Ayr United’s Next Permanent Manager

[Iain]

If you have 80% possession every week you’ll win almost all of your games.

[D'Jaffo]

I didn’t think there was any “jargon” used that should be particularly confusing to a professional footballer. Obviously you don’t want to do overboard and give loads of instructions to individual players.

I think it’ll take a few months before we see the results of this. The guys know things are going well and it’s never good to change an entire training regime overnight so I guess they’ll start feeding little bits in and gradually altering things over time. In the meantime though it’s all about getting points by any means necessary. Also pleasing to hear that senior players will be consulted on how training should be structured which will help getting them to buy into the idea.

In terms of recruitment though I think McArdle will have a greater influence. Maybe Kerr realises that he doesn’t have McCalls eye for the younger, discarded players such as Roscoe, Rose or Shankland so will let his assistant take charge on that front what with him predominantly working with youth players.

[callum-ayr]

7 hours ago, No_Problemo said:

 

When was moneyball mentioned?!

Monitoring opponents and ensuring training is effective and meets the needs of the players. Not really sure what the issue is.

 

This having 5 players out long term is good, who would actually think training to players needs may benefit them fitness wise? Will never catch on.

[Hawk89]

10 hours ago, North Terrace Gazza said:

 

Would be interesting to see which programme gets the higher viewing figures, the football or the nine? Personally I’ve never watched the nine.

 

It was reported that The Nine recorded zero veiwers one night a few months ago so would think the football is probably their biggest draw by some distance.
Only regularly watch the championship games on it, have watched The Nine once. It was the most dreary and half arsed attempt at news I've ever seen. 

[eez-eh]

6 minutes ago, Hawk89 said:

It was reported that The Nine recorded zero veiwers one night a few months ago so would think the football is probably their biggest draw by some distance.
Only regularly watch the championship games on it, have watched The Nine once. It was the most dreary and half arsed attempt at news I've ever seen. 

It’s absolutely tinpot. The fact they f**k over football fans by scheduling the games around it is tragic.

[AyrExile]

10 hours ago, UpInTheAyr said:

The deal with the BBC  covers this season in the Championship, strange if they'd jack it in at this stage.  Maybe they are just waiting to see  how the table shapes up before  picking their lot, although the way  things  have gone so far they'd be as well as just picking numbers from a hat.

Yeah probably as last season we got the punishment of being on regularly due to our league position. Think it’s a good idea with the Friday night games but they maybe don’t need to show one very week and keep the fans more on side 

[AyrExile]

10 hours ago, FergR said:

Good luck to him. But got to admit I had the same fear listening to it. Loaded with jargon, hopefully not overloading the players and making it too fussy

I was more worried that its all still theoretical. Like reading from a book about the best way to approach situations. It all sounds great but can they now implement in real life 

[HMIP]

10 hours ago, No_Problemo said:

 

When was moneyball mentioned?!

Monitoring opponents and ensuring training is effective and meets the needs of the players. Not really sure what the issue is.

 

The issue is that he has no experience (that I can see) of managing, coaching or recruiting first team players.  Given Kerr’s inexperience, it feels like we are repeating the errors of the great Roberts debacle.  As I said before, I can only hope that there is an experienced coach to be added.

The odd thing is that most on here seemed to want Stewart as manager with I suppose Kerr assisting, the argument bring stability and continuity.  We seem to have veered to the opposite extreme with a high risk appointment that verges on being experimental.  

[BukyOHare]

12 minutes ago, HMIP said:

The issue is that he has no experience (that I can see) of managing, coaching or recruiting first team players.  Given Kerr’s inexperience, it feels like we are repeating the errors of the great Roberts debacle.  As I said before, I can only hope that there is an experienced coach to be added.

The odd thing is that most on here seemed to want Stewart as manager with I suppose Kerr assisting, the argument bring stability and continuity.  We seem to have veered to the opposite extreme with a high risk appointment that verges on being experimental.  

That bits just patently not true. Perhaps that's your perception but certainly I think the posts I read were in support of Sandy staying as a coach to whoever got the job.

Happy to be proven wrong.

[BukyOHare]

10 hours ago, Thereisalight.. said:

Me too. Statistics and analysis count for bugger all at times. Look at possession stats, you can have 80% possession but it counts for nothing if you don’t win a game! Personally I’d prefer to leave stats and “Moneyball” management to baseball 

Don't be scared of the future. It can embrace more traditional methods and if done properly and successfully can help greatly in winning matches.

