Queens v Dunfermline

[queenslad]

2 hours ago, SueSue said:

No matter how you dress it up, 700 home supporters is not good.

 

 

 

Today is not best day to make a judgement on crowds. Our support is getting older and I personally know of at least 2 cars ( 1x 4, 1 x3 who did not got match today due to weather warnings - these guys seldom miss a match

[Skyline Drifter]

17 minutes ago, queenslad said:

Are you saying we didn't have a blizzard or high gusting winds this afternoon?  I am sure we got both. The wind and rain made a mockery  of the match. Player were frozen, reaction times were slower due to the cold, they didn't know where the ball was going next, so lumped it out for throw in or cleared it from back to front going nowhere. Why did Lee Robison look like Michigan man second half as he had so many layers on and players were constantly trying to keep warm. If conditions weren't so bad why weren't any/more ball boys/girls employed. Seats were soaking wet as was ground around the seats. Even getting from town centre - bus stop I was soaked through!!

 

If we had a blizzard today I must have missed it? I havent seen any snow all day (a little sleet about 7pm). It was a bit gusty pre match. I know when he first arrived the referee was a little concerned the wind didnt get much worse. It dropped a bit before kick off though. It was windy, yes, but not excessively so. Certainly seen games played in windier conditions. 

Were conditions pleasant? No. The combination of wind chill and rain made it difficult for both sets of players. They were cold and wet, and I noted the absence of ball boys too, but it wasnt unplayable. The front of the main stand was very wet with the prevailing wind blowing into it. I was getting wet halfway back in it. I presume with the wind blowing from behind it the BDS Stand probably wasnt too wet if you were in the upper rows?

[SUPERSOUTH]

Why at home today did it look like we were the away team sitting in hoping for a draw when we were playing a team sitting below us in the league? The odd time we did attack directly we caused them problems but certainly didn't do it enough. Yet last week away from home we played 2 up and had a go at a team sitting 2nd in league, I don't really get it.... 

[HoBNob]

1 hour ago, SUPERSOUTH said:

Why at home today did it look like we were the away team sitting in hoping for a draw when we were playing a team sitting below us in the league? The odd time we did attack directly we caused them problems but certainly didn't do it enough. Yet last week away from home we played 2 up and had a go at a team sitting 2nd in league, I don't really get it.... 

Maybe because you done the exact same at EEP and got three points? I don't remember our defence having any problems all game, it was a game of no clear cut chances. 

 

That's the third 0-0 in a row at Palmerston. 

1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said:

If we had a blizzard today I must have missed it? I havent seen any snow all day (a little sleet about 7pm). It was a bit gusty pre match. I know when he first arrived the referee was a little concerned the wind didnt get much worse. It dropped a bit before kick off though. It was windy, yes, but not excessively so. Certainly seen games played in windier conditions. 

Were conditions pleasant? No. The combination of wind chill and rain made it difficult for both sets of players. They were cold and wet, and I noted the absence of ball boys too, but it wasnt unplayable. The front of the main stand was very wet with the prevailing wind blowing into it. I was getting wet halfway back in it. I presume with the wind blowing from behind it the BDS Stand probably wasnt too wet if you were in the upper rows?

Was dry as could be in the away end. 

[North Terrace Gazza]

I know conditions were terrible but that crowd yesterday was really poor.
Queens the new wee diddy team of the championship

[19QOS19]

Are you saying we didn't have a blizzard or high gusting winds this afternoon?  I am sure we got both. The wind and rain made a mockery  of the match. Player were frozen, reaction times were slower due to the cold, they didn't know where the ball was going next, so lumped it out for throw in or cleared it from back to front going nowhere. Why did Lee Robison look like Michigan man second half as he had so many layers on and players were constantly trying to keep warm. If conditions weren't so bad why weren't any/more ball boys/girls employed. Seats were soaking wet as was ground around the seats. Even getting from town centre - bus stop I was soaked through!!
 

I don't think the weather really effected the game other than the odd poor bit of control. The wind wasn't anywhere near as bad as I thought it would be. There was only one occasion I saw the ball hold up in the air.

Have you ever played football in the rain? If you're trying then you're certainly not frozen. I used to prefer the rain to sunshine as it was like a permanent cool down device, by running around you're certainly not "frozen" though. I like how you put the booting it clear down to the weather. What the reason for it in the sunshine? [emoji38]

Robinson was the only player who would have been cold as he had absolutely nothing to do. I expect he'd have been cold had it not been raining anyway.

To say the weather was the sole reason that game was so shite is kidding yourself on.

[Guest Flash]

11 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

 

More generally for me we are suffering now from a combination of factors hitting our home gates. We have always had quite a high average age of support. A lot of the fans who remember when we actually were decent in the 60s and before are dying off now. The age group reaching retiral age now are mostly the Harkness mismanagement 70s and 80s era. There frankly arent that many of them. It was a time when home gates were barely over 500 regularly. We havent really captured enough of a younger age group permanently now to make up for it. Dumfries is an economically depressed area these days. There is little industry, few retailers outside supermarkets and a low disposable income profile. People are far more likely to migrate away from the town now than they used to be. Those who dont have less money. Its a vicious circle and mostly out of the club's control. 

