George Floyd/Black Lives Matter Protests

[welshbairn]

3 hours ago, NotThePars said:

If someone kicks this hornets nest enough we'll get someone defending racial profiling before the day is out

If you want to track down a serial killer or paedo it might save time on average. How's that?!?

[NotThePars]

7 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

If you want to track down a serial killer or paedo it might save time on average. How's that?!?

Idk why but this reminds me of my two favourite thought experiments on Twitter which were "terrorists have your baby and are going to kill it in an hour. Do you torture one of the terrorists you've caught to save your baby?" and "a (white) Make A Wish kids says his dying wish is to say the N word. Do you let him?"

[Ira Gaines]

1 minute ago, NotThePars said:

Idk why but this reminds me of my two favourite thought experiments on Twitter which were "terrorists have your baby and are going to kill it in an hour. Do you torture one of the terrorists you've caught to save your baby?" and "a (white) Make A Wish kids says his dying wish is to say the N word. Do you let him?"

I've laughed way harder at that second one than it probably deserves. 

[Szamo's_Ammo]

Outside of a first or second year university politics lecture or tutorial, I'd never heard Marxism mentioned until this year.

Now every racist gammon suddenly appears to be an expert on the subject. Strange.

Edited December 10, 2020 by Szamo's_Ammo

[pandarilla]

Context is hugely important but some people seem to forget the context of lived experience of BAME people is important too e.g. it's entirely possible for someone to use the wrong word  for a Chinese takeaway with no ill intent. It's still wrong 

Maybe your should've made this point to begin with, rather than building a straw man about 'someone coming to you with a complaint' - in order to simply have a cheap dig.

[Binos]

5 hours ago, invergowrie arab said:

Context is hugely important but some people seem to forget the context of lived experience of BAME people is important too e.g. it's entirely possible for someone to use the wrong word  for a Chinese takeaway with no ill intent. It's still wrong 

What is the word for a Chinese takeaway in Romanian

[Cheese]

[Sergeant Wilson]

6 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

6 hours ago, NotThePars said:

If someone kicks this hornets nest enough we'll get someone defending racial profiling before the day is out

I remember this debate sprang up briefly during that stabbing incident in Glasgow recently. Cant recall which thread. There was a debate about how the Police described the stabber.

Stabbist.

[Bairnardo]

13 minutes ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

Stabbist.

Yes, it was the Police description of the stabbist that caused the controversy 

[invergowrie arab]

12 hours ago, pandarilla said:

18 hours ago, invergowrie arab said:

Context is hugely important but some people seem to forget the context of lived experience of BAME people is important too e.g. it's entirely possible for someone to use the wrong word  for a Chinese takeaway with no ill intent. It's still wrong 

Maybe your should've made this point to begin with, rather than building a straw man about 'someone coming to you with a complaint' - in order to simply have a cheap dig.

It's not a cheap dig it's a serious point. Context is important and in a court of law or where there is an official complaint it's important to explore all of these things.

 However,  it's revealing that some people's FIRST reaction is to explain away the complaint and come up with all sorts of sophistry to do so.

We even had some saying "I'm sure the referee wasn't being racist". How would they know?

My strawman was not about saying you can never have context. It's about saying that for BAME people who experience racism or folk experiencing sexism, homophobia sexual harassment etc there is a culture of explaining away their experience. No wonder people feel unwilling to report these experiences for want of being taken seriously.

[Dons_1988]

13 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

It's not a cheap dig it's a serious point. Context is important and in a court of law or where there is an official complaint it's important to explore all of these things.

 However,  it's revealing that some people's FIRST reaction is to explain away the complaint and come up with all sorts of sophistry to do so.

We even had some saying "I'm sure the referee wasn't being racist". How would they know?

My strawman was not about saying you can never have context. It's about saying that for BAME people who experience racism or folk experiencing sexism, homophobia sexual harassment etc there is a culture of explaining away their experience. No wonder people feel unwilling to report these experiences for want of being taken seriously.

I think the overriding sentiment has been that none of us know exactly what was said or the context, based on fairly vague reports in the media.

Quite different from being personally approached by someone telling you they've been racially abused.

[NotThePars]

I think the overriding sentiment has been that none of us know exactly what was said or the context, based on fairly vague reports in the media.
Quite different from being personally approached by someone telling you they've been racially abused.

In both the made up scenario and the incident which sparked this off, we aren’t witnesses to what happened but in both there are people who were there that deemed it serious enough to report it/ down tools.

[SANTAN]

18 hours ago, NotThePars said:

Idk why but this reminds me of my two favourite thought experiments on Twitter which were "terrorists have your baby and are going to kill it in an hour. Do you torture one of the terrorists you've caught to save your baby?" and "a (white) Make A Wish kids says his dying wish is to say the N word. Do you let him?"

 

18 hours ago, Andre Drazen said:

I've laughed way harder at that second one than it probably deserves. 

 

[Dons_1988]

1 hour ago, NotThePars said:

 

In both the made up scenario and the incident which sparked this off, we aren’t witnesses to what happened but in both there are people who were there that deemed it serious enough to report it/ down tools.
 

 

OK, if you want to draw parallels.

In the made up scenario I'd listen to the victim, advise them on the best ways to make complaints then take a step back whilst an investigation took place.

In the real scenario, people on this thread are not making any judgement until it becomes clearer what happened.

No one trying to undermine the complaint or tell them how to feel, just not jumping in with two feet with a judgement.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

19 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

Yes, it was the Police description of the stabbist that caused the controversy 

What was that out of interest? 

[Bairnardo]

19 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

What was that out of interest? 

I think there was a debate on here whether it was right that the radio shout came including a skin colour descriptor. Would need to find the thread I imagine it's still around. Not got time now I might have a look later

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

6 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

I think there was a debate on here whether it was right that the radio shout came including a skin colour descriptor. Would need to find the thread I imagine it's still around. Not got time now I might have a look later

What the description passed to the guys going to the call? Quite often the people who take the 999 calls are just typing everything down in terms of the when/what/why type stuff so if someone phoning 999 describes someone as 45, white, with a red tshirt on, male and carrying a sword, then that gets written on the police incident and the control room relays that info down to the people going. If youre getting dozens of calls about someone running about randomly stabbing people you want as accurate and detailed description of the person as possible, especially if there’s a risk to life, potential for firearms deployments etc. 

[Bairnardo]

7 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

What the description passed to the guys going to the call? Quite often the people who take the 999 calls are just typing everything down in terms of the when/what/why type stuff so if someone phoning 999 describes someone as 45, white, with a red tshirt on, male and carrying a sword, then that gets written on the police incident and the control room relays that info down to the people going. If youre getting dozens of calls about someone running about randomly stabbing people you want as accurate and detailed description of the person as possible, especially if there’s a risk to life, potential for firearms deployments etc. 

I will look later. I cant remember who the protagonists were or anything, just that there was talk about it. 

[Bairnardo]

@Inanimate Carbon Rod

 

[NotThePars]

38 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

@Inanimate Carbon Rod

 

Thanks for reminding us of another classic Detournement moment where he just states something as fact despite it being complete shite and five posts later carries on like nothing happened