuinely think the likes of Turnbull would have made an impact last season. There has obviously been rumours about his relationship with Robinson, not sure how true these are to be fair. Interesting to hear Carson on the Si Ferry Podcast saying that him and some others had actually stressed to the manager last season that Turnbull should be in the team. I know there is a fine line managing young players but I would just like us to push these guys into the team a wee bit sooner.

I agree with a lot of this tbh. I think there's room for some of the English lower league folk to come in as grafters but when you compare the actual footballing ability of Johnson & Main with Turnbull & Hastie it's night and day.

Hopefully Maguire gets a good 6 months of getting battered about the Championship and comes back ready to move in to our first team.

[Gianfranco]

Announce Turnbull.

 

What’s happening with Mckinstry or whatever his name is? The one that Leeds and Southampton were apparently after.

[one m in Motherwell]

Some sensaysh #content right here...
 

I’ve not watched this with the sound up but please tell me it’s backed by the theme from Thomas the Tank Engine.

[gannonball]

Apologies if this already been mentioned but  I listened to Maurice Ross on the Si Ferry Podcast. Surprisingly came across as a smart enough guy with little self importance compared to your typical thick ex footballer with a bit of a chip on their shoulder when they have had to retire earlier than expected. Has some decent coaching experience already too. Its worth a listen anyway.

Edited January 25, 2019 by gannonball

[Desp]

1 hour ago, gannonball said:

Apologies if this already been mentioned but  I listened to Maurice Ross on the Si Ferry Podcast. Surprisingly came across as a smart enough guy with little self importance compared to your typical thick ex footballer with a bit of a chip on their shoulder when they have had to retire earlier than expected. Has some decent coaching experience already too. Its worth a listen anyway.

It's funny, I watched the same interview today. I thought he came across as an egotistical, arrogant w****r with the personality of a fucking lamppost. 

Wasn't for me. 

[gannonball]

Just now, Desp said:

It's funny, I watched the same interview today. I thought he came across as an egotistical, arrogant w****r with the personality of a fucking lamppost. 

Wasn't for me. 

I thought he was awfully serious compared to si ferrys other ones which might have portrayed some arrogance about the guy. Spent a lot of the time saying how much players were better than him though, almost in awe at times.

[Al B]

I thought it was one of the more boring of Si's interviews to be fair. The thing I like about them is because the majority of the interviewees are his genuine mates, they are much more relaxed and I have to admit there's a load of them have changed pre-conceived opinions I've had about people.

From the point of view of him coming on board with us though, I think he's a natural successor to Craigan as they both are big on the idea of instilling professionalism and discipline from a young age as a foundation to build talent on. I think he'll be a great appointment.

[well fan for life]

I can’t listen to Si Ferry anymore. Absolute brain damage. Gets to a vaguely serious point then “SO THEN YOU SIGNED FOR SUNDERLAND THAT MUST HAVE BEEN SOME PATTER EH HAHAHAHAH”

 

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

Jordan Rossiter should be a non starter. We have enough in the centre of the park. Gorrin, Campbell, Turnbull, McHugh, Grimshaw, Bigirimana. Cadden when he is fit too. If we need to go past that depth then I have no problem with Liam Brown coming into the first team.  That is 8 guys that can play in a midfield 3.

What would be the point in getting Jordan Rossiter on loan? In the Express Burns says it would be contigent on someone leaving. Realistically I could see Bigi leaving in a Bowman type exit. But still I would rather we give our on guys a chance than some Rangers dud.

[Archie McSquackle]

I listened to the Maurice Ross interview a few days ago and really couldn't make my mind up about him. At some points I thought he came across well and other bits he just seemed to be an arrogant arse.
Could well be a good coach for us though.
I've been listening to some of the older Open Goal podcasts and enjoyed the Moyes and Archie Knox ones. I was bit disappointed the Knox interview skipped his time at Motherwell and subsequent departure to Aberdeen, deciding to focus on his time at Manchester United, Rangers and his first stint at Aberdeen instead for some reason.

[AndyRoss]

I expected a bit more movement both in and out during the window, but at this moment in time I think we can be pretty happy with how it's went.

