Live TV coverage.

[true_rover]

With the England games, is it not the case that ITV had their contract already before UEFA centralised the rights? It looks like that contract ends next year so this could be the last campaign with them on free to air unless BBC or ITV pay for the full batch.

[craigkillie]

8 hours ago, Clown Job said:

Old man yells at cloud with a hint of Scottish cringe mixed in. 
We get a shockingly poor service from BBC and Sky for our game in comparison to England, while having to pay the exact same fees
Kinda ironic that you’re telling others to stop moaning when you’re moaning about not wanting any change 

To add a bit of balance here, BBC Scotland shows a hell of a lot more live Scottish football than the UK wide equivalent does with English football. Between European qualifying rounds, Championship, SPFL play-offs (Prem/Champ/L1), the Scottish Cup, SWPL, Scotland Women and Scotland U21s they have well over 60 games a year.

Edited October 11, 2021 by craigkillie

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Another big game for us today.
For those unable to make the match, obviously again there was no live coverage apart from through subscription service.
1/2 an hour after the final whistle at Hampden, STV[emoji1787] show 3 hours of live coverage of a meaningless game involving meaningless countries.... beamed live to every TV set in the nation...prime time in a Saturday evening.
Our state broadcaster, the BBC, that we all (ahem) pay our TV licence too, thereafter again  produce a shockingly amateurish highlight show shown hours after our game finishes and too late for many youngsters.
"STV" highlights are on even later. Our games highlights are mixed in with the all the "home" nation matches with pundit Johnny Collins thrown in to appease.
We hear English broadcasters talking about TV sporting crown jewels that must remain on TV free for all. There is a reason for that. They recognise the cultural importance of these events and the inspiration they provide to the aspiring young. 
Scotland international games are our crown jewels and they have been stolen. 
No other country would put up with this p@sh. How has the situation come about? Who is at fault? What can be done?

The real nonsense is that Scottish TV license payers are subsidising English international football.

Those saying BBC Scotland should take it out their budget ignore the fact that they don't get a pro rata share of BBC funding.

In 2017-18 only 69% of licence fees raised in Scotland were spent here - that's now risen to 80% but only because of funding for the white elephant that is the BBC Scotland channel.

And this lack of spending isn't new - it's been happening for the past 20-30 years.

[forameus]

21 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

The real nonsense is that Scottish TV license payers are subsidising English international football.

They might be if BBC showed English games.  They don't.  ITV do.

[craigkillie]

In 2017-18 only 69% of licence fees raised in Scotland were spent here - that's now risen to 80% but only because of funding for the white elephant that is the BBC Scotland channel.

That white elephant is responsible for an enormous increase in the amount of Scottish football shown live. The vast majority of the 60+ live games per season that I mentioned in my previous post are shown on that channel.

[mizfit]

That white elephant is responsible for an enormous increase in the amount of Scottish football shown live. The vast majority of the 60+ live games per season that I mentioned in my previous post are shown on that channel.

Genuinely think BBC Scotland should embrace football and just show every youth side, woman’s matches, Scottish cup, Championship and Challenge cup ties.

Only thing I watch on it is the football and AVFTT, along with still game.

[Monkey Tennis]

I think the fact that we get the England games is a bit of a red herring in the debate.  

It deflects from the fact that Scotland games aren't free to view, which is the issue.  Now it's not really accurate to say they were always on in the 80s and 90s.  Home qualifiers generally weren't, certainly in the 80s, with away games sometimes featuring.  

Since the advent of satellite TV and loads of live football, however, it's the case that our games have mainly been available only to those paying a subscription.  I think that's regrettable, in the same way I think it's a joke that I can no longer watch The Open or the Ryder Cup without paying for it.

If however, you're a fan of free unfettered markets where the only relevant criterion for such decisions is financial, then you must think it's a great idea.  We seem to have a few such fans on here.

[eez-eh]

24 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

I think the fact that we get the England games is a bit of a red herring in the debate.  

It deflects from the fact that Scotland games aren't free to view, which is the issue.  Now it's not really accurate to say they were always on in the 80s and 90s.  Home qualifiers generally weren't, certainly in the 80s, with away games sometimes featuring.  

Since the advent of satellite TV and loads of live football, however, it's the case that our games have mainly been available only to those paying a subscription.  I think that's regrettable, in the same way I think it's a joke that I can no longer watch The Open or the Ryder Cup without paying for it.

If however, you're a fan of free unfettered markets where the only relevant criterion for such decisions is financial, then you must think it's a great idea.  We seem to have a few such fans on here.

And you can bet many of those people will think of themselves as left wing outside of football.

There’s something about football that turns supposed socialists into avid supporters a free market. You see it all the time on here - the same people who go onto the politics forum and shout about Tory scum will come onto a football thread and mock anyone who dares to question the state of ticket prices, prize money, transfer fees, TV coverage and so on.

Edited October 11, 2021 by eez-eh
Typo

[Monkey Tennis]

2 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

And you can bet many of those people will think of themselves as left wing outside of football.

There’s something about football that turns supposed socialists into avid supporters a free market. You see it all the time on here - the same people who go onto the politics forum and shout about Tory scum will come onto a football thread and mock anyone who dares to question that state of ticket prices, prize money, transfer fees, TV coverage and so on.

Yes, it can be something of a theme.

[craigkillie]

Given that UEFA sell the rights to the highest bidder, there are only really 3 routes to getting FTA Scotland games back:

1) The UK government passing legislation enshrine government them as "crown jewels". This is highly unlikely because they've actually been slowly dismantling this list to suit their pals like Murdoch.

2) An independent Scottish government passing legislation to make them Scottish "crown jewels" (or some less royalist terminology). This is the sort of populist policy I could imagine from the current SNP but the independence part is likely to be much more challenging.

