bennett Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 I wonder if sugar is involved with the Rangers Football Monitor website? -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
54_and_counting Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 I think this is what Cowan and Cosgrove go on about: for a lot of Celtic and Rangers fans, if you appear critical in any way of one then you must be affiliated with the other. If you fall into neither camp, this false dichotomy appears quite baffling (as it does to me right now). Perhaps I can clarify by saying that Celtic are never in my top 3 dozen SPFL sides; and they are very seldom in my top 40. They make that roster when in Europe and on a few other occasions. BUT even if they were my own team, that would have no effect WHATSOEVER on the gist of what I perceive to be the financial status. How could the former possibly affect the latter? I just can't comprehend optional realities that are dependent on one's wishes: you'd be as well not being an atheist. Back to a non-preferred reality. I've seen an updated estimate that the sale of retained shares could realise 40m x 25p = £10m. Seems about right, and could just about clear existing debts. If I've got the wrong end of the stick then we can expect the accounts to be published nice and early, with no going-concern warning, and perhaps a re-listing on the ISDX as promised (because the main"stopper" there could well be proof of funds - the same criterion as for avoiding the warning in the accounts). So the accounts might be a decent objective gauge of financial health. funny there's been quite a few clubs tits up financially, im waiting on your in depth analysis of them also 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Fitlike Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 funny there's been quite a few clubs tits up financially, im waiting on your in depth analysis of them also I know... Institutionalised cheating, tax dodging, Illegal contracts, corrupt administration process and soon-to-be-in-court aquisition of assets chicanery.... It's All About The 'The Rangers' 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accietilleyedye Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 I wonder if sugar is involved with the Rangers Football Monitor website? I heard they like it in their tea 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugna Posted October 6, 2015 Author Share Posted October 6, 2015 funny there's been quite a few clubs tits up financially, im waiting on your in depth analysis of them also Why on earth would you want to see further analyses when you aren't able to grasp this one, and this one's particularly clear-cut? I think P&Bers traditionally refer to this as "playing the man, not the ball", and it's more generally referred to as an ad-hominem argument. In either case, it's entirely up to the Rangers fans whether they want to challenge those in charge of their club, given the extreme and unsustainable state of the finances. I'm simply pointing out a little of the reality, and musing on the immediate consequences. If survival isn't that important to you, then it probably makes sense to ignore the reality and focus on some sort of conspiracy theory instead. But as with Craig Whyte's takeover, the facts are in the public domain and ignoring them seems a bit strange. At least to me. If it were my own club, in... / looks up map "Clackmannanshire", I would be very concerned and would be trying to do something about it. Like Hearts did. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 (edited) Who is ignoring facts? Has anyone denied that there are financial issues? The Rangers board have been upfront about it. To claim that "reality is being ignored" is silly and the poster in question can't expect to be taken seriously. Spacing edit Edited October 6, 2015 by bennett 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greyman Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 Who is ignoring facts? Has anyone denied that there are financial issues? The Rangers board have been upfront about it. To claim that "reality is being ignored" is silly and the poster in question can't expect to be taken seriously. Spacing edit I haven't laughed so hard since I heard my first fanny fart!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henrik's tongue Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 I haven't laughed so hard since I heard my first fanny fart!!! Did bennett fart? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythstoliveby Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 Has anyone denied that there are financial issues? The Rangers board have been upfront about it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 Densboys found the smiley button... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugna Posted October 6, 2015 Author Share Posted October 6, 2015 I think I may have over-estimated the chances of looking at a very interesting, specific topic without incurring partisan reactions. Probably should have known better. I'm going to try again to get to the basics and avoid taking a side. As things stand, with the information available and not making any assumptions in either direction, it seems to me that Rangers have about enough funds from ST sales to fund them to around the turn of the year. Separately (separating this for convenience), it seems that the un-issued shares might just about pay off existing loans, making those two items a wash. I know that both of those "seems" are liable to some sort of tolerance. But it looks as though there are not enough funds readily available to assure 12 months of operation, and that level of funding will be required at audit time in order to avoid a going-concern warning. Access to new investors through the ISDX is also dependent on that sort of funding projection. It may also depend on an ISDX Corporate Adviser being more willing to engage with DK than the NOMADs who were approached for AIM purposes (assuming that King was telling the truth about that, just to show no anti-King bias, here). So as things