bendan Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Todd_is_God said: I think the idea and theory behind this is largely sound. But without the ability to prevent cross border travel I can't see how this can be achieved and, crucially, sustained I find it a bit alarming that SG advisors would be thinking we can emulate New Zealand. We're in a totally different situation. Any attempt at eradication would at the very least need to be UK/Ireland wide. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 (edited) Check out how forward thinking Arlene Fraser is (Arlene Fraser FFS !!!). We already know they have relaxed distancing in Schools to allow proper organisation. Look at Dentistry this morning. You will be lucky to get a tooth out in Scotland let alone see an AGP (Aerosol Generating Procedure) like sonic scaling, drilling. Yet the Irish are ready for 1st July !!! Nicola is beginning to piss me off with her caution. its embarrassing Aerosol-generating procedures (AGPs) will be permitted when phase three commences on the 20 July. A fast-track option of 1 July will be made available to practices able to demonstrate they can safely offer AGPs and non-urgent/routine care. This is part of the new timetable for restoring high street dentistry in Northern Ireland Edited June 19, 2020 by superbigal 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 I don't know enough and I'm not affected enough to get in to the rights and wrongs of the ways of coming out of lockdown, but relaxing things faster doesn't automatically make you more "forward thinking". The USA have basically never bothered with a lockdown and I doubt anyone would call Trump "forward thinking". 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Devi Sridhar seems to doing a nice side-hustle in putting forward an ultra-cautious hot take for just about every single development. This is why you don't just let 'the scientists' determine policy because public health experts often display tunnel vision when it comes to the impact of their proposed measures. There is little realistic prospect of eradicating the outbreak from Scotland alone and even less appetite for the endless months of restrictions needed to chase this goal. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 I don't know enough and I'm not affected enough to get in to the rights and wrongs of the ways of coming out of lockdown, but relaxing things faster doesn't automatically make you more "forward thinking". The USA have basically never bothered with a lockdown and I doubt anyone would call Trump "forward thinking".I get that but doing the physical planning of schools for middle of August based on the guidelines in the middle of June is just plain stupid. Every man and his dug knows this.Also in my dentistry example all 4 devolved nations in effect answer to the British Dental association. How the 4 nations can have such different roadmaps on this subject is complete bollocks. My Wife works in the industry and is frankly embarrassed. We were ahead of the other nations in getting urgent dental care organised at shutdown but are absolutely crawling back to business. Should be leading the way and not cowering. New PPE protocol put the chances of the virus spreading in a dental facility (which was the most dangerous job in Britain pre lockdown) as reduced from 1% to 0.01% 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, virginton said: There is little realistic prospect of eradicating the outbreak from Scotland alone and even less appetite for the endless months of restrictions needed to chase this goal. Sadly I think a large chunk of ÜberNats do have that appetite. Being 'better' than England is above all else for them. Where they think their jobs will be at the end of it I don't know, but I am certain it will be WM to blame for relaxing too soon and not extending the JRS indefinitely, and not policy closer to home. Edited June 19, 2020 by Todd_is_God 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, virginton said: Devi Sridhar seems to doing a nice side-hustle in putting forward an ultra-cautious hot take for just about every single development. This is why you don't just let 'the scientists' determine policy because public health experts often display tunnel vision when it comes to the impact of their proposed measures. There is little realistic prospect of eradicating the outbreak from Scotland alone and even less appetite for the endless months of restrictions needed to chase this goal. I think this is the important part - any individual scientist is only really going to provide expertise in their own field, because that's what they're trained to do. The reason most academic scientific research is collaborative is because each of the collaborators bring different knowledge to the table which the others simply don't have. She is a public health expert and therefore any advice that she provides is purely on that basis. The economic impact of that advice is for someone else to worry about. It's the job of the government to bring together a variety of different experts, consider the advice from all of them and then make a decision based on all of the available information. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caledonian1 Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 40 minutes ago, superbigal said: Check out how forward thinking Arlene Fraser is (Arlene Fraser FFS !!!). We already know they have relaxed distancing in Schools to allow proper organisation. Look at Dentistry this morning. You will be lucky to get a tooth out in Scotland let alone see an AGP (Aerosol Generating Procedure) like sonic scaling, drilling. Yet the Irish are ready for 1st July !!! Nicola is beginning to piss me off with her caution. its embarrassing Aerosol-generating procedures (AGPs) will be permitted when phase three commences on the 20 July. A fast-track option of 1 July will be made available to practices able to demonstrate they can safely offer AGPs and non-urgent/routine care. This is part of the new timetable for restoring high street dentistry in Northern Ireland Her body has never been found (did Hector Dick feed it to his pigs?)