WaffenThinMint Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I really like this Finkelstein guy. Norm Finkelstein's a great writer. I think a lot of the deadpan humour to his writings are down to his parents, who if I remember correctly were some of the very few to have survived Majdenek (which made the Birkenau end of Auschwitz look like Butlins) and who became very disillusioned after the war at the way so many holocaust survivors thought nothing about screwing their own. Somehow they weren't in the least surprised. His book "The Holocaust Industry" is enough to make you want to punch lawyers on sight. It's horrifying to read how they simply used those that had survived the holocaust as a way of screwing money out of companies and banks left right and centre, with the people it was meant to help being lucky to see a cent of it. He broke down a lot of barriers in Germany about the Holocaust, particularly amongst the older generation where anti-Semitism still lies in places (especially the "veterans") who grumbled amongst themselves about Jews getting "fat" on these "shakedowns", it came as an almighty shock to them when he was interviewed over there and they learned those the money was supposed to go instead often died in poverty having received little to no help at all. Top bloke! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dee Man Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Indeed. Tl;dr 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS-18 ICBM Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 (edited) Our troops will stay out of Palestine because we don't really gives a f**k about human rights. The troops are not ours and some of us do actually care about the human rights of all innocent men, women and children. Israel, Palestine and Terror Having just won the American election, one cannot help but wonder if Barack Obama's doctrine of change will include the continuing plight of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. With the world's media having clearly been focused on said election campaign, perhaps the world's leaders will now finally address the ongoing humanitarian crisis in the Middle East; a stalemate of a situation, which continues to offer nothing other than appalling suffering and inexorable stasis. Indeed, many view the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as being centrifugal to world stability, which lends Israel, Palestine and Terror a resounding credence, if not credibility, way beyond the release of countless other political proliferations. Edited by Stephen Law, the fifteen essays contained herein, are of a fundamentally philosophical persuasion, which, like the subject they address, can make for (occasional) tempestuous reading. So be warned – these essays are loud and dense and opinionated and, as a result, rather inflammatory. In the first, 'Terrorisms in Palestine,' Ted Honderich nigh immediately asks if: ''terrorism now will secure a certain end or one of a range of ends, or will instead be the worst of things – useless killing, useless suffering, useless wrecking of lives.'' Suffice to say, if one were to ask this question in Tel Aviv, the response(s) would invariably be polar to those, than if the same question were asked in downtown Philadelphia. Similarly, Honderich then writes of another contentious issue, which again, if asked in Berlin, would garner an altogether different response than if it were asked in Jerusalem: ''A homeland for the Jewish people ought to have been created out of Germany. It was not the Palestinians who voted for Hitler in a German democracy and then ran the death camps. It was not the Palestinians who for conclusive reasons […] should have given more than help to the Jews, more than compensation. It is Germany, beyond question of doubt, out of which a homeland for the Jews ought to have been carved.'' The mere fact that this essay is placed right at the beginning of the book, suggests a great deal of philosophical and political shooting from the hip is yet to come. In 'Terrorism and Justice: Some Useful Truisms,' the brilliant, corrosive and effervescent of literary troubadours that is Noam Chomsky, questions whether terror is in fact, the weapon of the weak. As a result of 'hemispheric defence' having been changed to 'internal security' during the 1960s, the writer equates 9-11 with previous American terrorist activities in Columbia and Cuba (under Kennedy), and then Nicaragua during the 1980s (under Reagan): ''It is traditional for states to call their own terrorism 'counterterrorism,' even the worst mass murderers: the Nazis, for example. In occupied Europe, they claimed to be defending the population and legitimate governments from the partisans, terrorists supported from abroad […] The US military had some appreciation of the Nazi perspective: its counterinsurgency programmes were modelled on Nazi manuals, which were analysed sympathetically, with the assistance of Wehrmacht officers.'' Such high-octane writing is prevalent throughout the book, which makes for both imperative and interesting reading, as the ever influential Tony Benn explains: ''This is a brilliant, timely and important philosophical debate about the meaning and legitimacy of terrorism in the ongoing