The Big Queen's Park FC Thread

[bridgeofweirdo]

We desperately need a win not for the points (although that would be good)but for a confidence builder. The team looks deflated and devoid of any idea. The amount of ball watching is ridiculous and there is nobody prepared to run at the opposition defence rather pass out wide or back. When was the last time the ball was taken to the line crossed into the box and a goal achieved ??. Play through the middle?. Nobody seems to have their shooting boots on with any attempts which are few and far between missing the target and not even testing the keeper. 

I think (but hope it's not true) that Veldman (seems a nice enough guy) has lost the dressing room and the air of frustation amongst the team is there for all to see.

5 games left before 2024 to change things up ----thereafter I reckon if there is no improvement then a new manager is required.

Edited November 26, 2023 by bridgeofweirdo

[an86]

286 fans for a Scottish Cup tie in the same city tells you exactly where we are when you scratch away the free tickets. 

[SensibleSpider]

2 hours ago, QPEast said:

This is a weird obsession you’ve got here mate.

[Stuntiethumper]

12 hours ago, an86 said:

286 fans for a Scottish Cup tie in the same city tells you exactly where we are when you scratch away the free tickets. 

I would have expected closer to double that for a Thistle game. There has certainly been 400+ at previous games.  I heard a stat that this was our seventh meeting in 2023? Perhaps the sense of occasion of a Glasgow derby has worn off?

I missed the game (sorting storm damage) and the blokes I go with didn't go either, which is unusual. They normally go to more away games than me. I know they are frustrated with our style of play and suspect that may be a factor, along with our poor form.

[Gall09]

5 minutes ago, Stuntiethumper said:

I would have expected closer to double that for a Thistle game. There has certainly been 400+ at previous games.  I heard a stat that this was our seventh meeting in 2023? Perhaps the sense of occasion of a Glasgow derby has worn off?

I missed the game (sorting storm damage) and the blokes I go with didn't go either, which is unusual. They normally go to more away games than me. I know they are frustrated with our style of play and suspect that may be a factor, along with our poor form.

If you weren’t a long time supporter of QP, why would you go watch us just now? The product is awful. Zero incentive at the minute. 

[Dooflick]

16 hours ago, QPEast said:

This is a weird obsession you’ve got here mate.

What is weired about wanting us to have strengthened our team? When did we last win a league game? Is our team that good? Just pointing out that he was available and the club did nothing about it.

[Bring Your Own Socks]

44 minutes ago, Dooflick said:

What is weired about wanting us to have strengthened our team? When did we last win a league game? Is our team that good? Just pointing out that he was available and the club did nothing about it.

For what it’s worth, the committee have a solid stance that there is a budget (unknown but not much if you take a hard look at what we brought in) and first team movements have to work within that budget. So if the coach wants someone he has to move someone else along. The problem with that inflexible approach, which might work at a big club, is that logically if you are bringing in someone to improve things and you punt someone who isn’t part of the plan, the money involved in both directions is going to have quite a gap.

But we have the added burden of the whole Beuker plan which has no scope for short-term adjustments. Veldman looks unsettled by the lack of quality he has adopted. I can only assume that young players on similar programmes in Holland and Belgium are much more advanced  than what he has here. But those clubs have been at it for decades and we’re just at the start of it. That’s precisely why it was labelled as a “ten-year plan”. 

The CEO and DOF are the two who should be making this work, and it should be ramped up over a longer period. One is about to scarper after starting a bin fire, the other is focussed on that elusive career move to the SFA. 

The young man you refer to is probably better off where he is.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Bring Your Own Socks

[TheScarf]

51 minutes ago, Dooflick said:

What is weired about wanting us to have strengthened our team? When did we last win a league game? Is our team that good? Just pointing out that he was available and the club did nothing about it.

You do realise that;

1) We're able to sign players based on who our manager is.  i.e not some no mark Dutchman who will be forgotten about as soon as he's emptied from your club.

2) He may not have even been our your radar.  i.e a 33 year old who's just come back from a horrific injury.  Going by your squad and your signings in the pasts 12 months, he doesn't exactly fit the profile.

[Kircer bairn]

16 hours ago, an86 said:

286 fans for a Scottish Cup tie in the same city tells you exactly where we are when you scratch away the free tickets. 

Hearing that the project is being revisited & future direction under review given lack of fan backing.

[Anonymous Spider]

I think we've been trundling along hoping that things were going to click and we would turn a corner. There's no evidence that things are going to improve so they'll need to change. 

Bit of a perfect storm just now. We managed to spunk ourselves out of the Scottish Cup being distracted selling Simon Murray - so fk knows how we're going to manage this sensibly with Beuker going to Ajax. 

New DoF has to be the priority, though? Bagging Veldman will only get us so far. 

[Bring Your Own Socks]

e pro

2 minutes ago, Kircer bairn said:

Hearing that the project is being revisited & future direction under review given lack of fan backing.

I’m sure there’s no-one on this forum regularly who will be in any doubt that our committeee/board will be absolutely cacking it’s just now. 

Edited November 27, 2023 by Bring Your Own Socks

[mcjameos]

1 hour ago, Anonymous Spider said:

Bit of a perfect storm just now. We managed to spunk ourselves out of the Scottish Cup being distracted selling Simon Murray - so fk knows how we're going to manage this sensibly with Beuker going to Ajax.

Fortunately we cant get put out any more cups this season.

Not been this disappointed with results since the 82/83 season. However, for me, this is worse because, for obvious reasons, there were one or two in that team who simply weren't up to it.......

