BBC Alba coverage of SPFL games

[Otis Blue]

I've posted this originally on the League 1 forum after watching the Annan v Clyde playoff game last night, but the discussion probably belongs elsewhere, and apologies in advance if there is already a thread somewhere for this.

This BBC Alba lower league coverage thing really does ma heid in.  I get that BBC Alba is all about promoting the Gaelic language and I've no issue with that cause.  But why watch an SPFL playoff game between two clubs who will probably not have a Gaelic speaker within their fanbase, and a probable TV viewing public (mostly "southern Scots" - ie South of the highland fault line) who likewise will be unlikely to have any Gaelic speakers, with commentary in Gaelic?  Flipping this around, does the BBC seriously think that there will be many viewers within the Gaelic speaking community (mostly based in the Western Isles and North Western Highlands) who would want to tune in to watch a football game between Annan and Clyde?  The interviews have to revert to English of course because none of the players, management or pundits speak Gaelic.

Keep BBC Alba for broadcasting content relevant to the Gaelic community (as they do in Wales), but SPFL lower league games content/commentary should be in English.  No doubt the BBC will say something like ... "to be able to screen the game on the Alba channel there has to be Gaelic language content" as their get out - well, fine then put them on the BBC Scotland channel.  It's great that these games are made available on public TV, but the whole Alba/Gaelic content thing for these events is just plain daft.  Whatever happened to common sense?

Any others with views (for or against) on this?

[The Master]

BBC Alba isn't funded 100% by the BBC. It's a joint operation with MG Alba.

The upshot is that the rights to these games (and the other football shown on the channel) come out of the BBC Alba budget, and thus must be shown on that channel, with Gaelic commentary (there's been a few SWNT games shown with English commentary on the iPlayer, but the primary broadcast language is still Gaelic).

If they weren't on Alba, they likely wouldn't be shown at all. 

[Salvo Montalbano]

I guess that's another argument isn't it? In England the lower league play-off games are shown on Sky and the non-league play-offs are shown on BT (I think they even televised the National League North and South play-offs in the last couple of seasons?) but up here you've had years when Sky have had the rights and not bothered showing them, and the lower league ones are only ever on BBC Alba, and indeed it was only fairly recently they started showing the League One play-offs after only showing the Championship final for several years. BBC Radio Scotland don't bother their arse covering them either. You can argue about teams finishing in mid-table being able to win promotion but one thing you have to admit is they create a bit of excitement, but our media companies look at this open goal and decide to go to the (Rangers or Celtic) club shop instead.

[Otis Blue]

I've suggested that the Mods move the posts on the L1 Clyde/Annan thread over to this thread to keep things in one place.

@invergowrie arab has explained the business model behind BBC Alba, as also indicated above by @The Master.

@untitled00 has also mentioned that in Wales, S4C has a red button option where you can listen in to English commentary as an alternative to the Welsh language version - but notes that this probably carries extra cost to the channel.

[Otis Blue]

1 hour ago, The Master said:

BBC Alba isn't funded 100% by the BBC. It's a joint operation with MG Alba.

The upshot is that the rights to these games (and the other football shown on the channel) come out of the BBC Alba budget, and thus must be shown on that channel, with Gaelic commentary (there's been a few SWNT games shown with English commentary on the iPlayer, but the primary broadcast language is still Gaelic).

If they weren't on Alba, they likely wouldn't be shown at all. 

I've no doubt what you say is fully correct.  I think my beef is that there is clearly a desire (at some level anyway) from the SPFL to have these games made available on terrestrial TV, but that showing them with Gaelic commentary to an (almost certainly) purely English speaking audience is just plain daft and nonsensical, regardless of the contractual reasons behind how and where it is transmitted.  I don't believe it is beyond the wit of man for the SPFL and the media channels to discuss a more common sense approach here - even if it means moving this to another channel/broadcaster.

[BFTD]

If Gaelic commentary means we get more opportunities to watch the smaller clubs on the telly, great. It's not long since the idea of an Annan game being broadcast would've seemed ridiculous.

Might just be me, but I don't feel like I miss much without (understandable) professional commentary anyway. I watched most of a World Cup in Spanish once, and it was arguably more enjoyable purely because the Mexican commentators actually sounded like they enjoyed the sport and their jobs. Fan commentary can be better for similar reasons.

[invergowrie arab]

I watched the game and will again tonight so they aren't catering to a purely English speaking audience.

Your notion that most Gaelic speakers come from the Highlands is incorrect. 10% of all Gaelic speakers live in Glasgow. I couldn't say for Clyde but I certainly know Gaelic speaking fans of Rangers, Celtic and Partick.

Anyway, its not really relevant as from MG Alba's POV the acquisition of football and previously Pro 12 rugby does two things. 

1. The official reason. It acts as a gateway drug to Gaelic for non-speakers. The idea being that people jump on a spectrum that goes from actively wanting to learn the language to just not being completely hostile due to normalisation of interaction with the language.

2. The unofficial reason is it boosts channel numbers and the sports stuff is often the most watched content.

It's not BBC Alba's intention or MO to provide a service to Clyde or Annan fans.  