Not saying there arent other factors but its a major issue. Not really something today in itself proves though.

If you are suggesting that the potential pool of people from that era is around 500, that is just wrong. Looking at an old Nightmare on Terregles Street fanzine, crowd numbers are shown from 1971/72 to 1991/92. They may not be 100% accurate, but I imagine they will give a good indication. Average crowds in the 1970s were never in the hundreds. In 1971/72, for example, they were about 2,200. Same in 1975/76, the first season of the new First Division, when there were only 13 home league games. 

They did show a dip in the early 80s when we were in the Second Division, but recovered in the mid 80s when we were back in the First.

The serious and consistent decline only really happened in the early 90s towards the end of the Harkness era. So, although they did fluctuate in the 80s, it is not true to suggest that the crowds were in the hundreds such that there are only that many potential fans from that era around now.

[SueSue]

10 hours ago, SUPERSOUTH said:

Why at home today did it look like we were the away team sitting in hoping for a draw when we were playing a team sitting below us in the league? The odd time we did attack directly we caused them problems but certainly didn't do it enough. Yet last week away from home we played 2 up and had a go at a team sitting 2nd in league, I don't really get it.... 

To be blunt, if we had played 2 up top today we would have lost.

At present without Dobbie and any money for a decent goal scoring loan signing we are digging deep to get positive results.

Given Dykes couldn’t hit a cows backside with a banjo never mind score we are where we are until Dobbie comes back.

0 0 is better than a battling 1 0 defeat.

IMO

[palmy_cammy]

It’s harder work listening to some of our fans than it is watching us at times.

Last season our defence was pish, this season we are too negative. We must have the hardest to please fans in the country. Presumably if we were batting everyone aside à la PSG we’d moan it was boring.

Someone actually compared this season to the Gus Macpherson shitshow on Facebook. I mean come on!

[SUPERSOUTH]

31 minutes ago, SueSue said:

To be blunt, if we had played 2 up top today we would have lost.

At present without Dobbie and any money for a decent goal scoring loan signing we are digging deep to get positive results.

Given Dykes couldn’t hit a cows backside with a banjo never mind score we are where we are until Dobbie comes back.

0 0 is better than a battling 1 0 defeat.

IMO

We canny get a loan signing in till Jan, have said from the start of the season we were a striker short. We played 2 upfront last week against a much better side away from home scored and got a result. The good thing about yesterday was once again a clean sheet the defence has really been pretty solid this season. If you don't concede you can't lose. 

[Fae_the_'briggs]

No shots on target over 90 minutes in a home game is an absolutely embarrassing statistic, especially against a Dunfermline team not at its best just now.  Even if Dobbie had been playing I doubt it would have been different as the supply to the front player (yes mostly played one up front,  again)  was practically non- existent.  Too much emphasis again on not losing rather than trying to win.  We lack pace in the team,  too slow in our build up giving opposition teams time to get back and defend.  Ball control,  distribution,  decision making,  closing down the opposition,  we were /are poor in all of these.  What is Naysmith's problem with Stirling?  He's been on good form this season yet is constantly hooked.  Didn't start last week but came on and scored,  and not even used yesterday.   The thinking is that Frizzell helps out better defensively but surely at home we should be looking to take the game to them which Stirling would have done.. (Thought Frizzell was poor yesterday anyway). Obviously Naysmith,  backed by some fans it seems,  would be happy to sit through a lot of turgid games,  sitting back,  hoping not to concede goals on the off chance that we might escape with a point or three. Certainly not pretty to watch but OK if it works,  the problem is that in a lot of cases it won't.  We got lucky up at EEP and we got lucky yesterday,  let's hope the luck doesn't run out for Naysmith. 

Falling crowds: Where to start?  Poor product on the park,  too much negativity in the Managerial Department's approach,  and "the result is more important than the performance" culture that now dominates the game. I realise this is the modern thinking but some fans,  probably of the older variety of the species (like myself),    actually pay money on the off- chance of being entertained, or at least seeing the team trying to win games rather than not get beat.  There's too much emphasis in coaching  on what the opposition will do rather than on what your own team should be doing.  There are other factors obviously for falling attendances,  weather, the number missing of older fans not being replaced,  lack of funds at this time of year,  other pastimes take over,  even the smoking ban to a very small extent,  but the main factor I would say is the product on the park,  and the modern game in general at this level,  it's just not so attractive to supporters of a certain vintage. Maybe that's a bit of a generalisation but it's certainly the feeling of a good few fans that I speak to. Luckily some of us are too brainwashed or stubborn to give up attending so keep going along in the hope that we might actually enjoy a game. 

[SUPERSOUTH]

There have been plenty of enjoyable games at slmerston this season lots of goals and action, another point against one of our main rivals for play off position. Felt the couple of times we had a go at Dunfermline we could have opened them up and scored, the game was crying out for Andy Stirling to be introduced, unless he's struggling with an injury we aren't aware of it was a terrible decision not to get him on the pitch yesterday.... I respect Naysmith as a manager and feel he is doing a great job with limited resources but now and again he disappoints with his tactics especially at home considering as he says we have lots of exciting positive sacking players in the squad. Ending in positive note we are in the play off position punching above our station hopefully a win next week will set us up nicely for the visit of Ayr on the 29th and the return of the best player in the league yes that'll be Dobbie... 