Not sure if Veldman is the right man to take this forward but pinning my hopes on Beuker being the main problem. During the time between McKinnon and Coyle the team was struggling. Coyle did well during the first half of his tenure (new manager bounce?) but since around Feb 22, both Coyle and Veldman have made no real impact. As I (now) see it, the constant influence during most of this period has been Beuker and I think he needs to go, and soon.

At the start of the season, I was happy accept some regression but not relegation, which is where this is heading without change. 

[CTQP1867]

2 hours ago, Kircer bairn said:

Hearing that the project is being revisited & future direction under review given lack of fan backing.

that sounds absolutely grim 

[an86]

4 hours ago, Kircer bairn said:

Hearing that the project is being revisited & future direction under review given lack of fan backing.

League One is certainly a new direction, I’ll give them that. 

[Stuntiethumper]

6 hours ago, Kircer bairn said:

Hearing that the project is being revisited & future direction under review given lack of fan backing.

And your source is connected to the club in what way? Or does your P&B username make that as obvious as I think it is?

Edited November 27, 2023 by Stuntiethumper

[Ben Reilly]

7 hours ago, Bring Your Own Socks said:

For what it’s worth, the committee have a solid stance that there is a budget (unknown but not much if you take a hard look at what we brought in) and first team movements have to work within that budget. So if the coach wants someone he has to move someone else along. The problem with that inflexible approach, which might work at a big club, is that logically if you are bringing in someone to improve things and you punt someone who isn’t part of the plan, the money involved in both directions is going to have quite a gap.

But we have the added burden of the whole Beuker plan which has no scope for short-term adjustments. Veldman looks unsettled by the lack of quality he has adopted. I can only assume that young players on similar programmes in Holland and Belgium are much more advanced  than what he has here. But those clubs have been at it for decades and we’re just at the start of it. That’s precisely why it was labelled as a “ten-year plan”. 

The CEO and DOF are the two who should be making this work, and it should be ramped up over a longer period. One is about to scarper after starting a bin fire, the other is focussed on that elusive career move to the SFA. 

The young man you refer to is probably better off where he is.

For me, your second paragraph sums up where the main problem lies.

My take on it is that Veldman has been put in a very difficult position where he has been hired to work within a rigid framework of giving lots of young players game time. He can only work with the players he has available to him, and I think some of his recent post match interviews have shown signs of his frustration with this. I'm also not sure he has had much say in player recruitment.

If the rumour that was posted on here a few weeks ago is true, that he is expected to stick to pre-determined substitutions regardless of how the game is going, then that is very concerning.

Similarly, the policy of only signing very young players (the last time I checked only 3 players in our squad are over the age of 25, and only 1 of those is over 30) is very restrictive. I'm fully behind the goal of developing young players who can do well in our first team before moving on for a reasonable fee, however it seems like the ballance is all wrong. Part of a young players development is by learning from watching, training and playing with older, experienced players. For that to work we need a better mix of youth and experience. No matter how far through the 10 year plan we are, that will still be the case.

Likewise, there is a place for data and statistics in football, lots of successful clubs use this to their advantage, but you can't be a slave to it. Sometimes you need to go with your gut.

Going by press reports, it looks likley that Beuker will move to Ajax in the next month or 2. In that case we should be looking for someone to replace him that is more flexible in their approach. I'd be very interested to see how Veldman would get on if given a bit more freedom.

I also agree with the comment made earlier that adding someone to the coaching staff with more experience of the Scottish leagues could be beneficial. And/or perhaps the new DoF could have this experience?

The current trajectory is obviously concerning, but I was encouraged by a recent conversation with someone better connected than me, who assured me that Veldman is a good coach that the players all enjoy working with, and that there may be a move to bring in some more experience and depth to the squad in January. Whether this coinciding with Beuker moving on is just coincidence or not is open to speculation, but hopefully someone near the top has seen what the rest of us have been seeing for weeks and is willing to proactively move to improve things.

[an86]

I think he gets until Cappielow, unless we take an absolute skelping in either of the two games before it. If we don’t win one of the next three, it becomes very difficult to make a case for him continuing.
 

We can’t just continue to base it on the hope that things might turn around. There needs to be some level of evidence that it might actually happen. I’m not seeing it. 

[Southsideforever]

Things are not going well on the pitch at the moment for sure. However, a new model to serve for many years in the future is being introduced and this takes time. We should be giving maximum support to the players and management at this time. What is the worst that could happen? Relegation? I would take that for a new model with young players being developed and playing football correctly, and consistent future success. We are not relegated yet, and we have every chance of surviving in this transition year and then moving onwards next season.

[an86]

7 minutes ago, Southsideforever said:

Things are not going well on the pitch at the moment for sure. However, a new model to serve for many years in the future is being introduced and this takes time. We should be giving maximum support to the players and management at this time. What is the worst that could happen? Relegation? I would take that for a new model with young players being developed and playing football correctly, and consistent future success. We are not relegated yet, and we have every chance of surviving in this transition year and then moving onwards next season.

I think we could all accept inconsistency. What we can’t accept is being consistently guff. We haven’t won in the league since August and our record against full-time opposition is one win in thirteen. 
 

It would be deeply embarrassing for us to be relegated, given the shouting from the rooftops the club has done about “the project.” It would actually be inexcusable given the amount of resource that’s been poured in.

[Southsideforever]

13 minutes ago, an86 said:

I think we could all accept inconsistency. What we can’t accept is being consistently guff. We haven’t won in the league since August and our record against full-time opposition is one win in thirteen. 
 

It would be deeply embarrassing for us to be relegated, given the shouting from the rooftops the club has done about “the project.” It would actually be inexcusable given the amount of resource that’s been poured in.

Money has gone into structures rather than established players' contracts to build for the future rather than short-term success.