....unbelievable that her husband thought he could get away with it though Perhaps you mean Arlene Foster? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, craigkillie said: I think this is the important part - any individual scientist is only really going to provide expertise in their own field, because that's what they're trained to do. The reason most academic scientific research is collaborative is because each of the collaborators bring different knowledge to the table which the others simply don't have. She is a public health expert and therefore any advice that she provides is purely on that basis. The economic impact of that advice is for someone else to worry about. It's the job of the government to bring together a variety of different experts, consider the advice from all of them and then make a decision based on all of the available information. They should be listening to guys on a football forum that are choking for pint imo 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melanius Mullarkey Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, doulikefish said: They should be listening to guys on a football forum that are choking for pint imo They’ve got “all the graphs” as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18527181.scottish-government-advisors-have-no-idea-evidence-lockdown-decisions-coming-from/ Maybe because the evidence for hospitality is not going to be available for another 2 weeks? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 I think this is the important part - any individual scientist is only really going to provide expertise in their own field, because that's what they're trained to do. The reason most academic scientific research is collaborative is because each of the collaborators bring different knowledge to the table which the others simply don't have. She is a public health expert and therefore any advice that she provides is purely on that basis. The economic impact of that advice is for someone else to worry about. It's the job of the government to bring together a variety of different experts, consider the advice from all of them and then make a decision based on all of the available information.It's always a balancing act in terms of the economy and health.Unfortunately some here think you should not listen to any scientific advice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forest_Fifer Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Cineworld Cinemas are expecting to open in England on July 10th. I can only assume that there's some briefing going on behind the scenes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 6 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: Maybe because the evidence for hospitality is not going to be available for another 2 weeks?. Stop focusing on one example. Not every decision revolves around hospitality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Stop focusing on one example. Not every decision revolves around hospitality.The only example she actually gave was for hospitality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartsOfficialMoaner Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Probably been said already but pubs open on Isle of Man. No virus for 28 days, no lockdown, no social distancing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madwullie Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 15 hours ago, Thereisalight.. said: I cycled to Girvan tonight. The roads are so much busier than they were even 3 weeks ago. Also about 20 motorcyclists outside the chippy. I don’t have an issue with any of that but I saw one one of them peeing beside the public toilets as they aren’t open. I really don’t see why you can go to Tesco or Morrisons and use the toilet but the public ones aren’t open, especially when there’s more people out and about There's been some research into toilet plumes (lol) which might go some way to explaining why they're still closed - although personally I thought it more likely it being a damp enclosed environment that won't get disinfected frequently enough to ameliorate the risk. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/06/16/coronavirus-toilet-flushing/%3foutputType=amp 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd_is_God Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 12 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: The only example she actually gave was for hospitality. “Some of the other decisions around releasing of lockdown, and also the point that [was made] about some of the inconsistencies in the details and the advice, I have no idea where these are coming from. “And to be perfectly frank, when I've spoken to some of my colleagues who sit on the advisory group, it's not obvious where they're coming from. So not everything has been transparent, at all.” 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FFCinthearea Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 13 hours ago, Melanius Mullarkey said: I really wish the fucking pubs and clubs would hurry up and open. Just imagine the delights that will populate the Horrific Club Photos thread. Fat munters in cropped tops proudly displaying their lockdown weight gain. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madwullie Posted June 19, 2020 Share Posted June 19, 2020 Re planning for schools being made now, they really have to as it will require some massive changes compared to normal, structurally as well as "curricularly". It's looking more like they are hopeful that will be plan b, with plan a just going back as normal. Problem is if they gamble everything on it being fine, the system will be totally fucked if for whatever reason they can't go back normally. They definitely could have made more of the fact that they were hopeful of going back normly though, would have saved a lot of earache. * braces self * 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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