In simplistic terms, let's say that team A concede over a third of their goals from corner kicks to the back post.

Or team B are slow to track runners from midfield and are particularly weak at defending through balls.

Is that not something to be identified, considered, worked on in training and used in a match? 

Or player X has certain traits, habits or failings that you can provide to your team to win their personal battles over the pitch and perhaps turn a draw into 3 points?

Don't be scared. 

#kerrball

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, BukyOHare said:

Don't be scared of the future. It can embrace more traditional methods and if done properly and successfully can help greatly in winning matches.

In simplistic terms, let's say that team A concede over a third of their goals from corner kicks to the back post.

Or team B are slow to track runners from midfield and are particularly weak at defending through balls.

Is that not something to be identified, considered, worked on in training and used in a match? 

Or player X has certain traits, habits or failings that you can provide to your team to win their personal battles over the pitch and perhaps turn a draw into 3 points?

Don't be scared. 

#kerrball

I'm pretty sure that any "traditional" coach worth their salt would be doing this as matter of fact.

I know from my own experiences playing BB and Boys club football (back in the dark ages) that even we would go over the goals we lost and how they could be prevented in future matches.

Trust me, there's nothing new here, except there's maybe an "app" for it nowadays...............

[D'Jaffo]

I'm pretty sure that any "traditional" coach worth their salt would be doing this as matter of fact.
I know from my own experiences playing BB and Boys club football (back in the dark ages) that even we would go over the goals we lost and how they could be prevented in future matches.
Trust me, there's nothing new here, except there's maybe an "app" for it nowadays...............

McCall clearly didn’t do it as we rarely changed our approach for different opponents. We weren’t effective at attacking set pieces and we conceded from defending them.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, D'Jaffo said:

McCall clearly didn’t do it as we rarely changed our approach for different opponents. We weren’t effective at attacking set pieces and we conceded from defending them.

I hear what you're saying and agree, however I actually believe that it's down to playing style and staff in many ways.

It's a similar situation if you look at sides such as Man City and Barcelona, they play lovely attacking football, have the majority of possession in matches and score lots of goals (generally), however they're also very poor at defending set pieces and also gift goals to the opposition quite often through individual mistakes when passing out from the back.

On the other hand, teams such as Inverness and the likes of Atletico Madrid are the opposite, they tend to play a much more negative style and have a different type of player, but again they get results their way. They grind out 1-0 wins and tend to draw quite a few but defensively they're pretty sound.

It would be great if it was possible to get the balance spot on but again I really don't think it's possible (certainly not at our level) and from a fans perspective I'd take our current style along with the defensive frailties that come with it any day over a negative hoof ball style with our team loaded with big hackers.

Anyway, we've obviously been doing something right when you look at the league table....................

[ayrmad]

I've no idea what sort of data we'll be analysing, at the higher levels they'll be examining which passes players of both teams are good/bad at and trying to ensure that opposition players are forced to play to their weaknesses while their own players are playing to their strengths.

It's not rocket science and it's going to be more and prevalent as the years go by, I'm open to anything that might allow us to perform above our budget.

[edinburghhonestman]

I don't actually think either Kerr or Mcardle are saying anything that revolutionary or new and I'd genuinely be expecting us to be doing these things.  I suspect it comes across a bit forced as they are probably still in interview mode to some degree.  Let's face it, David Hopkin probably didn't go to his Morton interview and say that he was just going to lump it up the park to some haddie and then try and win the ball when he creates a stramash.  

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, ayrmad said:

I've no idea what sort of data we'll be analysing, at the higher levels they'll be examining which passes players of both teams are good/bad at and trying to ensure that opposition players are forced to play to their weaknesses while their own players are playing to their strengths.

It's not rocket science and it's going to be more and prevalent as the years go by, I'm open to anything that might allow us to perform above our budget.

Porterfield and Roxburgh were both reckoned to be well ahead of their time and were amongst the most coveted coaches across Europe with their ground breaking approaches, however I don't think anyone would ever have placed them above the likes of Ferguson, McLean, Smith etc when it came to actual real life results.

Ultimately you can have all the ideas, diplomas and even experience in the world, however it's 100% a results driven business and really that's all that matters and generally with a "whatever means possible" attitude......................

[HoBNob]

23 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

It's far far more likely that a "few seasons of consolidation" will see home crowds drop due to a bit of staleness. That's certainly what we've found.

Aye, if our crowds are about to do the same. 

18 hours ago, Trogdor said:

Lets be serious now. Statistically speaking I dont think there is anyone more effective at kicking people up in the air than Sir Andy Geggan.

