The European football level St. Mirren FC 2024/25 thread

[btb]

If we were still "budgeting for eleventh" then Henderson would be well suited for us, but we're not and he's 21 now so it's pretty much make  or break time for him - I wouldn't push the boat out but on balance I'd him a two year deal. 

Edited April 29, 2023 by btb

[SS77]

I’d be more worried if Henderson didn’t look good today against a shockingly bad Falkirk team.

He’s a good Championship player but if we’re striving to be a top 6 side then we need to be looking for better.

[RandomGuy.]

4 minutes ago, SS77 said:

I’d be more worried if Henderson didn’t look good today against a shockingly bad Falkirk team.

He’s a good Championship player but if we’re striving to be a top 6 side then we need to be looking for better.

Partick fans said similar about Kevin Nisbet once upon a time.

[houston_bud]

2 minutes ago, SS77 said:

I’d be more worried if Henderson didn’t look good today against a shockingly bad Falkirk team.

He’s a good Championship player but if we’re striving to be a top 6 side then we need to be looking for better.

A young St Mirren player just played a pivotal role in getting his loan team to the Scottish Cup Final. I think ge deserves the praise he's getting. He played well and put in several terrific crosses. OK, Falkirk could've maybe pressed him a bit better but his delivery is excellent. 

I'm all for looking for better players - Henderson is still likely to improve - but he deserves the plaudits coming his way today.

[SS77]

3 minutes ago, houston_bud said:

A young St Mirren player just played a pivotal role in getting his loan team to the Scottish Cup Final. I think ge deserves the praise he's getting. He played well and put in several terrific crosses. OK, Falkirk could've maybe pressed him a bit better but his delivery is excellent. 

I'm all for looking for better players - Henderson is still likely to improve - but he deserves the plaudits coming his way today.

He done well today and I don’t think anyone is disputing that!

[SS77]

6 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Partick fans said similar about Kevin Nisbet once upon a time.

Different situation really isn’t it?

Nisbet by all accounts had a terrible attitude and never bothered his arse properly until he had to drop down a level to find a move. I don’t think anyone can criticise Henderson’s effort or attitude, he just isn’t good enough for the level we want to be at.

[RandomGuy.]

29 minutes ago, SS77 said:

Different situation really isn’t it?

Nisbet by all accounts had a terrible attitude and never bothered his arse properly until he had to drop down a level to find a move. I don’t think anyone can criticise Henderson’s effort or attitude, he just isn’t good enough for the level we want to be at.

Hes 21.

Folk acting like he should already be top flight level and wont amount to anything if he isnt need to take a deep breath. Players, like Nisbet, can look miles off it at 20/21 and then turn it around later. 

If he wasnt your player and you were about to sign a 21yo standing out in the tier below, and who just had a great game as his team reached the Scottish Cup Final, would you be pleased?

[Billy_Gunn]

5 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

If he wasnt your player and you were about to sign a 21yo standing out in the tier below, and who just had a great game as his team reached the Scottish Cup Final, would you be pleased?

That’s a fair point but, we’ve already seen Jay in the first team and know his limitations, particularly in the system both Goodwin & Robinson played/play.  Unless he drastically improves (some players do) then, he’s only going to be carried as a emergency squad player and, for me, I’d rather we looked elsewhere for someone that fitted our style and system.

I wouldn’t say he’s been a stand out for ICT either, it’s been a good loan spell but he’s not exactly set the league alight, has he?

[SS77]

16 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Hes 21.

Folk acting like he should already be top flight level and wont amount to anything if he isnt need to take a deep breath. Players, like Nisbet, can look miles off it at 20/21 and then turn it around later. 

If he wasnt your player and you were about to sign a 21yo standing out in the tier below, and who just had a great game as his team reached the Scottish Cup Final, would you be pleased?

You’re correct in saying that he’s got time to improve but I still don’t think any team in the top flight will be desperate to sign him based on a few good games for Inverness.

I’d love for him to stay and kick on but I just can’t see it happening for him.

[RandomGuy.]

20 minutes ago, Billy_Gunn said:

That’s a fair point but, we’ve already seen Jay in the first team and know his limitations, particularly in the system both Goodwin & Robinson played/play.  Unless he drastically improves (some players do) then, he’s only going to be carried as a emergency squad player and, for me, I’d rather we looked elsewhere for someone that fitted our style and system.

I wouldn’t say he’s been a stand out for ICT either, it’s been a good loan spell but he’s not exactly set the league alight, has he?

4 goals and 3 assists from 1192 minutes, so a goal contribution every 149 minutes.

From a 21yo winger going into a side thats been struggling.

Your system and style will have to adapt as you go, otherwise youll end up going backwards. Just because something works now doesnt mean itll work forever. Not impossible that next season you find you need wingers like him.

Edited April 29, 2023 by RandomGuy.

