banjo player Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Longmuir has already made the following two statements:"We want to support the club as much as possible. A points deduction could still be put in place if the other clubs feel that it is a necessary course of action to take." "But demotion wasn't considered because the prospective buyers of the club have a business plan that involves us bending over and taking it up the jacksie." If the SFL remain determined to save Livi at all costs, I would not be the least bit surprised if they do not even suffer a points deduction never mind automatic relegation. Sorted 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 So now we have the saviours declaring an ultimatum which is a challenge to the authority and integrity of the SFL. Surely now there has to be a very stiff penalty imposed or the SFL has forever lost control of its member clubs who would have licence to dictate whatever they wish when they wish. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 It's surely up to the clubs to decide. I can think of more than a few wanting to see punishment, and a few at the wrong end of this division looking for points deductions. I want Morton's vote to be for the most severe punishment with a level of support. Longmuir wants to avoid the embarassment of a 9 team league, simple. The rest of the leagues should impose a strong punishment. I hope Livi get a hefty points deduction and I'm sure even their most ardent fans must see there is a very strong case for one. Obviously, a large deduction could result in Rankine and McDougall leaving because their business plan would not be feasible in the second division. It appears they have the SFL exactly where they want it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 So now we have the saviours declaring an ultimatum which is a challenge to the authority and integrity of the SFL.Surely now there has to be a very stiff penalty imposed or the SFL has forever lost control of its member clubs who would have licence to dictate whatever they wish when they wish. It doesn't exactly show much commitment to their newly acquired club. You'd like to think the SFL will do the right thing, but I am not at all confident this will happen. I hope I am wrong. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 (edited) Here's the 'truths': 1. Livingston have shown time and time again to be unable to sustain a First Division side without financial mismanangement. 2. McDougall et al are pledging not to financially mismanage the club 3. Their business plan relies upon First Division football. Now, I keep trying to put those three into an order that makes logical sense, but somewhere between First division football and 'no financial mismanagement' it keeps falling apart? Is there something I'm missing in all this? 'Brass neck' springs to mind when dealing with these new chancers. I'd be concerned if I were a Livi fan and they went down anyway this season, no? Edit for typos. Edited July 31, 2009 by vikingTON -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 "But demotion wasn't considered because the prospective buyers of the club have a business plan that involves Livingston being in the First Division." f**k the prospective buyers and their business plan. The SFL has lost any integrity it had remaining. I can't believe they've allowed themselves to submit to the wishes of McDougall and Rankine. Those two must be absolutely pishing themselves at how spineless the SFL really are. I hope the other clubs screw Livingston with a massive points deduction; 15+ perhaps. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 (edited) Heard on the news tonight that Rankine and McDougall will pull out of any deal if a sanction of relegation from the 1st is imposed by the SFA/SFLApologies if this has already been mentioned Livingston won't be deducted any points. This will have been decided at yesterday's meeting. A guy as fly as Rankine won't have allowed something like this to go undiscussed. The SFL will argue that the club are "technically" not in administration so can't really be deducting points even though they are being run by a court appointed interim manager. I'd imagine McGruther's role now will be to get a CVA drawn up sharpish. It's been said by another poster (can't remember who or what page) that this can be done without full administration. McDougall/Rankine/McGruther have played a blinder on this one. They knew they were up against it but also knew the SFL were an organisation absolutely desperate for a solution to this nonsense and this gave them the power to push through their plans. I had a go at guessing what was said in the meeting last night. In my script I forgot to include Rankine telling Brown McMaster that any deal is off if they are relegated. I'd imagine he has also persuaded him to ensure there will be no points deduction. I look forward to the SFL bending over backwards and doing whatever it takes for my club to survive if it ever found itself in the sh*t. PS: Massone's selling of the shares means the rule 21.7 vote is largely irrelevant so I won't be surprised if this vote is suspended until further notice so that "more investigation can be carried out". If it does go ahead, at least clubs can vote knowing they aren't deciding whether a club lives or dies. Edited July 31, 2009 by southview 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Livingston won't be deducted any points... Good post once again. All I will add is that the member clubs still have a vote on this matter and there is still some hope, albeit minimal, that justice can be done. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Sorted 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Longmuir has already made the following two statements:"We want to support the club as much as possible. A points deduction could still be put in place if the other clubs feel that it is a necessary course of action to take." "But demotion wasn't considered because the prospective buyers of the club have a business plan that involves Livingston being in the First Division." If the SFL remain determined to save Livi at all costs, I would not be the least bit surprised if they do not even suffer a points deduction never mind automatic relegation. They really said that? You know, why didn't the "consortium" not just say 'we have a business plan to save the club but it requires automatic entry to the champions league, annual subsidies and a thirty point head start in the league.' 