phantoms-livi-lass Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 OK i'm arguing with someone on the Failed appeal thread. Ah! now the penny drops. I wish I had known I could have given you a power of abuse. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampy Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Full time Third Division Ohh, this is just brilliant. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullyWeeBoy Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Glad Livi are in the 3rd but would not like them to go to the wall 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airdrie76 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 I'm almost certain that Livingston's punishment will be overturned at some point, in which case I'm finished with Scottish football. Re. convinced it will be overturned - why??????? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airdrie76 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Aye you must be gutted about staying up for the 2nd season running due to default. I think you'll find we were quite happy being in division 2. That after all is the division our squad was signed to compete in. 37 year old part time pizza franchisers are not good enough for the 1st division! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Aye you must be gutted about staying up for the 2nd season running due to default. I'm not exactly singing from the rooftops about it. If we stay up as a 1st Div club and (as others suggest) we struggle with an (effectively) 2nd Div squad then going to see Airdrie every week will be about as much fun as having fingernails pulled. That's in addition to everything WAAD stated above. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampy Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Aye you must be gutted about staying up for the 2nd season running due to default. On the subject of Airdrie in general, Ballantyne - of whom I am not normally a fan - has conducted himself extremely well throughout this mess, and I don't think that he, Airdrie, or (most of) their fans really have done much, if anything, worthy of criticism here. On the point you made earlier regarding players being on First Division contracts: 1) There is no such thing as a 'First Division contract', there are amateur and professional contracts 2) Even if there was such a thing it would not follow that all players were on it, or that there were not relegation clauses written into it 3) It isn't the mandate of the SFL to ensure that member clubs can break certain rules in order to fulfil their own contractual obligations 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkblue1893 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Glad Livi are in the 3rd but would not like them to go to the wall Don't want them to go the wall either but just won't lose any sleep for their fans that chose to gloat at us with afore mentioned flag. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinheed Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 While not wanting to see the demise of another club after all my own club has previously endured. I for one will not lose any sleep for their tosser fans that brought the Hassan Kachloul flag to Dens at end of last season. Enjoy the third division. Small club now in a small division. Ye get annoyed by a flag? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin_Nevis Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Aye you must be gutted about staying up for the 2nd season running due to default. Try reading the thread back. You'll find most Airdrie fans were looking forward to a season possibly challenging in the 2nd, rather than possibly getting horsed weekly in the First. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantoms-livi-lass Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Don't want them to go the wall either but just won't lose any sleep for their fans that chose to gloat at us with afore mentioned flag. Ignore them they are just silly little boys who think they are big hard men, they will realise the errors of their ways when they grow up or someone gives them a good skelp whichever comes first! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 I'd argue no, because the SFL rules state that they can take whatever action they see fit.I would imagine the rule you quote only applies in cases where, for example, a club (or player) has been fined £20,000 when the maximum punishment set out in the rules is a £10,000 fine. Yes the sfl can take what action they see fit but the purpose of an appeal is to have the the decision looked at again by a higher body and in this case the higher body is the SFA. I think that rule would allow the Sfa to reduce the punishment 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampy Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Yes the sfl can take what action they see fit but the purpose of an appeal is to have the the decision looked at again by a higher body and in this case the higher body is the SFA. I think that rule would allow the Sfa to reduce the punishment How do you interpret that from the rule as written? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 This situation is absolutely shambolic. Why are clubs with no link to the guilty party having their season ruined by the inertia of the governing bodies and the petulance of the Livingston board? The governing bodies are blameless as regards the time issue here... It's Livi who are appealling and scratching games. The SFL and now SFA cannot be blamed for the timescales involved IMO. Hopefully SFA convenes the Appeals Committee extraordinarily, not wait for a schedule meeting. I'm almost certain that Livingston's punishment will be overturned at some point, in which case I'm finished with Scottish football. Re. convinced it will be overturned - why??????? For it to be overturned, the SFA has to do something it has never done in living memory. It has to directly contradict and over-rule a major decision of a member league - despite that member league having complied fully with it's own rules and the SFAs. Understand well what that means in practical terms. It's like Charles I raising his standard at Nottingham, on 22nd August 1642... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Sorry in advance for going over what is obviously well trodden ground, and it's kind of hard to avoid on a thread with as many posts as this, but is it not the case that the punishment only came about when the interim manager of Livingston Football Club advised the SFL management committee that he was unable to guarantee that the Club would be in a position to fulfil its league fixtures for season 2009-2010 and that the punishment is for this as well as being in interim administration.If my understanding of the above is correct then its hardly an excessive punishment, in fact it's downright lenient to allow the Club to remain in the SFL at all as they may not have been able to guarantee completion of any league fixtures regardless of the league that they were in. The management committee therefore, as they stated, gave the Club the best possible chance for surviving while ensuring the integrity of its top division. Hardly excessive. Fair point if that is what the punishment was for. However I wonder how many other clubs in administration have been asked the same question. Probably none because if a club goes into administration during the season there is no way that the punishment would be relegation. The sfl are not going to impose such a penalty half way through a season. So livi coud well argue that their punishment was made more harsh because the timing of going into admin. allowed it to be. Oddly enough WLC were behind the timing. Perhaps if they had waited until the season had started it may have been better for Livingston 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Master Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Yes the sfl can take what action they see fit but the purpose of an appeal is to have the the decision looked at again by a higher body and in this case the higher body is the SFA. I think that rule would allow the Sfa to reduce the punishment The rule that the SFL invoked effectively gives them carte blanche to do what they want with teams that are in breach of it. For the SFA to turn round and say that Livi deserve a lesser punishment would be tantamount to ripping up the SFL rule book and could have serious repercussions for every organisation affiliated with them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Master Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 The governing bodies are blameless as regards the time issue here... It's Livi who are appealling and scratching games. The SFL and now SFA cannot be blamed for the timescales involved IMO.Hopefully SFA convenes the Appeals Committee extraordinarily, not wait for a schedule meeting. For it to be overturned, the SFA has to do something it has never done in living memory. It has to directly contradict and over-rule a major decision of a member league - despite that member league having complied fully with it's own rules and the SFAs. Understand well what that means in practical terms. It's like Charles I raising his standard at Nottingham, on 22nd August 1642... ...or marching into the Commons. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phantoms-livi-lass Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Fair point if that is what the punishment was for. However I wonder how many other clubs in administration have been asked the same question. Probably none because if a club goes into administration during the season there is no way that the punishment would be relegation. The sfl are not going to impose such a penalty half way through a season. So livi coud well argue that their punishment was made more harsh because the timing of going into admin. allowed it to be.Oddly enough WLC were behind the timing. Perhaps if they had waited until the season had started it may have been better for Livingston The council was just the first in a long queue, HMRC were supposed to be starting proceedings two days after the council took action. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
text.surfer2008 Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 The new owners say they want to move the club forward but how can they do that when they are going through these appeals? I mean come on, is this way to bring business in? Refuse to play fixtures and have no income? Great business plan, absolute genius. I would put them in charge of the country's finances! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay Silverheels Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 Un-fucking-believable. Livi fans have learned nothing NOTHING from this whole fiasco. It has been everyone else's incompetence that has led poor Livi to this point. West Lothian must have some mind-altering drugs in the water supply for them to actually believe the pish they are spouting. I genuinely had sympathy for Livi right up until today. Now, I hope the earth opens up and swallows them whole, then seals over again, taking all traces of Almondvale and those fucktards Rankine and McDougall with it. For the sake of putting this into perspective, it may well be prudent to compile an alphabetical list of whose fault Livi fans think this whole sordid clusterfuck is. I'll give a quick A-Z, but there are many, many more missing. Please feel free to add to it as you see fit. Airdrie United Blobby Hunter Cowdenbeath Duncan Freemason Everybodyfuckingelse Flynn GhostofJimMorton HibeeJibee Italians Jim Ballantyne Kenny Black Longmuir Massone Notfuckingus Organized Vote-Fixing Press Corps Quotes Attributed to Longmuir/Ballantyne/Black et al Reality SFL The Sixteen Clubs Who Voted To Uphold The Unfair Penalty On Us Unsympathetic Fans of Other Clubs VikingTON West Lothian Council X-Rays From Outer Space Yoss Zombies 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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