Parallels with the 99 playoff?

[greenockraver]

Back in 1999, there was a huge build up to the Euro 2000 playoff against England. There was the big thing about us getting a decent result at hampden to take down the road.
 
We got humped.
 
I remember a very similar burst baw feeling to what we have right now . Disappointment, frustration, apathy.
 
We went doon to the old wembley with no much of a hope . I remember billy dodds talking before the game about scoring in the first 10 minutes to level the playing field
... but the english squad was full of household names. Big sol campbell at the back , ye had yer nevilles , beckhams , shearers ,scholes ... we had nae chance.
 
By f**k , did we give them a scare.

It turned oot the only englishman to score was our own.
 
Big christian dailly was a bawhair away from levelling the tie! (Albeit with heroics from Seaman)

 
Ma point is... this isny done , naw by a long way.
 
We perform when the chips are doon. Underdog seems to suit us.

We would have bit the hand off at any point over the last 23 years to be in this position we are in right now .

Come on Scotland!

[GordonS]

In fairness, that Scotland team had Dodds and Don Hutchison to score goals, and Colin Hendry and Davie Weir to keep them out. I don't think we have that sort of quality up front or at the back now.

I've always felt that if Paul Lambert had been fit for those play-offs we'd have won.

We can do it on Friday, of course we can, I just struggle to remember the last time we won a game in which we were so outmatched. But it's a derby, so who knows. We could win 1-0, we could get gubbed 6-0. 

[Ayr23]

Back in 1999, there was a huge build up to the Euro 2000 playoff against England. There was the big thing about us getting a decent result at hampden to take down the road.
 
We got humped.
 
I remember a very similar burst baw feeling to what we have right now . Disappointment, frustration, apathy.
 
We went doon to the old wembley with no much of a hope . I remember billy dodds talking before the game about scoring in the first 10 minutes to level the playing field
... but the english squad was full of household names. Big sol campbell at the back , ye had yer nevilles , beckhams , shearers ,scholes ... we had nae chance.
 
By f**k , did we give them a scare.

It turned oot the only englishman to score was our own.
 
Big christian dailly was a bawhair away from levelling the tie! (Albeit with heroics from Seaman)



 
Ma point is... this isny done , naw by a long way.
 
We perform when the chips are doon. Underdog seems to suit us.

We would have bit the hand off at any point over the last 23 years to be in this position we are in right now .

Come on Scotland!

I needed to read something like this. Heading down to London tonight and I am not buzzing in the slightest. However come 8pm on Friday I'll be thinking we'll get a result.

[Gordopolis]

In fairness, that Scotland team had Dodds and Don Hutchison to score goals, and Colin Hendry and Davie Weir to keep them out. I don't think we have that sort of quality up front or at the back now.
I've always felt that if Paul Lambert had been fit for those play-offs we'd have won.
We can do it on Friday, of course we can, I just struggle to remember the last time we won a game in which we were so outmatched. But it's a derby, so who knows. We could win 1-0, we could get gubbed 6-0. 

Hutchison and Dodds were good for us, but they weren't exactly Dalglish and Law, or even McCoist and Johnstone. Dykes and Adams are fledgling players for us, but Adams in particular looks potentially able to be a solid source of goals. Dykes, I feel, will have plenty hapless days like Monday, but a few vital moments for us too.

My point is I don't think there is much of a gap between the 99 forwards and today's ones. Friday is the perfect stage for them to prove it [emoji1696]

[DanMc99]

i'll cling onto any hope we can get.

[djchapsticks]

I was thinking this the other day. Dunno if it's been lost to the annals of time or those who are downtrodden at Monday's happenings are just too young to remember but it's definitely a Scottish trait to choke with the weight of expectation and to pull a rabbit out of the hat when being dismissed.

Friday's game is not the formality the media are presenting it as and this is great!

Edited June 16, 2021 by djchapsticks

[KirkieRR]

The hope I cling to is English overconfidence, which can only have been boosted by our defeat to Czechia.

We do have a record of turning over much better teams than us when least expected, but not really for a while. The double v France 2006-7 is perhaps the last one? England 2017 came close, but for yon half-hour of injury time.

[Dunning1874]

9 hours ago, GordonS said:

In fairness, that Scotland team had Dodds and Don Hutchison to score goals, and Colin Hendry and Davie Weir to keep them out. I don't think we have that sort of quality up front or at the back now.

I've always felt that if Paul Lambert had been fit for those play-offs we'd have won.

We can do it on Friday, of course we can, I just struggle to remember the last time we won a game in which we were so outmatched. But it's a derby, so who knows. We could win 1-0, we could get gubbed 6-0. 

Che Adams has just scored as many goals in an English Premier League season as Hutchison's highest total, and while Hendry and Weir would be starting ahead of any other two centre backs now neither of them are as good as Tierney, albeit we don't know if he'll make it yet.

Obviously England are clear favourites regardless, but I don't think it's true to say we have noticeably less quality than we did then.

[GordonS]

11 minutes ago, Dunning1874 said:

Che Adams has just scored as many goals in an English Premier League season as Hutchison's highest total, and while Hendry and Weir would be starting ahead of any other two centre backs now neither of them are as good as Tierney, albeit we don't know if he'll make it yet.