conflict between Israel and Palestine against the background of history.'' Should America's newly elected 44th President only read one book before his inauguration in January, let it be Israel, Palestine and Terror; especially the following (by Ted Honderich): ''The history of Palestine is partly in America, partly in New York, Los Angeles and Washington. Right or wrong in Palestine is importantly American right or wrong, almost as much by commission as by omission. David Marx www.davidmarx.co.uk Edited November 19, 2012 by SS-18 ICBM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 The last half a dozen pages or so of this thread are made up almost exclusively of that. The "you have chosen to ignore this throbber" bit, not Greggy Wallaces fantastic smug coupon, which would have been much better I agree, we really should get Div to sort that out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS-18 ICBM Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Well, obviously it's because of a political movement that began several centuries after the word Ashkenazim was first used. And it wouldn't be the actual name of that political movement. It would be a nickname for it that was originally disparaging, as Nazi was a common nickname for people called Ignatz, a common name in the rural portions of the NSDAP's Bavarian heartland. Why, what did you think it was? The biblical name Ashkenaz and the toponym for the part of Germany in which these people settled? ENCYCLOPEDIA BRITANNICA: Ashkenazi, plural Ashkenazim, from Hebrew Ashkenaz ("Germany"), member of the Jews who lived in the Rhineland valley and in neighbouring France before their migration eastward to Slavic lands (e.g., Poland, Lithuania, Russia) after the Crusades (11th–13th century) and their descendants. After the 17th-century persecutions in eastern Europe, large numbers of these Jews resettled in western Europe, where they assimilated, as they had done in eastern Europe, with other Jewish communities. In time, all Jews who had adopted the "German rite" synagogue ritual were referred to as Ashkenazim to distinguish them from Sephardic (Spanish rite) Jews. Ashkenazim differ from Sephardim in their pronunciation of Hebrew, in cultural traditions, in synagogue cantillation (chanting), in their widespread use of Yiddish (until the 20th century), and especially in synagogue liturgy. Today Ashkenazim constitute more than 80 percent of all the Jews in the world, vastly outnumbering Sephardic Jews. In the late 20th century, Ashkenazic Jews numbered more than 11 million. In Israel the numbers of Ashkenazim and Sephardim are roughly equal, and the chief rabbinate has both an Ashkenazic and a Sephardic chief rabbi on equal footing. All Reform and Conservative Jewish congregations belong to the Ashkenazic tradition. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinigol Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Does anyone in this thread not have SS-18 on ignore? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE KING Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 1353359478[/url]' post='6822809']Who was it that came up with that? De Bono? Yeah http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/de-bonos-marmite-plan-for-peace-in-middle-yeast-740189.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Freud Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Why do our citizens have to live with rocket fire from Gaza while we fight with our hands tied? Why are the citizens of Gaza immune? If the Syrians were to open fire on our towns, would we not attack Damascus? If the Cubans were to fire at Miami, wouldn’t Havana suffer the consequences? That’s what’s called “deterrence” – if you shoot at me, I’ll shoot at you. There is no justification for the State of Gaza being able to shoot at our towns with impunity. We need to flatten entire neighborhoods in Gaza. Flatten all of Gaza. The Americans didn’t stop with Hiroshima – the Japanese weren’t surrendering fast enough, so they hit Nagasaki, too. There should be no electricity in Gaza, no gasoline or moving vehicles, nothing. Then they’d really call for a ceasefire. Were this to happen, the images from Gaza might be unpleasant – but victory would be swift, and the lives of our soldiers and civilians spared. The words of Ariel Sharon's son. You cannot judge the father by the son nor vice versa but you'd also be a fool not to see this through 'window' into the thinking of the former prime minister of Israel's family household, a father who himself is guilty of atrocities. It is in moments like that where the distinctions between zionism and nazism suddenly melt away and you feel a familiar chill reading the words. These Völkisch movements all inevitably become runaway trains of psychopathic lunacy. They are like factories of transformation where normal human beings go in in one end and come out dangerous psychopathic nutcases the other. Mmm. Because German Jews were constantly bombarding Berlin. Look, the Israelis are behaving appallingly, but so are Hamas. We all know the endgame is going to be bloody, the question is how bloody. To pretend that the Jews are suddenly Nazis shows little understanding of the history of Israel or Nazism. Nazism was anti