Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[coprolite]

6 minutes ago, sparky88 said:

You'd be correct. But they don't sell alcohol so wouldn't seek one, for any of their premises.

https://www.bmstores.co.uk/products/food-and-drink/drinks/alcohol

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, bendan said:

I'm still not sure I understand what the huge problem is with this. I don't like Cummings at all, but why would the chief advisor be barred from attending  a meeting?

Because it is supposed to offer science led advice with no political spin.  The presence of a spin doctor (no pun intended) compromises impartiality.

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, coprolite said:

https://www.bmstores.co.uk/products/food-and-drink/drinks/alcohol

I’m assuming an apology will be incoming.

[bendan]

Has any journalist at the SG briefings asked why our testing numbers don't seem to be increasing? Went up a bit Thursday but back to around 1200 yesterday IIRC, which is where we were two or three weeks ago. They need to be testing all patients coming out of hospitals, as that seems to be a big route for the virus getting into care homes.

[coprolite]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m assuming an apology will be incoming.

It's more important than ever that we all try to counter the spread of misinformation through the internet. 

[Granny Danger]

Just now, bendan said:

Has any journalist at the SG briefings asked why our testing numbers don't seem to be increasing? Went up a bit Thursday but back to around 1200 yesterday IIRC, which is where we were two or three weeks ago. They need to be testing all patients coming out of hospitals, as that seems to be a big route for the virus getting into care homes.

I’ve stopped watching the briefings.  Too many journalists asking softball questions, and the ones asking probing questions aren’t getting answers anyway.

I’m not alone.  I’m assuming the 51% who think Johnson is doing a great job aren’t watching these briefings either.

[bendan]

3 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Because it is supposed to offer science led advice with no political spin.  The presence of a spin doctor (no pun intended) compromises impartiality.

I can understand the problem with him offering scientific advice at a SAGE meeting, I just don't get why it's considered outrageous that the government's chief advisor attends the meeting. It would be more alarming, surely, if he's giving his advice without having attended briefings by the scientists. When you look at things like PPE provision and care home deaths, this seems a complete sideshow to me.

[welshbairn]

10 minutes ago, bendan said:

I'm still not sure I understand what the huge problem is with this. I don't like Cummings at all, but why would the chief advisor be barred from attending  a meeting?

He takes his data harvesting guru from the Vote Leave campaign along with him. Their speciality is manipulation, not finding truth.

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, Snafu said:

What the f**k is softball?

I could tell you but I believe in the Socratic method.  What do you think it is?

[dirty dingus]

2 minutes ago, Snafu said:

What the f**k is softball?

It's like rounders without the tennis ball.

[Granny Danger]

2 minutes ago, bendan said:

I can understand the problem with him offering scientific advice at a SAGE meeting, I just don't get why it's considered outrageous that the government's chief advisor attends the meeting. It would be more alarming, surely, if he's giving his advice without having attended briefings by the scientists. When you look at things like PPE provision and care home deaths, this seems a complete sideshow to me.

Then, with respect, you don’t understand the issue.

I would try to assist further but there’s only so many folk on here I can help at any one time.

[Paco]

Even if he sat silently and didn’t offer an opinion on anything mentioned at SAGE, Cummings can go back to Downing St and spin things to Johnson before he gets the official minutes/report through (if he bothered to read it, of course). “They’re going to tell you we need to lock down, just the typical overreaction shite led by that p***k Smith and his cronies, I spoke to Jones after the meeting and he disagrees”. Something like that could completely change the context of the report that lands with the government.

SAGE is supposed to offer impartial and independent advice with no account taken of politics. If the best scientific thing to do is murder all children, that should be the report that lands on the PMs desk with no thought to the political consequences - the PM and cabinet can then decide whether or how to implement.

We do however know that Cummings has spoken at the meetings, it could be nothing but equally it might have been him steering the report towards a consensus that is easier on the PM - and thus he can claim to be ‘following the science’ that his own adviser has implemented.

It’s completely unprecedented as far as I can see, former Tories in positions of power say it would never have happened before as well former CMOs, and I think Chris Whitty’s pretty deadpan ‘yes’ when asked if he thinks members of SAGE should be known to the public hints at genuine annoyance on his part too. In normal times it’s a resignation issue for at least Cummings with severe pressure on the PM, or at least a fall guy on his behalf. But the twitter bots are already all over it with ‘PM adviser attends meeting shock’ as if this is normal.

[bendan]

7 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

He takes his data harvesting guru from the Vote Leave campaign along with him. Their speciality is manipulation, not finding truth.

I can't say I've bothered reading a lot about it, but are they accused of manipulating the advice SAGE is giving the government, or simply attending the meeting?

[bendan]

1 minute ago, Paco said:

Even if he sat silently and didn’t offer an opinion on anything mentioned at SAGE, Cummings can go back to Downing St and spin things to Johnson before he gets the official minutes/report through (if he bothered to read it, of course). “They’re going to tell you we need to lock down, just the typical overreaction shite led by that p***k Smith and his cronies, I spoke to Jones after the meeting and he disagrees”. Something like that could completely change the context of the report that lands with the government.

SAGE is supposed to offer impartial and independent advice with no account taken of politics. If the best scientific thing to do is murder all children, that should be the report that lands on the PMs desk with no thought to the political consequences - the PM and cabinet can then decide whether or how to implement.

We do however know that Cummings has spoken at the meetings, it could be nothing but equally it might have been him steering the report towards a consensus that is easier on the PM - and thus he can claim to be ‘following the science’ that his own adviser has implemented.

It’s completely unprecedented as far as I can see, former Tories in positions of power say it would never have happened before as well former CMOs, and I think Chris Whitty’s pretty deadpan ‘yes’ when asked if he thinks members of SAGE should be known to the public hints at genuine annoyance on his part too. In normal times it’s a resignation issue for at least Cummings with severe pressure on the PM, or at least a fall guy on his behalf. But the twitter bots are already all over it with ‘PM adviser attends meeting shock’ as if this is normal.

Thanks for answering my question. I had been thinking SAGE was a meeting where scientists briefed politicians. I hadn't realised politicians weren't supposed to be present, so I can see it's strange in that context.

[Dunning1874]

33 minutes ago, sparky88 said:

You'd be correct. But they don't sell alcohol so wouldn't seek one, for any of their premises.

Luckily they also sell a range of garden tools in addition to alcohol, which will be helpful for this hole you're digging.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Thanks for answering my question. I had been thinking SAGE was a meeting where scientists briefed politicians. I hadn't realised politicians weren't supposed to be present, so I can see it's strange in that context.

Imo only people with DV status or elected politicians in government should be allowed to attend these meetings, Cummings isnt elected and wouldnt get DV.

[pub car king]

B and M is a source of Tennents lager in darkest Englandshire, although not all stores are licensed to sell drink. Where I reside there are 2 stores one is licensed and one is not.

Those who hate the T can f**k off 

 

[HeartsOfficialMoaner]

Cummings - herd immunity.  He should be faraway from SAGE.

Same with Vallance IMO.

[bendan]

3 minutes ago, HeartsOfficialMoaner said:

Cummings - herd immunity.  He should be faraway from SAGE.

Same with Vallance IMO.

TBF the herd immunity idea seems to have come from the epidemiologists at ICL and LCHTM.

[sparky88]

43 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m assuming an apology will be incoming.

I sincerely apologise to virginton, his family and everyone connected with Pie and Bovril. 

My inability to see alcohol in the aisles of B and M has cost me dear. I hope and pray that one day I will be forgiven.