[Billy_Gunn]

3 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

4 goals and 3 assists from 1192 minutes, so a goal contribution every 149 minutes.

From a 21yo winger going into a side thats been struggling.

Your system and style will have to adapt as you go, otherwise youll end up going backwards. Just because something works now doesnt mean itll work forever. Not impossible that next season you find you need wingers like him.

If we use wingers next season, they’ll need to be better than Jay Henderson otherwise we’ll certainly go backwards.

[sergie's no1 fan]

52 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

4 goals and 3 assists from 1192 minutes, so a goal contribution every 149 minutes.

From a 21yo winger going into a side thats been struggling.

Your system and style will have to adapt as you go, otherwise youll end up going backwards. Just because something works now doesnt mean itll work forever. Not impossible that next season you find you need wingers like him.

He creates chances. He gets numbers.

If Robinson wants to go 4-3-3 he will need to bring in 2 right hand sided wingers if Henderson leaves.

It doesn't make sense not to try push the boat out an extra £100 a week or whatever to keep hold of this talent and give him playing time.

He's only 21, he is only going to get better imo.

Not sure who will stump up the development fee we will want anyway.

[medals]

59 minutes ago, Billy_Gunn said:

If we use wingers next season, they’ll need to be better than Jay Henderson otherwise we’ll certainly go backwards.

Whoever signs him can have a 2 for 1 offer with Toyosi O

[aldo_j]

12 minutes ago, sergie's no1 fan said:

He creates chances. He gets numbers.

If Robinson wants to go 4-3-3 he will need to bring in 2 right hand sided wingers if Henderson leaves.

It doesn't make sense not to try push the boat out an extra £100 a week or whatever to keep hold of this talent and give him playing time.

He's only 21, he is only going to get better imo.

Not sure who will stump up the development fee we will want anyway.

Strikes me as the right footed Simon Lappin.

unsure where to play them (LB, LWB, LW), but crossing ability isn’t in question.

[djchapsticks]

I'm a bit perplexed by folk dismissing Henderson. He was very good for us last season, scoring a couple of pearlers and he's not been given a sniff this season due to the tactics change. That isn't a reflection of him as a poor player, its a reflection of us not playing a system presently that suits him. He got chucked in at RWB for a few games and was really left wanting because he's simply not a defender.

If we went 4-3-3 next season then he's definitely someone I'd want to keep and be giving reasonable game time to.

[FTOF]

13 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

I'm a bit perplexed by folk dismissing Henderson. He was very good for us last season, scoring a couple of pearlers and he's not been given a sniff this season due to the tactics change. That isn't a reflection of him as a poor player, its a reflection of us not playing a system presently that suits him. He got chucked in at RWB for a few games and was really left wanting because he's simply not a defender.

If we went 4-3-3 next season then he's definitely someone I'd want to keep and be giving reasonable game time to.

It's all about opinions.

I don't happen to think he was "very good". Although his goals were indeed something special.

He's performed well in a league where the standard is pretty poor.

I would have liked to have seen whether a regular run in a team has allowed him to kick on and perform consistently at a team trying to maintain top six finishes.

Sadly that would appear not to be the case.

FWIW I think if Cammy MacPherson had dropped down a league, he'd have performed well at that level.

[Captain_Sensible]

4 hours ago, houston_bud said:

A young St Mirren player just played a pivotal role in getting his loan team to the Scottish Cup Final. I think ge deserves the praise he's getting. He played well and put in several terrific crosses. OK, Falkirk could've maybe pressed him a bit better but his delivery is excellent. 

I'm all for looking for better players - Henderson is still likely to improve - but he deserves the plaudits coming his way today.

To an extent. He was up against a third tier side that’s only 7 pts ahead of Alloa though 

[Captain_Sensible]

If we finish 5th, I wonder if the loan deal with ICT would allow us to recall him before the final as the league games would be over?

Shitty thing to do to the boy but they’ll likely get pumped anyway and we need to protect our own interests first and foremost.

Edited April 29, 2023 by Captain_Sensible

[Captain_Sensible]

58 minutes ago, FTOF said:

It's all about opinions.

I don't happen to think he was "very good". Although his goals were indeed something special.

He's performed well in a league where the standard is pretty poor.

I would have liked to have seen whether a regular run in a team has allowed him to kick on and perform consistently at a team trying to maintain top six finishes.

Sadly that would appear not to be the case.

FWIW I think if Cammy MacPherson had dropped down a league, he'd have performed well at that level.

Indeed. I’m pretty sure that if Robinson thinks his performances merit him getting a place in our side then he’d do something about it.

I’m sure he’ll come back to haunt us one day though when we’re back in the Championship and getting pumped by whoever he’s playing for

[RandomGuy.]

2 hours ago, FTOF said:

FWIW I think if Cammy MacPherson had dropped down a league, he'd have performed well at that level.

Cammy MacPherson is performing well at this level.