Guest Flash Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Rather than add to the centre back debate on the Dundee match thread, I'll add my tuppence worth here. Durnan was dropped after a couple of games following a stupid sending off against Raith, which everybody seems to accept was fair enough. Higgins had an equally stupid sending off against Rangers, yet he wasn't dropped and nobody seems to have suggested he should have been. The point is, McIntyre seems to do anything to make sure Dowie plays and that means Durnan is the fall guy. He certainly appears to want to make sure that Durnan and Higgins aren't the centre backs. How many times have Durnan and Higgins played together at centre back this season? We can argue all we like about whether Dowie is better than Durnan and vice versa. But the difference either way is fairly marginal. However, we didn't need another centre back who may or may not have been slightly better than Durnan. What we needed was a goalkeeper. But, having pushed the boat out to sign Dowie, McIntyre is going to play him pretty much no matter what. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 I don't know about durnan but there is absolutely no doubt dowie is significantly a better player than Higgins. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRS LEFT PEG Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 (edited) Rather than add to the centre back debate on the Dundee match thread, I'll add my tuppence worth here. Durnan was dropped after a couple of games following a stupid sending off against Raith, which everybody seems to accept was fair enough. Higgins had an equally stupid sending off against Rangers, yet he wasn't dropped and nobody seems to have suggested he should have been. The point is, McIntyre seems to do anything to make sure Dowie plays and that means Durnan is the fall guy. He certainly appears to want to make sure that Durnan and Higgins aren't the centre backs. How many times have Durnan and Higgins played together at centre back this season? We can argue all we like about whether Dowie is better than Durnan and vice versa. But the difference either way is fairly marginal. However, we didn't need another centre back who may or may not have been slightly better than Durnan. What we needed was a goalkeeper. But, having pushed the boat out to sign Dowie, McIntyre is going to play him pretty much no matter what. Would definitely have Durnan in beside one of the other two . Explained defensive reasons more than once but nobody else really has touched on the fact that he gives you a threat in the opponents box and certainly far more of a threat than the other two. I didn't get a great view of Higgins sending off against rangers but can it have been as stupid as Durnans petulant kick red card ? I am hoping that if Durnan and Mitchell are playing tomorrow then people will not expect miracles straight away . They have not played much football although I would still expect an improvement in the team if they start. A run of games is what they both need . Edited October 18, 2013 by JRS LEFT PEG 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Distant Doonhamer Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 I don't know about durnan but there is absolutely no doubt dowie is significantly a better player than Higgins. Higgins was great for us a league down last year but I`d like to see Dowie and Durnan get a run. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
die hard doonhamer Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Durnan was still suspended for the game after Higgins red card, so the option of dropping him wasn't there. FWIW, I think it should be Durnan + AN Other, Dowie is a better player than Higgins, but Higgins has had a full season alongside Durnan. Dowie and Durnan would get that understanding in time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FC United mk2 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 No, its a fair point. Im working on the presumption that a keeper signed to a premiership side for 5 years, and deemed good enough to be offered a new contract in the summer, is going to be better than one released and without a club. Plus, Radford says he's ok ETA - I see its just been confirmed on the OS as a 28 day loan. Whats the rules on extending these? I see what your saying, but then Antell was kept on at hibs for a few seasons and was on the bench for the first team as well.. Listen i understand that we need a ready made keeper and my view on Antell is that he has bags of potential but is still at that confidence building stage that may take him a full season to reach, had he not made that blunder on Saturday we may have took 3 points but on the flip side had he not made the important saves due to defensive cock ups we could of clocked off with no points. I know it's a cliche but it truly is a horrible position to play. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I didn't get a great view of Higgins sending off against rangers but can it have been as stupid as Durnans petulant kick red card ? It was every bit as stupid. He went straight through the man in a reckless, violent way when already on a booking. The Durnan one had no direct impact on the outcome, while it can be argued that Higgins' red card might have. We were still in the game at 0-1 with over ten minutes left. A crazy challenge saw a free-kick conceded in a dangerous place to someone who'd already given the ball away. A defender down, we immediately went two goals down and the game was over. Every bit as stupid as Durnan' s but apparently less personally costly. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRS LEFT PEG Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 It was every bit as stupid. He went straight through the man in a reckless, violent way when already on a booking. The Durnan one had no direct impact on the outcome, while it can be argued that Higgins' red card might have. We were still in the game at 0-1 with over ten minutes left. A crazy challenge saw a free-kick conceded in a dangerous place to someone who'd already given the ball away. A defender down, we immediately went two goals down and the game was over. Every bit as stupid as Durnan' s but apparently less personally costly. fair enough then. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overthetop Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 It was every bit as stupid. He went straight through the man in a reckless, violent way when already on a booking. The Durnan one had no direct impact on the outcome, while it can be argued that Higgins' red card might have. We were still in the game at 0-1 with over ten minutes left. A crazy challenge saw a free-kick conceded in a dangerous place to someone who'd already given the ball away. A defender down, we immediately went two goals down and the game was over. Every bit as stupid as Durnan' s but apparently less personally costly. Higgins has had an awful season so far and his distribution from the back is very poor. Time to try Durnan and Dowie with mitchel and Holt. McIntyre unlikely to Change though apart from Mcguffie. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Higgins has had an awful season so far and his distribution from the back is very poor. Time to try Durnan and Dowie with mitchel and Holt. McIntyre unlikely to Change though apart from Mcguffie. Got to disagree there, yes the start wasn't his greatest but he has come on to a game lately. A goal line clearance in each of the last two games. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) Rather than add to the centre back debate on the Dundee match thread, I'll add my tuppence worth here. Durnan was dropped after a couple of games following a stupid sending off against Raith, which everybody seems to accept was fair enough. Higgins had an equally stupid sending off against Rangers, yet he wasn't dropped and nobody seems to have suggested he should have been. Durnan wasn't "dropped", he was suspended. Higgins was lucky in that his red card was in a cup match and didn't result in an immediate suspension (though he'll miss a game in the Ramsdens Cup next season) and even if the manager had wanted to drop him anyway Durnan still being suspended pretty much ruled it out. It was every bit as stupid. He went straight through the man in a reckless, violent way when already on a booking. The Durnan one had no direct impact on the outcome, while it can be argued that Higgins' red card might have. We were still in the game at 0-1 with over ten minutes left. A crazy challenge saw a free-kick conceded in a dangerous place to someone who'd already given the ball away. A defender down, we immediately went two goals down and the game was over. Every bit as stupid as Durnan' s but apparently less personally costly. I disagree with that. Durnan's was more stupid because it wasn't even remotely a challenge for the ball (which is why the red card was for violent conduct). Higgins' challenge was reckless but late. It was not, in the referee's opinion anyway, violent since he didn't send him off for a violent offence. As for the impact on the game, in both games we were 1-0 down at home. Higgins was sent off with 15 minutes to go. Durnan was sent off with 12 minutes to go. Rangers are a better team then Raith and took better advantage of the extra man but fundamentally both games we were losing at the time ended up as losses. We probably had a much better chance of getting back into the Raith one. We were losing to Cowdenbeath at the same stage too but didn't lose the game (though Raith are a better side than Cowdenbeath granted). The match situations were almost identical at the point of the red cards. Personally I think the Durnan one was more costly as it cost us any likely chance of getting back into a more saveable and ultimately more important match. Edited October 19, 2013 by Skyline Drifter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I don't know about durnan but there is absolutely no doubt dowie is significantly a better player than Higgins. I think you mean "was". Unless you've been watching a lot of Queens this season Got to disagree there, yes the start wasn't his greatest but he has come on to a game lately. A goal line clearance in each of the last two games. In my opinion, Higgins does a lot of this, certainly far more than Dowie. Had it been the other way round and Higgins had given the ball away, does anyone think Dowie would have sprinted 20 yards to slide in and clear the ball off the line? As I said on the Dundee thread, this isnt, for me, so much about how good Dowie is, its about changing what was a very successful back four simply to accommodate him. Dowie is the only defender, seemingly, guaranteed a game. McIntyre has tried Micthell and McGuffie at right back, Higgins and Holt at left back and Durnan and Higgins beside Dowie. The one combination he hasnt tried is Higgins and Durnan together. I think its reasonable to question why 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I think you mean "was". Unless you've been watching a lot of Queens this season In my opinion, Higgins does a lot of this, certainly far more than Dowie. Had it been the other way round and Higgins had given the ball away, does anyone think Dowie would have sprinted 20 yards to slide in and clear the ball off the line? As I said on the Dundee thread, this isnt, for me, so much about how good Dowie is, its about changing what was a very successful back four simply to accommodate him. Dowie is the only defender, seemingly, guaranteed a game. McIntyre has tried Micthell and McGuffie at right back, Higgins and Holt at left back and Durnan and Higgins beside Dowie. The one combination he hasnt tried is Higgins and Durnan together. I think its reasonable to question why I highly doubt dowie has become a notably different player over the summer, nor that higgins has massively improved his game in a season being relegated and one in a lower league. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I highly doubt dowie has become a notably different player over the summer, nor that higgins has massively improved his game in a season being relegated and one in a lower league. I wouldnt know, as I never saw much of either player while they were at Dunfermline. But then you wouldnt know either, having not seen them since 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 When I say Durnan was dropped, I mean he lost his place as a result of the suspension and didn't get back in when the suspension was over. Also, when you look at Higgins red card it was every bit as stupid because the fist booking was for dissent. He should have known better than to get that booking in the first place. Then, knowing he was on it, he dived into a tackle he didn't need to make. The point is, Durnan is being punished for his stupidity and Higgins isn't. I don't think Durnan did anything in the few games he played to merit being dropped, other than being sent off. Higgins has done plenty to merit being dropped, as well as being sent off. And Dowie was horrific last week. He'll play this week, though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 (edited) The match situations were almost identical at the point of the red cards. Personally I think the Durnan one was more costly as it cost us any likely chance of getting back into a more saveable and ultimately more important match. It wasn't a more important match. You get 36 goes at picking up league points. You get fewer goes in cups. It might have been the diddiest cup and I know it's fashionable to say league games matter more these days. I don't accept it as true though. Edited October 19, 2013 by Monkey Tennis 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broony88 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Oh another shit keeper. How difficult is it to hold onto a ball travelling with hardly any pace ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 9 points from 10 games. At the same stage under Gus we had 11. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie Mills Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Is it too early to start worrying about relegation yet? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broony88 Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 Is it too early to start worrying about relegation yet? No we played well but can't get points. Performances don't get points. Individual errors again cost us. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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