The Famous Aberdeen - Season 2022/23

[lubo_blaha]

The season isn’t necessarily over if we lose on Saturday but I can see a large portion of our support chucking it if we do. The only way we could salvage the season from there would be to go on a good run and get into Europe but I’m becoming less and less convinced that he’s capable of turning it around. If we’re in the bottom six by the split then I could see Cormack pulling the trigger as season ticket renewals will be on the line. Like most, I’d love Glass to succeed but to be lingering at the wrong end of the table with a large budget when at least 4th place is there for the taking isn’t good enough.

[DukDukGoose]

2 minutes ago, coprolite said:

I don't think it's that clear what he's trying to do in the final third. 

If teams sit as deep as they do against you in Scotland you've four options. 

1) Shoot from range

2) play it wide to cross it

3) play long balls over the top

4) play the ball around to find a bit of space once the defence commit.

We go for option 4 but some of the players just aren't good enough to do it. Ojo, for example, usually takes 3 touches to do what a Celtic player will do in one. Hedges was good at making the space but was too one footed and usually shot when he should pass and vice versa.

Glass is not the man for me but I think we'll look back at the good work he started favourably a long time after he's gone. Same as we did with Paw Broon.

 

 

[DukDukGoose]

Just now, IDoNotKnowThisOne said:

He wants to give Ojo a contract.

 

So, clearly glass thinks he is good enough to do it. 
 

Our best chances of scoring are almost always set pieces. 
 

We create very little in the way of clear chances from open play. 

Or he's not publicly announcing the player is finished at the club a few months before the season finishes?

[DukDukGoose]

3 minutes ago, IDoNotKnowThisOne said:

No, he's publicly announcing that he wants to enter talks over a new contract. 
 

If he was finished he'd surely just say nothing? 

He was asked about Ojos contract situation. He said we'll look at it after the window closes.

 

[gudge1903]

Our biggest issue is our new recruitment policy based on stats.  On one hand I'd love us to sack Glass and get a proven and tested guy in but we'd be back usual nonsense of signing guys with injury history or that have failed down south and want to come home.

I've wanted us to follow clubs like Brentford etc for years. Unfortunately for us, Cormack and Glass is this is ground zero. If this experiment is going to work then next season is the time to judge although season tickets etc will take a hit until the evidence starts to show a stats based recruitment is better than McInnes old pals act or asking Shay Logan who he jumped about with in English lower leagues.

Biggest issue regarding this year is how the f*CK we ended up with dumplings like Jumbo JET etc. I think we just hoped a few of these guys would hit it off well enough to keep us in top 3 or 4 in league.

Glass may fail but we can't go back to signing Forresters and Gleesons on big bucks who are absolutely murder. I'm encouraged by Besuijen and if AFC are signing guys like that with pace, tenacity, ability and sell on value then we may just be onto something.

Stats, scouting and exploring new markets that are less expensive than English lower leagues are the future. We need Glass to be a relative success next year to show future prospective managers and coaches that coaching a first team being fed by stats based recruitment is less risky than taking over a more traditional club and their recruitment policy.

It's the hope that kills you but it needs more than a season to judge coaching, new recruitment and all the other crap that goes with itm

 

(I know it looks bad just now but we need to stick it out as the possible benefits are huge for us)

 

[coprolite]

19 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

If teams sit as deep as they do against you in Scotland you've four options. 

1) Shoot from range

2) play it wide to cross it

3) play long balls over the top

4) play the ball around to find a bit of space once the defence commit.

We go for option 4 but some of the players just aren't good enough to do it. Ojo, for example, usually takes 3 touches to do what a Celtic player will do in one. Hedges was good at making the space but was too one footed and usually shot when he should pass and vice versa.

Glass is not the man for me but I think we'll look back at the good work he started favourably a long time after he's gone. Same as we did with Paw Broon.

 

 

It’s not just the players though. 

It might help if i was clearer what i meant. It's not obvious that Glass has any idea how to make his tactics work. 

To break down packed defences by passing around you need some movement. A celtic midfielder 25 yards out will have someone running past him, someone running channels or into space wide, and someone else running across the back line. We'll be lucky to have one of those and will mostly have players static in their starting place. I say mostly, because we can have good movement and did for most of the second half yesterday but it feels like something the players occasionally figure out rather than their instructions. 

