The DUP

[Salt n Vinegar]

Seen Sammy Wilson and Jeffrey Donaldson on the telly today. 

The Tories (well, some of them) will do their collective nut when the DUP say 'GTF'. 

[welshbairn]

4 hours ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

Seen Sammy Wilson and Jeffrey Donaldson on the telly today. 

The Tories (well, some of them) will do their collective nut when the DUP say 'GTF'. 

As will the NI business community.

[sparky88]

DUP spectacularly overplaying their hand.

This deal has the potential to reshape the Northern Irish economy. It's a massive opportunity that, afforded to Scotland, would by a threat to the independence movement. UK businesses would be daft not to seriously consider relocating to NI now.

Edited February 28, 2023 by sparky88

[CarrbridgeSaintee]

From the start, the biggest mistake the DUP/Unionists made was allowing 'no hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland' to become sacrosanct.

It become everybody's red line, with the threat of violence being talked up to no end.

It makes far more sense to have a border between two different countries than within one.

May's original deal was an absolute disgrace, and Johnson just lied.  He should be hiding in shame, never mind trying to mix it up.  Sunak has done well to claw things back from an awful starting point.

I can't see this deal passing the DUP's 7 tests.  Politically, it would be madness for the DUP to go back to Stormont unless a deal can be seen as a win for them.

No matter how much mock outage we hear from the opportunistic Alliance Party, SF (who will have helped engineer this situation in the first place) and others, the DUP should stand firm.  Other than the powers of persuasion, Stormont is their only leverage, and the complainers previously brought it down for 3 times as long anyway.

Must admit though, MLAs wages having been cut by 27.5% 'til the DUP go back makes me smile.  Sorcha Eastwood putting on her angry face and moaning about the DUP won't boost her wages.. but perhaps the rest of the parties putting pressure on the EU would.  Working together.. what a novel idea.

[welshbairn]

36 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said:

From the start, the biggest mistake the DUP/Unionists made was allowing 'no hard border between Northern Ireland and Ireland' to become sacrosanct.

It become everybody's red line, with the threat of violence being talked up to no end.

It makes far more sense to have a border between two different countries than within one.

That's why the mugs backed Brexit and the ERG from the start, bring back the old days of a fixed border and stop increasing North/South cooperation no matter the economic damage, which was never going to be allowed to happen. The Tories played them for their votes and dumped them as soon as they didn't need them anymore. Now they're delaying accepting the best deal they know they're ever going to get just to pretend to their supporters they still matter.

[Jacksgranda]

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

There will still be customs checks on some goods going between GB and NI.

There is no Stormont Brake, it is a Westminster Brake.

 

[welshbairn]

2 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

There will still be customs checks on some goods going between GB and NI.

There is no Stormont Brake, it is a Westminster Brake.

 

Northern Ireland should be delighted by the privileged position they've been given rather than being obsessed about minor symbolism that won't be noticeable to anyone. The world's been bending over backwards to appease and massage the egos of the DUP and have given Northern Ireland a massive trading advantage over every other part of the UK. If they try to wreck this opportunity they're certifiably insane.

[welshbairn]

4 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

They shouldn't have blocked May's deal then.

[sparky88]

1 hour ago, Jacksgranda said:

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

They need to be given the ultimatum that this can only happen if a hard border is erected on the island of Ireland. 

Sammy Wilson said on Newsnight that Steve Baker, also on the programme, would never accept ECJ jurisdiction over his constituency. It's a moot point as there isn't a land border with the EU that he wants kept open in his constituency. 

No-one can break the Brexit trilemma this side of a technological solution on the border.

Edited February 28, 2023 by sparky88

[Granny Danger]

The DUP’s raison d’être is to keep NI as part of the U.K. and subject to the same laws and rules as the rest of the U.K. other than for those matters that are devolved.  To this end no one can be surprised if they reject what is on offer.

 

[welshbairn]

Can anyone remember a single decision by the ECJ that affected the UK when we were members of the single market? No doubt there were some , but I doubt anyone in Northern Ireland was directly affected. It's a massive red herring, a single market requires rules and a body to interpret them and resolve disputes, as it's an EU single market that NI is being offered privileged access to, disputes can't be settled by a UK court, it's not their market. It's about commercial rules of the single market, not individual rights, tribal loyalties or flags. 

[Thane of Cawdor]

2 hours ago, Jacksgranda said:

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

There will still be customs checks on some goods going between GB and NI.

There is no Stormont Brake, it is a Westminster Brake.

 

"Acceptance" implies choice. It's like my saying I don't accept bad weather or the ageing process. It's clearly a done deal, and all the mewling and puking of Sammy Wilson and Ian Paisley Jr will have no bearing on implementation. 

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Oh look, another FBPE remoaner banging on about how great the EU single market is.

 

Let it go Rishi. Brexit means Brexit.

[welshbairn]

53 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

The DUP’s raison d’être is to keep NI as part of the U.K. and subject to the same laws and rules as the rest of the U.K. other than for those matters that are devolved.  To this end no one can be surprised if they reject what is on offer.

 

The DUP's whole strategy was to get a hard Brexit to bring back a hard border between North and South, they put their faith in Boris and the ERG who betrayed them, so now all they have left is trying to wreck Stormont and the Good Friday Agreement, and force direct rule from London. They're yesterday's men whose claim to be acting in the interests in their constituents has lost any credibility it might once have had.

[eez-eh]

3 hours ago, Jacksgranda said:

No unionist can accept a deal where EU law applies in one part of the UK, but not the rest of the UK. No unionist can accept where the ECJ is the highest court in one part of the UK but not the rest of the UK.

There will still be customs checks on some goods going between GB and NI.

There is no Stormont Brake, it is a Westminster Brake.

 

Said unionists ought to have considered this pickle before campaigning to leave the EU.

[Bully Wee Villa]

If the DUP's default position is "we refuse to engage with Stormont unless [insert completely impossible magic thing] happens", then the UK government need to push through legislation which enables Stormont to function without them.

Out of curiosity, are DUP MLAs being paid while this goes on?

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

Out of curiosity, are DUP MLAs being paid while this goes on?

All the MLAs have had their salaries cut by 27.5%, but only after 200 days of getting full whack while Stormont was closed.

[CarrbridgeSaintee]

16 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

If the DUP's default position is "we refuse to engage with Stormont unless [insert completely impossible magic thing] happens", then the UK government need to push through legislation which enables Stormont to function without them.

Out of curiosity, are DUP MLAs being paid while this goes on?

All MLA's pay has been decreased by 27.5%

ETA: Just noticed Welshbairn got in there first! 

Edited February 28, 2023 by CarrbridgeSaintee

[Bully Wee Villa]

Thanks both. 

[welshbairn]

They should treat the DUP MLAs the same as SInn Fein MPs, don't pay their salaries at all, just expenses for constituency work.

P.S. They don't half help themselves to expenses for not doing their jobs by the way..

DUP MP Ian Paisley's wife gets a £20,000 pay rise for part-time role

Edited February 28, 2023 by welshbairn