St Mirren v Greenock Morton 31/12/16

[Silvio]

Since the merger of all the leagues last year, are there still bullshit stadium restrictions for the top league? 

If so, would Cappielow have any problems?

[Dr Watson]

8 hours ago, Tonsilitis said:

Take it from me, there is plenty of ambition at board level.  That has to be tempered by realism and a lot of work has gone on and continues in making the club work better in every aspect, especially in the last six months since major personnel changes behind the scenes.  If clubs like Hamilton, Ross County and similar can sustain an SPL place, there is no reason why Morton cannot.

If we get a play off place, I assure you everyone at the club will be giving it our best shot for promotion but history tells you that's a long shot.  The way the play off work heavily weights against the third and fourth place clubs and since they started, nobody has managed to go up from that position.  These teams have so many matches to play  to get to the play off final that they generally run out of steam against the SPL side coming fresh to the final.  Second place gives you more of a chance.  As I say, because the odds are stacked against you, and you recognise that, does not mean you do not give it your best shot.

As for St Mirren, the Morton fan in me is very happy to see them struggle and I fully understand that.  The finance director sees two home games with St Mirren replaced by two home games against Livingston.  That's a financial difference of around £70-80k - put another way, two decent players.  Likewise, any other other clubs near the bottom of the championship are likely to bring more visiting fans to Cappielow than any of the likely League 1 play off contenders apart maybe from Airdrie.

It's a myth that the Premiership team comes into the play-off final fresh. Once the Championship ends, the 3rd and 4th teams play four games to reach the final while the Premiership team still have three more league games to play.

If anything, the play-offs are heavily weighted toward the Championship runners-up.  

[TheGoon]

35 minutes ago, Silvio said:

Since the merger of all the leagues last year, are there still bullshit stadium restrictions for the top league? 

If so, would Cappielow have any problems?

No and no.

[Rajamaki's Ponytail]

They need maybe 27 points from their remaining 17 games.  Those include 2 games each v The top two. Assume 2 points from that.  They have one match left v third place Morton at Cappielow.  Assume 1 point there.  That leaves them looking for 24 points from the other 12 matches - average 2 points a game. Can't see it happening which is a shame as those derby games are worth a lot of money to us.

Laughing at the scum getting relegated will be priceless.

[ashton]

10 hours ago, Tonsilitis said:

Take it from me, there is plenty of ambition at board level.  That has to be tempered by realism and a lot of work has gone on and continues in making the club work better in every aspect, especially in the last six months since major personnel changes behind the scenes.  If clubs like Hamilton, Ross County and similar can sustain an SPL place, there is no reason why Morton cannot.

If we get a play off place, I assure you everyone at the club will be giving it our best shot for promotion but history tells you that's a long shot.  The way the play off work heavily weights against the third and fourth place clubs and since they started, nobody has managed to go up from that position.  These teams have so many matches to play  to get to the play off final that they generally run out of steam against the SPL side coming fresh to the final.  Second place gives you more of a chance.  As I say, because the odds are stacked against you, and you recognise that, does not mean you do not give it your best shot.

As for St Mirren, the Morton fan in me is very happy to see them struggle and I fully understand that.  The finance director sees two home games with St Mirren replaced by two home games against Livingston.  That's a financial difference of around £70-80k - put another way, two decent players.  Likewise, any other other clubs near the bottom of the championship are likely to bring more visiting fans to Cappielow than any of the likely League 1 play off contenders apart maybe from Airdrie.

.

[vikingTON]

So if they were most likely of the four to play in the top flight next year (irrespective of why) then that would make them favourite.

Not to "beat whoever they play in the final" they wouldn't, which is what you claimed. If the SPL team has a 40% chance of winning the final, they'd still have a higher chance of playing top flight football in 2017-18 than any other team in the play-offs, because the other entrants can be eliminated in earlier rounds.

That's just basic probability champ.

[tonnitus]

The endless noise of absolute scenes.

ETA: Tontastic has a crowdfunding campaign going on at the moment, and Morton's video/photo coverage needs all the help it can get: http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/tontastic

[standman]

2 hours ago, Silvio said:

Since the merger of all the leagues last year, are there still bullshit stadium restrictions for the top league? 

If so, would Cappielow have any problems?

Not any more. Neil Doncaster confirmed in a meeting with Morton fans that Cappielow has the necessary licence to play in the top flight

[Scosha]

9 minutes ago, tonnitus said:

The endless noise of absolute scenes.

How the f*ck did we not get a penalty in first half? 

[Bobby_F]

25 minutes ago, standman said:

Not any more. Neil Doncaster confirmed in a meeting with Morton fans that Cappielow has the necessary licence to play in the top flight

Really?

Are benches and no cover for away fans top league standard?

Even at Dumbarton you get a proper seat and a roof.

Not getting at Morton, just didn't think the Premier League standards were, well, so low.

I know Morton were not really in a position to worry about it, but Saints, Dundee, Livingston, Airdrie all got in to serious financial difficulties to meet 'SPL' standards.

[Jamie_M]

15 minutes ago, Bobby_F said:

but Saints, Dundee, Livingston, Airdrie all got in to serious financial difficulties to meet 'SPL' standards.

Evidence that the rules of the 'SPL' were a joke and the current legislation is altogether better.

[GAD]

Morton won't get promoted because they have an extremely diddy club mentality, from the board to the fans. Teams like Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hibs, Dundee United, etc don't, and don't have the same hang ups Morton do. Even Hamilton, as a smaller club, don't have the extreme inferiority complex Morton do.