[DukDukGoose]

1 hour ago, coprolite said:

It’s not just the players though. 

It might help if i was clearer what i meant. It's not obvious that Glass has any idea how to make his tactics work. 

To break down packed defences by passing around you need some movement. A celtic midfielder 25 yards out will have someone running past him, someone running channels or into space wide, and someone else running across the back line. We'll be lucky to have one of those and will mostly have players static in their starting place. I say mostly, because we can have good movement and did for most of the second half yesterday but it feels like something the players occasionally figure out rather than their instructions. 

I think they managed it yesterday because there's generally more space against a team like Celtic once you beat their press.

One game against Hibs aside, we've been decent to good against the four bigger teams in the league. The teams that will leave gaps. It's no surprise and I've said as such before every game.

The players were coached to play a certain way under the previous manager for years. If you couldn't do it, you were out the door as quickly as you came in. Some of them are still here and probably haven't adapted as well as hoped. 

I know it isn't to everyone's liking, but tactical analysis guys on twitter have been highlighting the differences since The first few games of the Glass era. I just genuinely don't think we have the talent to do it clinically enough to be a success at the moment.

I wouldn't give Glass another season. I do think he'd be a success with some better recruitment though. As @gudge1903 says, I think to be successful at our level we need to go down the stats and analysis route. More Besuijen rather than the eyeball test like JET or who used to be good (May, Maynard etc).

Edit: I should add, I don't feel Glass should continue to try to play in this manner without the personnel, it may work out in the long run though.

Edited February 10, 2022 by Merkland Red

[coprolite]

22 minutes ago, Merkland Red said:

I think they managed it yesterday because there's generally more space against a team like Celtic once you beat their press.

One game against Hibs aside, we've been decent to good against the four bigger teams in the league. The teams that will leave gaps. It's no surprise and I've said as such before every game.

The players were coached to play a certain way under the previous manager for years. If you couldn't do it, you were out the door as quickly as you came in. Some of them are still here and probably haven't adapted as well as hoped. 

I know it isn't to everyone's liking, but tactical analysis guys on twitter have been highlighting the differences since The first few games of the Glass era. I just genuinely don't think we have the talent to do it clinically enough to be a success at the moment.

I wouldn't give Glass another season. I do think he'd be a success with some better recruitment though. As @gudge1903 says, I think to be successful at our level we need to go down the stats and analysis route. More Besuijen rather than the eyeball test like JET or who used to be good (May, Maynard etc).

Edit: I should add, I don't feel Glass should continue to try to play in this manner without the personnel, it may work out in the long run though.

Yes, it should be obvious to a manager that you need to play in a way that your players can actually play. Changing players to fit a system is a long term project and i'd rather we didn't do it in the second tier. 

[big al]

3 hours ago, logie skid boys said:

Well looks like it’s all coming down this next two games win them both and as poor as we’ve been at times were right back in it for the season..

Never mind Ramsey ,Ferguson  etc , if one player I would hate lose its McCrorie.   Been immense at times by far the player year so far for me .always guaranteed to give his all .He is a captain. More like him and we wouldn’t be struggling . So roll on the Weekend ,  Glass will Ken it’s make or break. I’m. Looking forward to it .

Nobody tries as hard as Hayes every single week, regardless of how well he or the team are performing.

Star man these days. 
McCrorie has a great attitude as well and is very likeable, has to learn to pass the ball better though.

[tarapoa]

4 hours ago, lubo_blaha said:

Has anyone ever managed to make it to the end of one of their podcasts by the way? Enjoy listening to them but 3 hours is pretty excessive.

ABZ is a really enjoyable podcast.  I think the presenters are bright lads and good crack, plus their guests have mainly been very interesting.

Now that I need to commute again three days a week I tend to use the drive to and from work to listen and eventually get through it all.

I find that and Here We Go are both very good for dandies chat.  Only 'The Red Line' (geopolitics) compares for Podcasts I will make sure I listen to.

Edited February 10, 2022 by tarapoa

[tarapoa]

2 hours ago, Merkland Red said:

If teams sit as deep as they do against you in Scotland you've four options. 

1) Shoot from range

2) play it wide to cross it

3) play long balls over the top

4) play the ball around to find a bit of space once the defence commit.