McCormack looks like he's got a bit of a way to go in terms of fitness and he's still striving to achieve over 10 touches across his two appearances, but hopefully that'll come with more game time, it was suggested he was injured before he arrived and that it would be the end of the month before he'd be ready.

Ariyibi has been promising, he's clearly blessed with great pace and offers something we've been badly lacking so far this season. Maybe take him off set-pieces as he seems to barely be able to get the ball off the ground, but early signs are very good.

Then in the potential of Turnbull signing and Hastie's brilliant performance on Wednesday - we're looking decent in terms of personnel. 

Those that have left, I think there was pretty much universal agreement that the guys had done us a turn, but wasn't great disappointment or worry following their departures. 

Suspect there will probably be a bit more business done in terms of incomings and outgoings in the next five days, but so far, so good.

[AndyRoss]

4 minutes ago, Archie McSquackle said:

I listened to the Maurice Ross interview a few days ago and really couldn't make my mind up about him. At some points I thought he came across well and other bits he just seemed to be an arrogant arse.
Could well be a good coach for us though.
I've been listening to some of the older Open Goal podcasts and enjoyed the Moyes and Archie Knox ones. I was bit disappointed the Knox interview skipped his time at Motherwell and subsequent departure to Aberdeen, deciding to focus on his time at Manchester United, Rangers and his first stint at Aberdeen instead for some reason.

That's where Ferry's stuff confuses me. 

After Celtic he's played with a number of smaller clubs, but his go to question with guys who made their breakthrough anywhere except for Celtic and Rangers is - 'so did you start to think I'm too good to play here?' It's almost as if he disregards smaller teams, but then every so often you'll get an episode like the one with Louis Moult or last week Trevor Carson guesting - it's quite hard to fathom.

 

[Busta Nut]

10 hours ago, well fan for life said:

I can’t listen to Si Ferry anymore. Absolute brain damage. Gets to a vaguely serious point then “SO THEN YOU SIGNED FOR SUNDERLAND THAT MUST HAVE BEEN SOME PATTER EH HAHAHAHAH”

 

I am with this guy

[capt_oats]

No Sammon in the squad today lads.

[Archie McSquackle]

So with St. Mirren playing Hibs today (and currently winning), are we now at the stage of wanting Hibs and Livingston to lose with a view to us potentially climbing the table or are we still wanting teams below us to lose to keep the gap?

[Casagolda]

On 26/01/2019 at 14:11, capt_oats said:

No Sammon in the squad today lads.

Seems like the most obvious candidate to leave at present. He falls into the same category as Bowman and Rose in terms of being both expendable but we could probably find someone else to take him. 

Actually looking at our bench yesterday, it’s the strongest it’s been in sometime.

Quote

Ferguson, Hartley, McHugh, Bigirimana, Frear, Johnson & McCormack 

So much so that our captain, top scorer and big January signing were all unused subs. That’s also us without guys like Carson, Cadden, Tanner as well as Sammon, ATS and Donnelly.

Looking at it, it’s hard to see too many others that you feel Robinson would see as expendable but we could also find other teams actually willing to take them. Maybe why we’ve done very little business since the opening week in the window?

You also have to wonder if our current league form/position is making Robinson and co reconsider their plans somewhat. Should be an interesting last few days of the window regardless, however I don’t expect us to be as busy as I did this time last week. 

Edited January 27, 2019 by Casagolda

[capt_oats]

1 hour ago, Casagolda said:

Seems like the most obvious candidate to leave at present. He falls into the same category as Bowman and Rose in terms of being both expendable but we could probably find someone else to take him. 

Actually looking at our bench yesterday, it’s the strongest it’s been in sometime.

So much so that our captain, top scorer and big January signing were all unused subs. That’s also us without guys like Carson, Cadden, Tanner as well as Sammon, ATS and Donnelly.

Looking at it, it’s hard to see too many others that you feel Robinson would see as expendable but we could also find other teams actually willing to take them. Maybe why we’ve done very little business since the opening week in the window?

You also have to wonder if our current league form/position is making Robinson and co reconsider their plans somewhat. Should be an interesting last few days of the window regardless, however I don’t expect us to be as busy as I did this time last week. 

