ryanayr1987 Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 42 minutes ago, No_Problemo said: I can’t be bothered going back to look, but it could just be that it turns into a back three with them all shifting across one to cover. Obviously doesn’t really work with someone that gets exposed badly out wide like McGinty does. Syla and Young are being asked to do far too much, particularly given their level of experience IMO. You could put mcginty in the middle with Frankie on one side and stanger on the other both have experience playing full back at other clubs so should be able to cover wider areas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 2 hours ago, Nelson said: If Reading comes up against someone who is willing to run at him then he’s generally awful. I would imagine other teams have noticed that too. Reading is a wing back being asked to play as a full back. He needs someone in front of him that helps out by protecting him. Murphy has been doing this, if Reading overlaps, Murphy supports him. That could have happened last season but 51 year old Bullen was perhaps not experienced enough to make that change. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Problemo Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 1 hour ago, diegomarahenry said: Reading is a wing back being asked to play as a full back. He needs someone in front of him that helps out by protecting him. Murphy has been doing this, if Reading overlaps, Murphy supports him. That could have happened last season but 51 year old Bullen was perhaps not experienced enough to make that change. I really don’t see how he is a wing back, I’m not sure he has ever played there for us and arrived as a left back. A footballer who was solely a wing back would be pretty useless. The blame for his performances last season is Reading’s own - the players in front of him didn’t make him constantly give the ball away in ridiculous situations, get caught under the ball or get roasted one v one every single time. Murphy in front of him obviously helps but that is because he is a very good and experienced player - it isn’t a Bullen issue. It isn’t like Reading overlapped last season and everyone else stood around watching him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelson Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 1 hour ago, diegomarahenry said: Reading is a wing back being asked to play as a full back. He needs someone in front of him that helps out by protecting him. Murphy has been doing this, if Reading overlaps, Murphy supports him. That could have happened last season but 51 year old Bullen was perhaps not experienced enough to make that change. Reading is never a wing back - he’s nowhere near quick enough or good enough going forward. And even wing backs need to defend at times. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 18 minutes ago, No_Problemo said: I really don’t see how he is a wing back, I’m not sure he has ever played there for us and arrived as a left back. A footballer who was solely a wing back would be pretty useless. The blame for his performances last season is Reading’s own - the players in front of him didn’t make him constantly give the ball away in ridiculous situations, get caught under the ball or get roasted one v one every single time. Murphy in front of him obviously helps but that is because he is a very good and experienced player - it isn’t a Bullen issue. It isn’t like Reading overlapped last season and everyone else stood around watching him. 9 minutes ago, Nelson said: Reading is never a wing back - he’s nowhere near quick enough or good enough going forward. And even wing backs need to defend at times. Wing backs need cover, when we had Harvie and Houston, we had Forrest and more often than not, Crawford in front of them. Two players that weren’t traditional wingers and sat in front of the wing backs. Reading played left wing for Scotland U21 when Harvie played left back. I’m not absolving Reading of any criticism, he was dreadful last season and didn’t improve at all or seem to learn anything. But we have changed personnel in front of him and play in a manner that suits a wing back and he has improved. I don’t think that is a coincidence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelson Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 32 minutes ago, diegomarahenry said: Wing backs need cover, when we had Harvie and Houston, we had Forrest and more often than not, Crawford in front of them. Two players that weren’t traditional wingers and sat in front of the wing backs. Reading played left wing for Scotland U21 when Harvie played left back. I’m not absolving Reading of any criticism, he was dreadful last season and didn’t improve at all or seem to learn anything. But we have changed personnel in front of him and play in a manner that suits a wing back and he has improved. I don’t think that is a coincidence. Wing backs don’t generally have cover in front of them - that’s why it’s such a hard position to play, you need to be seriously rapid amongst other things to cover the ground required. Harvie and Devlin are probably the only 2 full backs I’ve seen at Ayr over the last 20 years who were anywhere near fast/good enough to play that position. Maxwell might have been able to do it, but as we know we played him out of position for a season to accommodate Reading. If Reading’s value really is in his ability going forward (?), then surely we would have played them the other way round. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shibuya Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Did we play 3-5-2 under McCall? I don't recall us doing so for any length of time, therefore Devlin and Harvie didn't play wingback for Ayr. That being said, totally agree with @Nelsonthat those two guys are the only ones we've had who were capable of playing it since Paul Lovering! Paddy Reading lacks the pace, power and aggression to play that position in the Championship, there is not a chance he would look good doing it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyIncognito Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 1 hour ago, Shibuya said: Did we play 3-5-2 under McCall? I don't recall us doing so for any length of time, therefore Devlin and Harvie didn't play wingback for Ayr. That being said, totally agree with @Nelsonthat those two guys are the only ones we've had who were capable of playing it since Paul Lovering! Paddy Reading lacks the pace, power and aggression to play that position in the Championship, there is not a chance he would look good doing it. We did when he first came in and kept us up, but we mostly played 4-4-2/4-4-1-1 after that. Also think he played a 4/3/3 at the beginning of 19/20. Also you're forgetting Liam Smith 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelson Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 1 hour ago, Shibuya said: Did we play 3-5-2 under McCall? I don't recall us doing so for any length of time, therefore Devlin and Harvie didn't play wingback for Ayr. That being said, totally agree with @Nelsonthat those two guys are the only ones we've had who were capable of playing it since Paul Lovering! Paddy Reading lacks the pace, power and aggression to play that position in the Championship, there is not a chance he would look good doing it. The problem with 3-5-2 is that you really need a sweeper who can play behind 2 stoppers. Not many of them around at our level either. Ronnie Coyle and Andy Millen are the only 2 that really come to mind in our vaguely recent past. Maybe Peter Murphy too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 2 minutes ago, Nelson said: The problem with 3-5-2 is that you really need a sweeper who can play behind 2 stoppers. Not many of them around at our level either. Ronnie Coyle and Andy Millen are the only 2 that really come to mind in our vaguely recent past. Maybe Peter Murphy too. We had Jamie Adams and Stevie Bell that dropped in to defence when we were in possession during McCalls time 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyIncognito Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 8 minutes ago, Nelson said: The problem with 3-5-2 is that you really need a sweeper who can play behind 2 stoppers. Not many of them around at our level either. Ronnie Coyle and Andy Millen are the only 2 that really come to mind in our vaguely recent past. Maybe Peter Murphy too. Murphy played in the middle of that back 3 McCall played when he first arrived didn't he? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muZZa__44 Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Would also say 3-5-2 wouldn’t work as we don’t have any wide players who can play as the wingbacks especially on the right, Murphy at a push could on the left but you don’t want him to be constantly going back and forth and risk getting injured again 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelson Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 9 minutes ago, diegomarahenry said: We had Jamie Adams and Stevie Bell that dropped in to defence when we were in possession during McCalls time Bell didn’t really drop into defence, he played centre back almost exclusively. I vaguely remember one game where he played centre midfield but his lack of mobility was an immediate and obvious issue. He might well have been able to play as a sweeper in a back 3, but I don’t remember him playing there with us. Would be interested to see how Michael Rose is being used - he certainly had the pace to play as a sweeper and a lot of clubs at championship level do seem to line up with a back 3. Adams was great when he could go and physically compete with someone - smashing Kris Boyd all over the place was surely his finest hour for Ayr - but I would never have seen him playing as a sweeper. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 37 minutes ago, Nelson said: Bell didn’t really drop into defence, he played centre back almost exclusively. I vaguely remember one game where he played centre midfield but his lack of mobility was an immediate and obvious issue. He might well have been able to play as a sweeper in a back 3, but I don’t remember him playing there with us. Would be interested to see how Michael Rose is being used - he certainly had the pace to play as a sweeper and a lot of clubs at championship level do seem to line up with a back 3. Adams was great when he could go and physically compete with someone - smashing Kris Boyd all over the place was surely his finest hour for Ayr - but I would never have seen him playing as a sweeper. You don't necessarily need to play a sweeper, if you have someone in midfield that can drop back in between the centre backs it means you can defend as a back four and attack with a back three. Alternatively, You can play with three centre backs and defend as a five and attack as a three, That was the early 2000's preferred set-up of nearly every team. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shibuya Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Sorry to get in the way of this tactical masterclass, but did anybody purchase one of the new retro kits on Saturday? I had a look but wasn't convinced by the peeling badges... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 15 minutes ago, Shibuya said: Sorry to get in the way of this tactical masterclass, but did anybody purchase one of the new retro kits on Saturday? I had a look but wasn't convinced by the peeling badges... Because of your bitchy comment, I'm not going to tell you Spoiler No 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 16 minutes ago, Shibuya said: Sorry to get in the way of this tactical masterclass, but did anybody purchase one of the new retro kits on Saturday? I had a look but wasn't convinced by the peeling badges... Surely not? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diegomarahenry Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Just now, Iain said: Surely not? There were two or three in the club shop where the badge was rolling up like a window blind. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Problemo Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Get voting for Franny for the questions this week, so we can ask him why he feels his minutes have been limited recently… 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 15 minutes ago, No_Problemo said: Get voting for Franny for the questions this week, so we can ask him why he feels his minutes have been limited recently… I'm in, where do I vote? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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