We go for option 4 but some of the players just aren't good enough to do it. Ojo, for example, usually takes 3 touches to do what a Celtic player will do in one. Hedges was good at making the space but was too one footed and usually shot when he should pass and vice versa.

Glass is not the man for me but I think we'll look back at the good work he started favourably a long time after he's gone. Same as we did with Paw Broon.

Agree with this - but in this claustrophic league when you play each other so often, teams soon lose the ability to surprise their opponents.

Having the ability, nous and in-game management to vary the strategy against the "low block" $hitfesters should be the way - but in terms of playing the percentages option 4 is probably the worst when there is not the quality of player to execute.

......and this gets back to Matty Longstaff's strange observation that it was long ball stuff here - we've gone from using that too often in the latter days of the previous regime, to seldom doing so anymore.

Edited February 10, 2022 by tarapoa

[DukDukGoose]

16 minutes ago, tarapoa said:

Agree with this - but in this claustrophic league when you play each other so often, teams soon lose the ability to surprise their opponents.

Having the ability, nous and in-game management to vary the strategy against the "low block" $hitfesters should be the way - but in terms of playing the percentages option 4 is probably the worst when there is not the quality of player to execute.

......and this gets back to Matty Longstaff's strange observation that it was long ball stuff here - we've gone from using that too often in the latter days of the previous regime, to seldom doing so anymore.

There needs to be a happy medium somewhere. There was a game under Derek where he said we needed more crosses. Most of us on here despaired, especially when the stats should about 30 odd crosses had been fired in to the opposition box with no success. Could say the same about the current regime.

There was a point last night where we had a throw wide right. 5 or 6 passes later we were genuinely back to Bates with the ball in the left back position. This was at 2-0, early-ish in the second half. I'm not one for lumping crosses in for little reason but the sideways passing didn't get us anywhere either.

[gudge1903]

My point earlier regarding the stats and analysis stuff is that I think we're stuck with Glass until the recruitment fails or is successful. 

Just think for a moment (imagination needed) if (big IF) Glass has us firing on all cylinders with a new and exciting squad maybe breathing down the ugly sisters necks or going for cup glory then a competent manager will jump at the opportunity when it presents itself.

A sustainable and successful recruitment policy is only way to grow season ticket numbers. We can't have future Derek McInnes types losing top performers like McGinn and Hayes and having no idea how to replace or find similar players in our budget. Then kick the can down the road until we can sign the same guys again almost done it with GMS too

If this works (we will know for sure by Christmas) then replacing managers and coaches will be easier. Also, if we have confidence to sign guys like and or better than Besuijen on 4.5 or 5 year deals then we should get robbed less often by bigger clubs than before. We will hold the aces with potential suitors.

Sack Glass now and no one will want to see this experiment through especially the next manager. If this really starts heading in right direction we will get coaches and managers above most Scottish clubs station interested in taking us forward as their will be less risk to them personally and will see us as a potential positive move, heading into Europe with a decent squad has to be the aim, then more cash and kudos will follow.

Need to hold tight for now. It's tough. But there's tougher shit out there (Iost my Mrs last year and I'm bringing my 3 kids up myself so I know more than most about the big bad world ) We'd love a long-term AFC** that we could actually get excited about not just the 3rd is as good as it gets. There's ways for our club to have a serious push at the league every 3 or 4 years if we can buy right, sell right, reinvest right and develope players right.

It can work, let's hope it does. Ignore the auld men that want us back training on beach and full control going from an Alex Ferguson to an Ian f*cking Porterfield to Alex Smith. Yes we have swung more drastically than Calderwood to McGhee to McInnes. I can mind it.

 

(I wanted Glass sacked too but I also want to change how we do stuff, so it's Glass until....well, next season, we need some positivity, hopefully he lays groundwork for future success if he's not up to it himself)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[72redz]

3 hours ago, gudge1903 said:

Our biggest issue is our new recruitment policy based on stats.  On one hand I'd love us to sack Glass and get a proven and tested guy in but we'd be back usual nonsense of signing guys with injury history or that have failed down south and want to come home.

I've wanted us to follow clubs like Brentford etc for years. Unfortunately for us, Cormack and Glass is this is ground zero. If this experiment is going to work then next season is the time to judge although season tickets etc will take a hit until the evidence starts to show a stats based recruitment is better than McInnes old pals act or asking Shay Logan who he jumped about with in English lower leagues.