I thought it was interesting that Robinson mentioned giving some of the other Young Team a run out this season when he was talking in his post-match yesterday.

Quote

"I believe as the season progresses we'll see some more young ones come in and that freshness and energy they've provided."

You'd think that the way things are looking in terms of league position it would mean that it'd give us more breathing space to introduce guys like Scott and maybe Livingstone. Given Grimshaw seems to have found his calling as a right back I wonder if recent performances have meant we've reappraised things and may just stick with Tait at LB and Grimmy at RB?

With Ally Gorrin hitting a bit of form it made me wonder whether there's a re-evaluation due of Robinson's summer window as Gillespie's been a fine stand in for Carson, Johnson's our top scorer and Ally is showing why we were keen to bring him in. Also given the depth on the bench at the moment there was probably a bit of method in his much maligned '12-18' chat.

The ones that haven't really worked out are ATS, Donnelly and of course Sammon. Even then you can see why we took a punt on ATS given he's a left back and Donnelly fits the profile of the sort of player we'd target. He came through at Fulham, experienced at N.I u21s etc. Sammon's clearly been Sammon though.

No doubt it's taken a bit longer than everyone would have liked but possibly it wasn't the disaster it was looking though.

Also, there's the change in shape. Arguably changing up the system means there's been a shift in terms of what we actually need. I saw some mewling on Twitter dot com when the teams were announced about Main getting picked ahead of Johnson because "Johnson scores goals" completely oblivious to the fact that Johnson clearly isn't suited to playing as a lone striker whereas Main at least offers a certain robustness. Without that physicality the shape doesn't work because the ball doesn't stick.

Despite being our top scorer at the moment the 433/451 seems to leave Johnson a bit redundant at the moment. Even if we were looking to change it up a bit the fact that (if he ever gets fit) McCormack's on the bench then that's presumably the alternative we'd look to use (short term at least).

Just looking at the squad even if we were to find someone that would take Sammon on it still leaves us with Main, McCormack, Johnson and Scott as our forwards but only one legit centre forward spot so adding on top of that seems a bit excessive? The flip of that is that you could see us benefitting massively from someone who's a better fit as a #9 in a 433. The thing is, it's not exclusively goals we need but also someone who's physical enough to play that role and hold the ball up. I take it Killie are the only other team Erwin could play for this season after his brief stint in Iran?

Looking at the numbers we've got then including the injured players plus the young team we're at about 28 in total around the first team. It feels like it could do with a bit of trimming anyway.

As it stands the following players are out of contract in the summer (not including the u20s) and a decent number of them have seen some game time in the past couple of weeks:

• Aaron Taylor-Sinclair
• Christian Mbulu
• Carl McHugh
• Chris Cadden (injured)
• Elliot Frear
• Liam Grimshaw
• Gael Bigirimana
• Alex Rodriguez Gorrin
• Craig Tanner (injured)
• Curtis Main
• George Newell

There are presumably a few high wages in there like...

Edited January 27, 2019 by capt_oats

[Swello]

4 hours ago, Casagolda said:

Maybe why we’ve done very little business since the opening week in the window?

I also wonder how much Hastie effectively being like a new signing has changed the plans? It's very early days for him but given we were looking for (a) a winger and (b) some pace and directness - Hastie could have solved a problem without us bringing anyone in (and at the very least is clearly worth persisting with). Given that we have relatively little to play for - I would expect/hope that all our younger boys get as much game time as they need in preparation for next season.

I think the disaster against County has probably made Robinson's mind up (and mine!) that having Tait out of position at LB and Grimmy at RB is the lesser of two evils, so I assume that we won't be getting a LB in. 

The only area that urgently needs repaired is a centre forward - like most, I have no criticism to make of Main's effort levels but we simply can't rely on midfielders and defenders to be scoring our goals until the end of the season - so something has to give there....

 

[Gianfranco]

I’d agree that up front is the priority.

Given the table, we can get by with Tait, ATS or Livingstone if no one better on a permanent deal becomes available. Livingstone should get some starts as well so Robinson can properly judge him.