3) Our current FTA channels stump up the money. Sky have been half-arsing their international coverage recently but even so I can't imagine BBC Scotland having anything like the budget to match them


Therefore I have no real expectation that it's going to happen any time soon.

[Charles Stiles]

22 hours ago, Meldrew said:

they only give the diddy english village teams a turn because its all in the same FA Cup package, they recently had the chance to give some lower league outfit ''tv money'' but opted for an all premier league game, if anyone is having a go at why scotland isnt live on cooncil telly ask the SFA, its them who take the money for the broadcasts.

*and ''we'' don't get a uk wide platform because no c**t is interested in it other than the folk who live here, the biggest myth in scottish football is the english stop what they're doing to watch sevco play sellick, they don't give a rat's arse about it.

 

9 hours ago, Meldrew said:

well stop moaning about tv coverage then, STV don't have a say what rights are bought, and no one gives a f**k about Scotland outside of Scotland, and even then not everyone is interested in the national team regardless how well they're doing.

Yep, the Jocks only live in Scotland. You must work for the BBC with such an ignorant and blinkered outlook. Scotland's greatest export is its people. After the English themselves I'd expect Scots to be the next biggest group living there with the Irish third. The other UK countries and Ireland have been settling in England long before the sizeable immigration from other parts of the world. Unfortunately the UK Census never determines that so the exact figures will never ben known so goodness knows which statistics the BBC use to base their attitude to the Scots, Irish and Welsh on when broadcasting to England. 

[resk]

1 hour ago, Monkey Tennis said:

I think the fact that we get the England games is a bit of a red herring in the debate.  

It deflects from the fact that Scotland games aren't free to view, which is the issue.  Now it's not really accurate to say they were always on in the 80s and 90s.  Home qualifiers generally weren't, certainly in the 80s, with away games sometimes featuring.  

Since the advent of satellite TV and loads of live football, however, it's the case that our games have mainly been available only to those paying a subscription.  I think that's regrettable, in the same way I think it's a joke that I can no longer watch The Open or the Ryder Cup without paying for it.

If however, you're a fan of free unfettered markets where the only relevant criterion for such decisions is financial, then you must think it's a great idea.  We seem to have a few such fans on here.

I bit against the original post so I suppose I'm in the category you refer to in your last paragraph.  For me it's just the reality of football as a commercial product rather than that I'm some kind of full on Tory small government free marketer.  As you point out, there's no huge history of Scotland games - or any live football at all for that matter! - being on free telly, so I'm not sure why folk get so raging about them not being on free telly now.  

As pointed out by others there's actually a decent amount of Scottish fitba on the BBC nowadays.  Folk need to be realistic.  

 

[Monkey Tennis]

17 minutes ago, resk said:

I bit against the original post so I suppose I'm in the category you refer to in your last paragraph.  For me it's just the reality of football as a commercial product rather than that I'm some kind of full on Tory small government free marketer.  As you point out, there's no huge history of Scotland games - or any live football at all for that matter! - being on free telly, so I'm not sure why folk get so raging about them not being on free telly now.  

As pointed out by others there's actually a decent amount of Scottish fitba on the BBC nowadays.  Folk need to be realistic.  

 

It used to be that there was a list of protected events.  

It was pretty anachronistic in that it contained things like the Boat Race.  It did at least, however, recognise that certain events have a value that goes beyond a balance sheet.  That's seemingly gone now, as evidenced by the fate of the golf competitions I mentioned earlier.

Football is a wonderful game, but a hideous industry, one which has embraced the excesses of uncontrolled capitalism shamelessly.

People are absolutely entitled to bemoan that big football matches with a national impact aren't screened live for free viewing.  Plenty were in the decades just prior to Satellite TV's arrival, even if it's not accurate to say they  always were.  Even in those days, big ones generally were screened, such as the two famous Wales clashes, the clincher in Belfast in 1981 and both play off legs with Australia.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Monkey Tennis

[resk]

Just now, Monkey Tennis said:

It used to be that there was a list of protected events.  

It was pretty anachronistic in that it contained things like the Boat Race.  It did at least, however, recognise that certain events have a value that goes beyond a balance sheet.  That's seemingly gone now, as evidenced by the fate of the golf competitions I mentioned earlier.

Football is a wonderful game, but a hideous industry, one which has embraced the excesses of uncontrolled capitalism shamelessly.

People are absolutely entitled to bemoan that big football matches with a national impact aren't screened live and cheaply.  Plenty were in the decades just prior to Satellite TV's arrival, even if it's not accurate to say they  always were.  Even in those days, big ones generally were screened, such as the two famous Wales clashes, the clincher in Belfast in 1981 and both play off legs with Australia.

Our playoff final v Serbia last year was screened live for free (a Sky Sports PR decision possibly?).  There is still a list of protected events to my knowledge - World Cup and Euro finals matches are on it along with Scottish and FA Cup finals (and possibly Wimbledon, big rugger matches and so on).  International qualifiers were almost definitely never on that list, as over the years they've only been sporadically shown on free telly.  

I know where you're coming from and I do understand your argument - it's just I think this is one of those situations where people have convinced themselves that things used to be much better in the good old days, when actually they were pretty similar!  

[Monkey Tennis]

3 minutes ago, resk said:

 

I know where you're coming from and I do understand your argument - it's just I think this is one of those situations where people have convinced themselves that things used to be much better in the good old days, when actually they were pretty similar!  

They weren't similar though.

There's a big difference between matches not being screened because they often aren't, technology is limited and there are very few channels, and because they've been sold to the highest bidder and are seen in purely commercial terms.

In the 80s, away games actually were screened live pretty frequently anyway.