Biggest issue regarding this year is how the f*CK we ended up with dumplings like Jumbo JET etc. I think we just hoped a few of these guys would hit it off well enough to keep us in top 3 or 4 in league.

Glass may fail but we can't go back to signing Forresters and Gleesons on big bucks who are absolutely murder. I'm encouraged by Besuijen and if AFC are signing guys like that with pace, tenacity, ability and sell on value then we may just be onto something.

Stats, scouting and exploring new markets that are less expensive than English lower leagues are the future. We need Glass to be a relative success next year to show future prospective managers and coaches that coaching a first team being fed by stats based recruitment is less risky than taking over a more traditional club and their recruitment policy.

It's the hope that kills you but it needs more than a season to judge coaching, new recruitment and all the other crap that goes with itm

 

(I know it looks bad just now but we need to stick it out as the possible benefits are huge for us)

 

I agree with a good bit of this. First year was aye gan tae be difficult, nae helped by the ludicrous recruitment aroon the DoF and Head o Recruitment. It’s difficult tae ken fah was behind some of oor signings. But, he needs results tae justify anither season

[Highloon]

I don't think it's that clear what he's trying to do in the final third. 

Totally agree

[scottorae]

I agree with a good bit of this. First year was aye gan tae be difficult, nae helped by the ludicrous recruitment aroon the DoF and Head o Recruitment. It’s difficult tae ken fah was behind some of oor signings. But, he needs results tae justify anither season

As do I.

However, the failure to sort out the defence and stop chucking goals in after 8 months is almost a sackable offence in itself, given the amount of cash spent on them wage wise.

That said, the summer does offer the chance to get rid of Ojo, McGeough and maybe move on some other high earners. If they can get that right, (Besuijen looks like an excellent signing) then it could be really interesting

[Alex_14]

Gudge, firstly sorry to hear about your loss. The AFC brethren are always here for you, genuinely.

Perhaps it’s an old school way of thinking but Glass needs to mould a tactic to the players he’s got first. If they aren’t up to the Glassball attacking vision then he needs to solidify us first, liaise with the head of recruitment and DoF about what he wants to do / how he wants to play, then transition to that.

[HarleyQuinn]

5 minutes ago, scottorae said:

 

As do I.

However, the failure to sort out the defence and stop chucking goals in after 8 months is almost a sackable offence in itself, given the amount of cash spent on them wage wise.

That said, the summer does offer the chance to get rid of Ojo, McGeough and maybe move on some other high earners. If they can get that right, (Besuijen looks like an excellent signing) then it could be really interesting

 

This.

I regard Vicente Besuijen as Mowbray/Gunn's first signing under the new recruitment strategy. It takes 10-12 months to identify the right players for the system Glass is playing. I'm optimistic we'll see a marked improvement in recruitment going forward. This upcoming summer should resolve a lot of the problems we've seen this season. 

[Rodhull]

19 minutes ago, IDoNotKnowThisOne said:

He's going to be good under a better manager. 
 

Players tend not to develop as well in hostile and toxic environments. 
 

I'd like to see Mowbray/Someone competent and familiar with the structure. 

Unless you're itk about something that's gone on behind the scenes is it a hostile/toxic environment?

Just because things are going poorly and morale could be low doesn't necessarily make it either of those things.

[Rodhull]

Just now, IDoNotKnowThisOne said:

I'm talking about fans and their current fury. Players don't tend to develop in hostile atmospheres, knowing every time there's a mistake there'll be groans and moans. I mean there are anyway, but it's exacerbated by the predicament we're in. 
 

I couldn't possibly say it's a hostile or toxic environment from the inside. I have no idea. Dressing rooms that consistently lose generally aren't happy places though, you'd think. When the manager is chucking players under the bus from time to time as well, that can't make the guys feel good. 

 

It might be amazing, who knows? If it is it's not translating on to the pitch. 

 

I'm purely talking the support, who've been sold a crock of shit and been made to swallow it as well. 
 

 

 

If players weren't able to develop because the fans were angry bellends then no Aberdeen player would have developed in my lifetime.

That's not me defending Glass or the current situation in any way but I don't think the fans should be having that much of an effect. Aberdeen fans are always miserable and ready to turn more than most clubs.