Obviously England are clear favourites regardless, but I don't think it's true to say we have noticeably less quality than we did then.

Adams has done nothing at international level yet and Don Hutchison was always dangerous. Scoring winning goals away against Germany and England is plenty evidence of that. But even accepting your point, there's still Billy Dodds who was miles better than Dykes or Nisbet (and Adams IMO). 

Tierney's not really a centre half and IMO he's definitely not a better defender that Hendry or Weir. And how much better are that two than Hanley, Jack Hendry, McKenna or Cooper? Christian Dailly is much better than any of them too.

[Richey Edwards]

I wasn't too impressed with England or Croatia in their game.

A poor England team is still better than us though.

I don't actually think we played that badly in the Czech game. I have seen us play quite a bit worse than that and still win. However, we were very much the architects of our own downfall. Individual errors, bad decisions and poor finishing cost us in the Czech Republic match. I thought we looked like the better team until we were two down, then that wonder goal/Marshall going for a walk took the wind out of our sails.

Funnily enough, the 0-2 defeat in the 1999 play-off first leg was the first Scotland game that gave me that crushing disappointment. I was too young to appreciate World Cup 98.

The Czech game was my nephews first Scotland game, and was also a 0-2 defeat with crushing disappointment.

[Snobot]

Hutchison was a great player for us, he did the physical side that Dykes does and was a great link player. I was standing in row 2 at the back post where he scored at Wembley. We were brilliant that night, with a young inexperienced  CM (B Ferguson) running the show - hopefully history repeats with Gilmour.

That was an unbelievable day out, Trafalgar Square with a big carry out.

Dodds, I always felt, was just a notch below true international class but scored a few goals. Adams is just as good if not better a player (much better technically), and it’ll be interesting to see his goal tally down the line - Dodds was 7 in 26.

[The Ghost of B A R P]

Hutchinson walks into this current team, but Adams is easily a better player than Dodds.

The difference that night was an always under-appreciated Barry Ferguson (as Snobot has just pointed out). Do we have somebody good enough -- and gallus enough -- to take hold of the game on Friday? I have to say I doubt it.

Only chance we have is that England have a non-performance in them, especially when they're over-confident... as was the case in '99.

[Glennie]

41 minutes ago, The Ghost of B A R P said:

The difference that night was an always under-appreciated Barry Ferguson (as Snobot has just pointed out). Do we have somebody good enough -- and gallus enough -- to take hold of the game on Friday? I have to say I doubt it.

Do we have a manger brave enough to task McTominay and Gilmour with that job?

[forameus]

43 minutes ago, The Ghost of B A R P said:

The difference that night was an always under-appreciated Barry Ferguson (as Snobot has just pointed out). Do we have somebody good enough -- and gallus enough -- to take hold of the game on Friday? I have to say I doubt it.

 

Have to agree.  Peak Brown would have loved this kind of game.  Sure he might have ended up looking like a tit when England just shrug and play around him, but there's always the chance of that kind of performance where he is everything.  I don't think we've got anyone like that.

I think with McTominay it's more likely we see him having a big cuddle with his Premier League pals after the game than it is him being a big old b*****d.

[Glennie]

Looking at that 99 lineup youd get Robertson Tierney McTominay Adams in there and maybe an inform Fraser for Mccann

Actually good combined side but shoving Tierney to the right

Sullivan

Tierney Weir Hendry Robertson

McTominay Ferguson Collins

Fraser Hutchinson Adams

 

 

Edited June 16, 2021 by Glennie

[The Ghost of B A R P]

8 minutes ago, Glennie said:

Do we have a manger brave enough to task McTominay and Gilmour with that job?

Don't forget Brown sent us creeping out in the first-leg for a 0-0...

Ferguson was the kind of player, for better or worse, who probably didn't listen too much to managers. Don't think we have anything similar at the moment... and it is some ask for someone like Gilmour to be able to impose himself on a game like this one.

5 minutes ago, forameus said:

 

Have to agree.  Peak Brown would have loved this kind of game.  Sure he might have ended up looking like a tit when England just shrug and play around him, but there's always the chance of that kind of performance where he is everything.  I don't think we've got anyone like that.

I think with McTominay it's more likely we see him having a big cuddle with his Premier League pals after the game than it is him being a big old b*****d.

Agree, we need a bit of hard-faced ruthlessness... and the Czech game confirmed, again, that we don't have it.

[Need2Speak2Caesar]

Got a good feeling about this. We are due a scalp.

Just got my shopping in and fueled my car up and heading off to London tonight.

Come on boys, you can do this !

[Lurkst]

As long as the parallel isn't that we're out the competition at full time 

 

[Thumper]

We've come a long way from "at least we're fail gloriously". We're not going to fail gloriously. England's primary strategy is to flood down their left flank. Our right back could barely remember what team to tackle on Monday.

[BFTD]

One of the reasons the defeat at Hampden felt so miserable was that England were (relatively) shite under Kevin Keegan, as demonstrated by their cluelessness about how to handle us at Wembley. For all their weaknesses, they're a better side now than under Keegan, and we're worse.

This has been your daily dose of sunshine.