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Well, its up to the other member clubs to step in now. If livi and there new owners are allowed by member clubs get away with this then all the others tar themselves with the same brush. And dont anyone say they cannot be penalised. Livi, if i have read this correctly will be run by the interim manager for the entire season do to mismanagement which is a breach of the rulesn appertaining to penalties that may be imposed. In this case the maybe should be substituted by WILL BE. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Good post once again. All I will add is that the member clubs still have a vote on this matter and there is still some hope, albeit minimal, that justice can be done. There's always a chance but I'd imagine Longmuir et al will advise clubs that deducting points from a club "technically" not in administration would not be the best course of action to take as it would open the gates for any club to be deducted points should they find themselves in a bit of financial bother. They will try and sweeten the pill I reckon by installing a rule which will say if you go into administration, you are deducted 10 or 15 points. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Well, its up to the other member clubs to step in now.If livi and there new owners are allowed by member clubs get away with this then all the others tar themselves with the same brush. And dont anyone say they cannot be penalised. Livi, if i have read this correctly will be run by the interim manager for the entire season do to mismanagement which is a breach of the rulesn appertaining to penalties that may be imposed. In this case the maybe should be substituted by WILL BE. Now that Massone has sold his shares, I'd imagine McGruther's involvement will end once payment plans are agreed with taxman and council and the CVA is drawn up and signed off. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 There's always a chance but I'd imagine Longmuir et al will advise clubs that deducting points from a club "technically" not in administration would not be the best course of action to take as it would open the gates for any club to be deducted points should they find themselves in a bit of financial bother.They will try and sweeten the pill I reckon by installing a rule which will say if you go into administration, you are deducted 10 or 15 points. Livingston are - and will remain for the foreseeable future - in something more than "a bit of financial bother". I can't honestly believe anyone thinks Livingston should avoid a point reduction punishment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 (edited) In one of the interviews was it not stated that Mcgruther would run the club for the first year. Edited July 31, 2009 by Numbers 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SHAKINZ Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Good post once again. All I will add is that the member clubs still have a vote on this matter and there is still some hope, albeit minimal, that justice can be done. zzzz same old stories livi haters zzzzzzzzz 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Livingston are - and will remain for the foreseeable future - in something more than "a bit of financial bother". I can't honestly believe anyone thinks Livingston should avoid a point reduction punishment. I believe Livi should be deducted points. There was a major argument for relegating them right now, but for me that was a less favourable option as Airdrie and Cowdenbeath would have been hugely disadvantaged. Livi are not "technically" in administration/liquidation. I find this staggering to believe but apparently that is the case, despite their complex situation. I don't think clubs will vote to have them deducted points given this information and I reckon Longmuir and his chums will advise accordingly. I also find it hard to believe, rightly or wrongly, that you can draw up a CVA without entering administration but company law and the like is not my strong point. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 zzzz same old stories livi haters zzzzzzzzz I don't actually hate Livi. I actually respect some of your fellow fans who have come on here and been prepared to debate as opposed to just saying "stop f*cking moaning etc..." I just don't see how after all of what has gone on the club do not receive even one sanction whether it be points or otherwise. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry the lion Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 I don't actually hate Livi. I actually respect some of your fellow fans who have come on here and been prepared to debate as opposed to just saying "stop f*cking moaning etc..."I just don't see how after all of what has gone on the club do not receive even one sanction whether it be points or otherwise. if after all the mismangement, in fighting, self destructive over stretching and frankly totally sh!t times we've had, if the worst thing to happen is some points (even quite a few) get deducted, I have no problem with that whatsoever. Over the last few weeks I have felt there would be nothing left of the club and we have all been pretty low, and crabbit. I know there is more to come, but honestly, the almondvale lions are a good bunch of loyal fans, we're down to the core now and it's as important to us as any of your clubs are to you. If nothing happens it will be down to a technicality. Obviously I hope that's the case as we'll need all the help we can get this coming season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southview Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 if after all the mismangement, in fighting, self destructive over stretching and frankly totally sh!t times we've had, if the worst thing to happen is some points (even quite a few) get deducted, I have no problem with that whatsoever. Over the last few weeks I have felt there would be nothing left of the club and we have all been pretty low, and crabbit. I know there is more to come, but honestly, the almondvale lions are a good bunch of loyal fans, we're down to the core now and it's as important to us as any of your clubs are to you.If nothing happens it will be down to a technicality. Obviously I hope that's the case as we'll need all the help we can get this coming season. And for this reason alone I am pleased that your club is still in business. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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