[Poet of the Macabre]

People can put their head in the sand all they want and be willingly naive but fact is if you have a product that people want to see then they'll turn up, even if the weather is atrocious.

Sounds like a typical Pars performance this season though.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

2 minutes ago, Poet of the Macabre said:

People can put their head in the sand all they want and be willingly naive but fact is if you have a product that people want to see then they'll turn up, even if the weather is atrocious.

Sounds like a typical Pars performance this season though.

I appreciate Dunfermline fans will have a better grasp of the situation but on yesterday's performance I can't understand the amount of negativity towards AJ.  He had the team setup to take the game to Queens,  his team had,  by quite a bit,    the best statistics for possession,  chances,  shots on target,  corners,  etc,  the workrate was good and you played at a high tempo. Maybe you didn't get the result that your play deserved but that's hardly entirely Johnston's fault, poor finishing,  good goalkeeping and the elements all played a part. That's probably(definitely)  two games against us this season that you were basically robbed of full points given the amount of play and chances you had in them. As I say you will have a better idea of where you think you should be under him but you were a far better team than I expected from some pre- match comments. 

Just to add,  had to laugh at Higginbottom a couple of times yesterday, when he played poor passes and then got on to his team mates for not being on the end of them. 

[Poet of the Macabre]

4 minutes ago, Fae_the_'briggs said:

I appreciate Dunfermline fans will have a better grasp of the situation but on yesterday's performance I can't understand the amount of negativity towards AJ.  He had the team setup to take the game to Queens,  his team had,  by quite a bit,    the best statistics for possession,  chances,  shots on target,  corners,  etc,  the workrate was good and you played at a high tempo. Maybe you didn't get the result that your play deserved but that's hardly entirely Johnston's fault, poor finishing,  good goalkeeping and the elements all played a part. That's probably(definitely)  two games against us this season that you were basically robbed of full points given the amount of play and chances you had in them. As I say you will have a better idea of where you think you should be under him but you were a far better team than I expected from some pre- match comments. 

Just to add,  had to laugh at Higginbottom a couple of times yesterday, when he played poor passes and then got on to his team mates for not being on the end of them. 

We've won 2 out of the last 10 games, we're 6 points clear of the bottom despite Falkirk having their worst side in decades, we've lost 8 games already this season, after losing 9 in the whole of last season etc etc.

Yesterday we were apparently the better side but didn't win, as we've done loads of times. The hard luck story gets very old, very quickly. 

[HoBNob]

33 minutes ago, Fae_the_'briggs said:

I appreciate Dunfermline fans will have a better grasp of the situation 

Yes they do. 

I cba repeating the reasons why he shouldn't be a manager, it's been extensively covered throughout our thread, it's an absolute disgrace he wasn't emptied after getting beat by Falkirk. 

 

A 0-0 draw where we looked just as likely to score as the side who had no shots on target doesn't change that, it reaffirms it. 

[Distant Doonhamer]

2 hours ago, palmy_cammy said:

It’s harder work listening to some of our fans than it is watching us at times.

Last season our defence was pish, this season we are too negative. We must have the hardest to please fans in the country. Presumably if we were batting everyone aside à la PSG we’d moan it was boring.

Someone actually compared this season to the Gus Macpherson shitshow on Facebook. I mean come on!

Certainly a few folk claimed it was a bit boring when we were comfortably beating everyone in our season in the division below. 

[HoBNob]

21 minutes ago, Distant Doonhamer said:

Certainly a few folk claimed it was a bit boring when we were comfortably beating everyone in our season in the division below. 

Tbf I found it pretty boring when we done it. Having absolutely no away fans or competitiveness was pretty boring. 

 

We had such a large budget compared to everyone else with full time training as well. 

[SueSue]

All this bluffing and shite is annoying.

Yes would all love attacking free flowing football but in doing so we would concede more goals as we would score.

GN is doing a very good job so far with the budget he has. 

We sit in a playoff spot as we speak.

I asked a few months ago would people want promotion and not so attractive football or No promotion with exciting football.

most said promotion please.

As for the nonsense regards a product people want to see putting attendances down....... I bet all those staying away yesterday will be knocking the door down if we are in the SPL next year.

it is nothing to do with product it is down to being a wee bit wet and cold to come and support your team.

I was sat next to Callum Semples family who said they have a round trip of 8 hours to come and watch a home game. There was 5 of them.

some of our support can’t even walk 10 minutes to watch the game yesterday.

dress it up how you like ...... 700 at a home game is piss poor.

 

 

[Monkey Tennis]

1 hour ago, Distant Doonhamer said:

Certainly a few folk claimed it was a bit boring when we were comfortably beating everyone in our season in the division below. 

Yes, I genuinely got a bit bored with it.  The wins stopped feeling meaningful, the more they piled up.