Your beef here is with the BBC and SPFL. MG Alba have basically found the tenner on the ground that those two dropped.

[Skyline Drifter]

39 minutes ago, Otis Blue said:

I don't get your point about commentary in English being daft - almost nobody watching the channel understands Gaelic and almost no Gaelic speaking watchers of BBC Alba will watch these programmes either.  So what's the point in transmitting the programme in a format that isn't comprehendable to the viewers actually watching and in a format to potential Gaelic speaking viewers who will have no interest in watching.  That for me is plain daft and nonsensical.

I'm sorry, I'm not following your logic at all. Its a gaelic language channel, that is its entire raison d'etre. Why on earth would it carry an exclusively English language commentary? There's no sense in that. 

Commentary should be in gaelic and so should the expert analysis. And for that matter the half time segments should either be dubbed or subtitled in gaelic.

[Otis Blue]

Just now, Skyline Drifter said:

I'm sorry, I'm not following your logic at all. Its a gaelic language channel, that is its entire raison d'etre. Why on earth would it carry an exclusively English language commentary? There's no sense in that. 

Commentary should be in gaelic and so should the expert analysis. And for that matter the half time segments should either be dubbed or subtitled in gaelic.

I'm not communicating this well, am I?  The real point is put it on a channel where English commentary is possible.  Quite why these games are put on a Gaelic channel is beyond me.  Extremely few of the Gaelic speaking public (located mostly in the Western Isles/NW Highlands) will have any interest in watching these games and almost certainly none of the football viewing public (located mostly south of the Highland fault line) who might watch these games speak any Gaelic.  How daft is this?  Thus the solutions are either:

1 - Provide an English commentary on BBC Alba for these games - perhaps as a red button alternative as they do in Wales, or

2 - Move the games to an alternative English language channel

Who on earth in the first place decided that a Gaelic speaking channel was remotely appropriate as a location for such programmes?  Beats me.

[KirkieRR]

Some of the bigger games (women's internationals, say) have an English commentary on the Red Button.

 

I've noticed that in SWPL coverage, after the commentator has moved into English to have a natter with the summariser, he sometimes forgets to go back into Gaelic again and it's like watching a normal football programme.

[KirkieRR]

1 minute ago, Otis Blue said:

1 - Provide an English commentary on BBC Alba for these games - perhaps as a red button alternative as they do in Wales, or

 

As I've said above, they have done this on some occasions. Mostly for women's internationals.

[Richey Edwards]

If you don't like the commentary, do what I do and mute it and do your own.

[velo army]

21 minutes ago, Richey Edwards said:

If you don't like the commentary, do what I do and mute it and do your own.

What language do you do it in?

[Richey Edwards]

1 minute ago, velo army said:

What language do you do it in?

Depending what's happening, sometimes very explicit language.

[GNU_Linux]

25 minutes ago, Richey Edwards said:

If you don't like the commentary, do what I do and mute it and do your own.

Can I access this via the red button or is it an option only on iplayer?

[Richey Edwards]

Just now, GNU_Linux said:

Can I access this via the red button or is it an option only on iplayer?

Just press the mute button.

[The Master]

25 minutes ago, Otis Blue said:

I'm not communicating this well, am I?  The real point is put it on a channel where English commentary is possible.  Quite why these games are put on a Gaelic channel is beyond me. 

They're on a Gaelic-language channel because a Gaelic-language channel bought the rights. 

And clearly it works for them because the football coverage is by far the most-watch programming on the channel.  Obviously most of those viewers won't speak Gaelic, but given these are games that won't be shown elsewhere I'm not sure why that's a problem. 

[Jan Vojáček]

I'll watch most of the lower league games Alba televises and, weirdly, don't seem to notice the commentary if that makes sense? I find it quite an easy language to listen to, and the pundits and VTs being in English mean that I've got to the stage where I don't really give it a second thought anymore. It actually winds me up considerably less than some of the commentary that's in English, seen as I can't argue with it!

[ScottR96]

I was far too invested in the game last night as a Clyde fan to notice the commentary tbh but I have felt the same way as the OP in the past when it’s a game I don’t have a vested interest in. 

I would much rather these games were shown on BBC Scotland but find it hard to level any sort criticism at Alba as at least they’re showing them. The Gaelic commentary is a small price to pay imo. It can also be quite good not having a clue what’s going on instead of having to listen to the likes of Chris Iwelumo and Rory Loy.
 

I do find it odd that BBC Scotland put all their eggs in the one basket with the Championship and don’t show at least a couple of games from L1 & L2, although I don’t really understand how TV deals work so I’ve no idea if it’s even an option. For all the Championship gets plaudits for being a really exciting league, some of the games shown on the BBC this season have been absolutely shocking. The size of the league also just makes it quite repetitive - you feel as if you’re watching the same teams every week. 

Edited May 17, 2023 by ScottR96

[razamanaz]

I don't mind the Gaelic commentary, just happy to see lower league games on the tele. Been watching football long enough to know what's going on - well done BBC Alba