[TheGoon]

16 minutes ago, GAD said:

Morton won't get promoted because they have an extremely diddy club mentality, from the board to the fans. Teams like Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hibs, Dundee United, etc don't, and don't have the same hang ups Morton do. Even Hamilton, as a smaller club, don't have the extreme inferiority complex Morton do.

 

[AsimButtHitsASix]

On 31/12/2016 at 19:19, Colkitto said:

Don't know what McDonagh was thinking with that sending off.

Rocco Quinn bit him

[GiGi]

9 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said:

Rocco Quinn bit him

There are probably pictures of the tooth marks on his boots.

[Coventry Saint]

9 hours ago, GAD said:

Morton won't get promoted because they have an extremely diddy club mentality, from the board to the fans. Teams like Falkirk, Kilmarnock, Hibs, Dundee United, etc don't, and don't have the same hang ups Morton do. Even Hamilton, as a smaller club, don't have the extreme inferiority complex Morton do.

The problem is, we've also had a diddy mentality since the summer of 2014 (arguably 2013) and the impact has been massive and devastating.

Stewart Gilmour could have read the 'huge pile' of CVs he claimed to have on his desk, and conducted a proper interview process, but instead he handed the job to Tommy Craig. It was the first fall in a diddy domino rally.

In three years (since the incredible summer transfer window of 2011) our BoD completely chucked it. Obviously, it'd take a 30-year spell outside the top flight for our diddy mentality to rival Morton's, but we've undeniably had one for the past few years and it's killing us at the moment.

[geo87]

The problem is, we've also had a diddy mentality since the summer of 2014 (arguably 2013) and the impact has been massive and devastating.

Stewart Gilmour could have read the 'huge pile' of CVs he claimed to have on his desk, and conducted a proper interview process, but instead he handed the job to Tommy Craig. It was the first fall in a diddy domino rally.

In three years (since the incredible summer transfer window of 2011) our BoD completely chucked it. Obviously, it'd take a 30-year spell outside the top flight for our diddy mentality to rival Morton's, but we've undeniably had one for the past few years and it's killing us at the moment.

Agree with everything above.

However, as ridiculous as this sounds, I can't still help but feel some optimism despite our current predicament as I feel we now have the right man leading us off the park (Gordon Scott) and on the park (Jack Ross). Even if we get relegated this year I am still confident we will be in a better place both on and off the park compared to where we are now in a few years time once we've had some time to right the wrongs from the past 3-5 years of mis-management.

[Tonsilitis]

34 minutes ago, geo87 said:

Agree with everything above.

However, as ridiculous as this sounds, I can't still help but feel some optimism despite our current predicament as I feel we now have the right man leading us off the park (Gordon Scott) and on the park (Jack Ross). Even if we get relegated this year I am still confident we will be in a better place both on and off the park compared to where we are now in a few years time once we've had some time to right the wrongs from the past 3-5 years of mis-management.

FWIW, Gordon Scott is a very sound guy and comes across as very competent.   Guys in football also have a lot of time for Jack Ross.

Being in a better place though, is not League 1.  If St Mirren do go down there will be hard choices to be made.  The league distribution cash is less than 1/4 of the equivalent place in the championship.  There will almost certainly be no biggish clubs to bring any kind of away support.  Any club staying fulltime in that league will make losses (unless they can manage a decent cup run). In St Mirren's ownership model, can they handle six figure losses?  You are left balancing pushing the boat out in the hope of securing an instant return to the Championship which can go wrong (ask Dunfermline) or reduce the playing budget and risk a lengthy stay in the lower leagues.

Its not easy!

[TurbineTon]

FWIW, Gordon Scott is a very sound guy and comes across as very competent.   Guys in football also have a lot of time for Jack Ross.
Being in a better place though, is not League 1.  If St Mirren do go down there will be hard choices to be made.  The league distribution cash is less than 1/4 of the equivalent place in the championship.  There will almost certainly be no biggish clubs to bring any kind of away support.  Any club staying fulltime in that league will make losses (unless they can manage a decent cup run). In St Mirren's ownership model, can they handle six figure losses?  You are left balancing pushing the boat out in the hope of securing an instant return to the Championship which can go wrong (ask Dunfermline) or reduce the playing budget and risk a lengthy stay in the lower leagues.
Its not easy!

Point and laugh at them for going down the silly fan ownership route.

[Coventry Saint]

3 minutes ago, Tonsilitis said:

FWIW, Gordon Scott is a very sound guy and comes across as very competent.   Guys in football also have a lot of time for Jack Ross.

Being in a better place though, is not League 1.  If St Mirren do go down there will be hard choices to be made.  The league distribution cash is less than 1/4 of the equivalent place in the championship.  There will almost certainly be no biggish clubs to bring any kind of away support.  Any club staying fulltime in that league will make losses (unless they can manage a decent cup run). In St Mirren's ownership model, can they handle six figure losses?  You are left balancing pushing the boat out in the hope of securing an instant return to the Championship which can go wrong (ask Dunfermline) or reduce the playing budget and risk a lengthy stay in the lower leagues.

Its not easy!

Decent post. I concur that GS and JR are the right people; I just hope they're not two years too late.

I think it's difficult to see how we could avoid going p/t if we did go down. You'd also have to look at stuff like the academy - which while it's not exactly spewing forth million-pound players twice a year, it is at least fuelling our first team - and wonder how that could possibly continue in the third tier.

I'd been saying for a while that we needed at least three wins on the table by Christmas. We've not managed that and we are now pretty much fucked, as far as I can see. We need to smash this transfer window (hey: we're being linked with a Morton reject and an Aberdeen youngster, so it's all good) and start getting some wins PFQ.