Andy Rodgers doesn't like this. 

16 hours ago, eez-eh said:

You only need to look at Brentford to see the benefits a bit of analysis can bring 

Brentford are my favourite team down south and it's madness how they keep plucking players in to replace departing ones. 

16 hours ago, ayrunitedfw said:

In a weird sort of way I actually prefer it when the away team bring enough fans to justify having the railway end opened for them. Think it makes for a better atmosphere when both the supports are decent numbers. 

Absolutely, it's one of the best advantages of moving up the leagues, my biggest criticism of being in league one is that there's very rairly any atmosphere. 

[BukyOHare]

2 hours ago, WATTOO said:

Porterfield and Roxburgh were both reckoned to be well ahead of their time and were amongst the most coveted coaches across Europe with their ground breaking approaches, however I don't think anyone would ever have placed them above the likes of Ferguson, McLean, Smith etc when it came to actual real life results.

Ultimately you can have all the ideas, diplomas and even experience in the world, however it's 100% a results driven business and really that's all that matters and generally with a "whatever means possible" attitude......................

Nobody's saying analysis reinvents the wheel, that it guarantees winning teams or ultimate success but if the information is available to identify strengths and weaknesses in your own team, the opposition or future signings what's not to like?

You'll probably find that Ferguson, McLean and Smith were way ahead of their time in that they'd identify strengths and weaknesses in the opposition, through their own eyes and that of old school scouts, compare it to their own team and plan accordingly.

I'd say that they were doing this before the majority and had excellent players with which to utilise their tactics doesn't go amiss either! 

Analysis only provides the raw data, it's upto the reader of the data to interpret it and use it effectively. 

To put things into a bit of context, I contacted the club earlier this season with detailed footage and analysis on a particular opponent. It was met with a rather stony silence, a sort of leave it with me reply and no one ever came back to me. We lost the game. Would my information have made a difference? I don't know.

Would I do the same again? Absolutely, if it was to benefit my club by even 1% in my eyes it would be more than worth it.

Don't be scared.

 

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, BukyOHare said:

Nobody's saying analysis reinvents the wheel, that it guarantees winning teams or ultimate success but if the information is available to identify strengths and weaknesses in your own team, the opposition or future signings what's not to like?

You'll probably find that Ferguson, McLean and Smith were way ahead of their time in that they'd identify strengths and weaknesses in the opposition, through their own eyes and that of old school scouts, compare it to their own team and plan accordingly.

I'd say that they were doing this before the majority and had excellent players with which to utilise their tactics doesn't go amiss either! 

Analysis only provides the raw data, it's upto the reader of the data to interpret it and use it effectively. 

To put things into a bit of context, I contacted the club earlier this season with detailed footage and analysis on a particular opponent. It was met with a rather stony silence, a sort of leave it with me reply and no one ever came back to me. We lost the game. Would my information have made a difference? I don't know.

Would I do the same again? Absolutely, if it was to benefit my club by even 1% in my eyes it would be more than worth it.

Don't be scared.

 

No, that's fair enough, I can't disagree with anything you've said there.

[Superhursty7]

Nobody's saying analysis reinvents the wheel, that it guarantees winning teams or ultimate success but if the information is available to identify strengths and weaknesses in your own team, the opposition or future signings what's not to like?
You'll probably find that Ferguson, McLean and Smith were way ahead of their time in that they'd identify strengths and weaknesses in the opposition, through their own eyes and that of old school scouts, compare it to their own team and plan accordingly.
I'd say that they were doing this before the majority and had excellent players with which to utilise their tactics doesn't go amiss either! 
Analysis only provides the raw data, it's upto the reader of the data to interpret it and use it effectively. 
To put things into a bit of context, I contacted the club earlier this season with detailed footage and analysis on a particular opponent. It was met with a rather stony silence, a sort of leave it with me reply and no one ever came back to me. We lost the game. Would my information have made a difference? I don't know.
Would I do the same again? Absolutely, if it was to benefit my club by even 1% in my eyes it would be more than worth it.
Don't be scared.
 

McCall was as old school as you get and it worked for us but we have to move with the times, if you can analyse certain players and know weekness in their games and have that in the player's heads i.e the goalie struggles with shots to his left, the striker can't hit a barn door with his right foot, players nowadays should be fit training should be about coaching and prep for the next game, McCall has brought us to the dance but to kick on we need to start looking at different ways of getting an advantage because we ain't going to buy our way to the premier league