Afghanistan Crisis

[Ric]

Sort of unrelated but connected in a way, there is a great book by Robin Jenkins, called "Some Kind of Grace"...

It's set in Afghanistan before the American and Russian invasions, and it deals with a British consulate official tracking down two British backpackers who 'got lost' in the mountainous North of the country. What's good about it, is not just the storyline, as that is good, a classic moral tale of Westerners having no fucking clue mixed with a really good description of what the place was like in between wars. I can't remember the exact time period but iirc it's 50s/60s.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Some-Kind-Grace-Robin-Jenkins/dp/1904598196

Robin Jenkins, btw, is a Scot.

 

It's not about the Afgahn war, but it's one of my favourite reads and couldn't help but recommend it.

 

[superwell87]

24 minutes ago, Detournement said:

If the Taliban can take over the entire country in a matter of weeks they obviously have some popular support. The western media never acknowledges that foreign occupation is massively unpopular and two decades of occupation drives extremism. 

This is obviously bad news for the people who collaborated with the occupiers but it's difficult to have any sympathy with them.  

I reckon a lot of the security forces etc have defected either by choice or fear. Add that to all the years the Taliban have been relatively quiet waiting to make there move. The speed they have taken control of essentially the whole country is quite alarming. 

[Ric]

7 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Maybe he’s busy with something else!

That would be the same Dominic Rabb who defended the change of the Conservative Twitter account into "FactCheck UK" during one of the leadership debates, which resulted in people being fooled into thinking it was a valid fact checker instead of them simply copying what Corbyn said and posting a jobby emoji next to it. Not that Corbyn doesn't speak shite, we saw that during the Brexit campaign and he should be forever remembered for his lies and misrepresentation, but it was certainly a fucking cheap move to say the least.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/19/tories-tweet-anti-labour-posts-under-factcheckuk-brand

Apparently, "nobody cares about social media", so it's fine for his party to brazenly lie to the public.

 

So, yeah, if you are looking for anything from Rabb, all you'll get is a Tucker Carlson-esque dumb fucking look and a willingness to shill no matter what subject.

 

Edit: I see SANTAN again dislikes the truth. Got to be a tough gig fighting against the incoming tide there, Cnut.

Edited August 15, 2021 by Ric

[Wee-Bey]

The US and the UK right now.

Max Boot(licker) said the quiet part out loud in this tweet.

[Richey Edwards]

I wonder if the Taliban still have the weapons Clinton gave them.

[Sergeant Wilson]

5 minutes ago, Richey Edwards said:

I wonder if the Taliban still have the weapons Clinton gave them.

I thought they just sold cards?

[Ric]

1 minute ago, Richey Edwards said:

I wonder if the Taliban still have the weapons Clinton gave them.

Why not, they have weapons every American president since Reagan 'gave them' along with a substantial number of Russian armaments.

The thing with Afghanistan is that it's not a partisan point, Western foreign policy (and our colonial past, with the French) has ended up either giving them weapons or losing them on the battlefield (which as Rick Sanchez would say, "well that sounds like arming them, with extra steps").

[Richey Edwards]

Just now, Sergeant Wilson said:

I thought they just sold cards?

Na, they have all kinds of stuff behind the counter.

 

[Sergeant Wilson]

3 minutes ago, Richey Edwards said:

Na, they have all kinds of stuff behind the counter.

 

[Richey Edwards]

6 minutes ago, Ric said:

Why not, they have weapons every American president since Reagan 'gave them' along with a substantial number of Russian armaments.

The thing with Afghanistan is that it's not a partisan point, Western foreign policy (and our colonial past, with the French) has ended up either giving them weapons or losing them on the battlefield (which as Rick Sanchez would say, "well that sounds like arming them, with extra steps").

I remember it was questioned why ISIS had hundreds of US Army issue armoured jeeps, thousands of US Army issue assault rifles and millions of rounds of ammunition.

The official story was that ISIS "found" these in an abandoned US army base. Though why would you leave that much military hardware just lying around somewhere, unless you are leaving it for someone to find and use?

[doulikefish]

Reports that the government has stepped down already and a new Taliban gov will be sworn in shortly

[Ric]

16 minutes ago, Richey Edwards said:

Though why would you leave that much military hardware just lying around somewhere, unless you are leaving it for someone to find and use?

Not sure if you're being sarcastic or want an answer, so apologies if you were just joking, but....

 

This is one of those cost/risk calculations.

The Americans (and the British) are scrambling to evacuate private security contractors, it's not equipment they are going for, despite those contractors being paid a king's ransom and putting themselves in danger. After all, to Johnson or Biden the optics of British or American citizens being left behind and/or killed would be bad. Are there people like translators and consulate support staff that needs airlifted out? Of course, but of those translators (as we've seen from UK foreign policy) are "expendable" as they have no use for them any more and the only consulate staff left are the bare bones. At its height, the Americans had over 16000 (yes, 16 thousand) private security contractors working for their DoD. It will be less, but it's still a fairly large chunk of people as contractors are used to defend bases once the official army leaves. The UK had less contractors but estimates put that at between 6 and 8 thousand. Now we are talking a combined, about 1000-1400 left on the ground, something a troop deployment of say 600 odd men (and women) should be enough to mop them up and get them home. Guess how big the troop deployment for this mission is, yeah... 600.

That explains why the troops are there, as for why they don't take their shit (or even just the important stuff) with them, it's a case of just costing too much. Weight is money, as anyone flying to and from oil rigs will know only too well. We aren't so much talking tanks and boats and big stuff, but the general run of the mill ammunition, weapons and of course paperwork. Armies are trained to deploy and recce an area quickly, they aren't given the same training on how to remove things in an speedy retreat. You can see this with gleeful Taliban soldiers holding up top secret documents that had been scattered in the rush to leave.

Edited August 15, 2021 by Ric

[Granny Danger]

24 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

Reports that the government has stepped down already and a new Taliban gov will be sworn in shortly

Do we know their position on climate change?

[doulikefish]

1 minute ago, Granny Danger said:

Do we know their position on climate change?

Green energy is the way forward and banning single use plastics 

[Granny Danger]

Just now, doulikefish said:

Green energy is the way forward and banning single use plastics 

There’s definitely scope for a sitcom about an environmentally friendly Taliban government but somehow I don’t see it being commissioned.

[DGW9]

Those Blackhawks are 30 years old not worth the effort to take back and require an immense amount of maintenance 

[TheScarf]

1 hour ago, Marshmallo said:

Just to put things into perspective: here's who's profiting.

That's probably down to me since the start of Covid.

[johnnydun]

4 minutes ago, DGW9 said:

Those Blackhawks are 30 years old not worth the effort to take back and require an immense amount of maintenance 

Are you certain? 

What maintenance is required on them?

[Bob in Denny]

Now if Afghanistan had masses of oil reserves. and pipelines.

the Talyvan has said they will not 'affect' a proposed natural gas pipeline (currently being built or proposed)...

[DGW9]

15 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

Are you certain? 

What maintenance is required on them?

They are refurbished UH-60s the sand alone getting sucked into the turbines will be a pain plus you've got engine gearboxes etc and they'll not be fitted with the latest military gear American versions are different to these lesser versions. The Taliban have been assiginating Afghan pilots aswell over the last few weeks and I doubt they'll have anyone suitably qualified to fly them.