democratic, homophobic, and Jews aside, about the destruction or enslavement of all untermenschen, Jew, gay, black, Gypsy or slav. To compare this to Israel is lazy and inaccurate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Mmm. Because German Jews were constantly bombarding Berlin. Look, the Israelis are behaving appallingly, but so are Hamas. We all know the endgame is going to be bloody, the question is how bloody. To pretend that the Jews are suddenly Nazis shows little understanding of the history of Israel or Nazism. Nazism was anti democratic, homophobic, and Jews aside, about the destruction or enslavement of all untermenschen, Jew, gay, black, Gypsy or slav. To compare this to Israel is lazy and inaccurate. Ach he is just setting himself up for a few yoo tube links and some copy and paste from the zionist daily or wherever his other sign in gets it from 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Mmm. Because German Jews were constantly bombarding Berlin. Look, the Israelis are behaving appallingly, but so are Hamas. We all know the endgame is going to be bloody, the question is how bloody. To pretend that the Jews are suddenly Nazis shows little understanding of the history of Israel or Nazism. Nazism was anti democratic, homophobic, and Jews aside, about the destruction or enslavement of all untermenschen, Jew, gay, black, Gypsy or slav. To compare this to Israel is lazy and inaccurate. I have a friend who married an Israeli girl and now lives out in Be'Er Sheva. His neighbours are Arabs and he works alongside another two. In fact, one of them is his direct boss. Oppression all over the shop there! His town is getting hit pretty hard with the rockets right at this moment. He has decided to move north to stay with friends as it is too dangerous now. Incidentally, I just wonder if it was mentioned in any of the news bulletins that a convoy of 80 lorries filled with medical equipment and food supplies drove south from Be'Er Sheva yesterday morning into Gaza. These people are obviously just Nazi scum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Pete Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Right, mods, IP check this clown with the 40 different logins and get him to f**k. Between him, the St Johnstone one with the 40 logins and the Livingston one with the 8,000 logins I'm beginning to worry my ignore list will have more active users than the forum itself. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Incidentally, I just wonder if it was mentioned in any of the news bulletins that a convoy of 80 lorries filled with medical equipment and food supplies drove south from Be'Er Sheva yesterday morning into Gaza. These people are obviously just Nazi scum. Yeah, the people of Gaza should be grateful that the illegal blockade of their country that has led to people have seriously limited calorific intake and may lead to the region becomming uninhabitable in years to come is allowing this aid through. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yeah, the people of Gaza should be grateful that the illegal blockade of their country that has led to people have seriously limited calorific intake and may lead to the region becomming uninhabitable in years to come is allowing this aid through. Why don't they just get all they want off Egypt? Surely they will be only too happy to help their arab brethren out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desert Nomad Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Turkey's Recep Tayyip Edrogan has accused Israel of Ethnic cleansing in Gaza. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinigol Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Turkey's Recep Tayyip Edrogan has accused Israel of Ethnic cleansing in Gaza. That's rich coming from him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Turkey's Recep Tayyip Edrogan has accused Israel of Ethnic cleansing in Gaza. lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Freud Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Turkey's Recep Tayyip Edrogan has accused Israel of Ethnic cleansing in Gaza. IN other news, BNP accuse IDF of racism. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Turkey's Recep Tayyip Edrogan has accused Israel of Ethnic cleansing in Gaza. To jump on the bandwagon, he's got some cheek, hasn't he? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Half Rice Half Chips Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Guys, there's a much more intelligent debate on the complexities and intricacies of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in RangersMedia at the moment……. "Me like Rangers. Me no like Celtic. Celtic like Palestine, so me no like Palestine. Israel no like Palestine neither too, so me like Israel." 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Guys, there's a much more intelligent debate on the complexities and intricacies of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in RangersMedia at the moment……. "Me like Rangers. Me no like Celtic. Celtic like Palestine, so me no like Palestine. Israel no like Palestine neither too, so me like Israel." Should that not be in the Pidgin English Forum? Oh, aye, right enough. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.