stand, I can't understand how Rangers can get to the end of the current season, and since they currently play in our division that's particularly interesting to me. I'm not sure at which point that falls under the remit of the SPFL. I hope that's removed all of the controversial aspects and unnecessary details, and has simply set-out the main issues involved. There's no need to make any of this personal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave.j Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 (edited) I think I may have over-estimated the chances of looking at a very interesting, specific topic without incurring partisan reactions. Probably should have known better. I'm going to try again to get to the basics and avoid taking a side. As things stand, with the information available and not making any assumptions in either direction, it seems to me that Rangers have about enough funds from ST sales to fund them to around the turn of the year. Separately (separating this for convenience), it seems that the un-issued shares might just about pay off existing loans, making those two items a wash. I know that both of those "seems" are liable to some sort of tolerance. But it looks as though there are not enough funds readily available to assure 12 months of operation, and that level of funding will be required at audit time in order to avoid a going-concern warning. Access to new investors through the ISDX is also dependent on that sort of funding projection. It may also depend on an ISDX Corporate Adviser being more willing to engage with DK than the NOMADs who were approached for AIM purposes (assuming that King was telling the truth about that, just to show no anti-King bias, here). So as things stand, I can't understand how Rangers can get to the end of the current season, and since they currently play in our division that's particularly interesting to me. I'm not sure at which point that falls under the remit of the SPFL. I hope that's removed all of the controversial aspects and unnecessary details, and has simply set-out the main issues involved. There's no need to make any of this personal. Dave King already admitted a lot of this, in his, Traditional Rangers press conference. Edited October 6, 2015 by dave.j 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythstoliveby Posted October 6, 2015 Share Posted October 6, 2015 Densboys found the smiley button... Not that - it's just that sometimes you rangers fans have me in hysterics with the head in the sand stuff you come away with! Thanks for that - you're comedy gold (but do go see a psychiatrist if you can.....) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 (edited) I think it's very clear that sugna does not have an agenda and is attempting to open and sustain genuine discussion. It was able to happen when he first opened the thread, but not apparently this time. All it took was for someone to suggest he must support Celtic, before Bennett and Tedi (who should know better) piled in with their own rubbish. It's a pity, but there you go. Edited October 7, 2015 by Monkey Tennis 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythstoliveby Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 I think it's very clear that sugna does not have an agenda and is attempting to open and sustain genuine discussion. It was able to happen when he first opened the thread, but not apparently this time. All it took was for someone to suggest he must support Celtic, before Bennett and Tedi (who should know better) piled in with their own rubbish. It's a pity, but there you go. Yep, it's really pathetic the way rangers (and celtic) fans just jump to the old "He must be one of them..." line whenever someone has a decent pop at their team. When they do that it really shows up their lack of maturity and intelligence.... Sad really 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 I think it's very clear that sugna does not have an agenda and is attempting to open and sustain genuine discussion. It was able to happen when he first opened the thread, but not apparently this time. All it took was for someone to suggest he must support Celtic, before Bennett and Tedi (who should know better) piled in with their own rubbish. It's a pity, but there you go. Sugars posts are very similar to the retoric posted on the Rangers Football monitor website, you know that the Alloa thing is a crock of shite but you'll continue to post that he doesn't have an agenda till the cows come home. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythstoliveby Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Sugars posts are very similar to the retoric posted on the Rangers Football monitor website, you know that the Alloa thing is a crock of shite but you'll continue to post that he doesn't have an agenda till the cows come home. See what I mean 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DA Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Sugars posts are very similar to the retoric posted on the Rangers Football monitor website, you know that the Alloa thing is a crock of shite but you'll continue to post that he doesn't have an agenda till the cows come home. Bennett, how would someone get the message over that The Rangers are financially screwed (in detail) without you calling them wan o' thame? The accounts were released for all to read - you don't need to follow PMG or RFM to be able to interpret them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Fitlike Posted October 7, 2015 Share Posted October 7, 2015 Sugars posts are very similar to the retoric posted on the Rangers Football monitor website, you know that the Alloa thing is a crock of shite but you'll continue to post that he doesn't have an agenda till the cows come home. your posts look very similar to the contents of the lavvy pan after having 3 tins of alphabet soup and a half pint of syrup of figs 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sugna Posted October 7, 2015 Author Share Posted October 7, 2015 (edited) Sugars posts are very similar to the retoric posted on the Rangers Football monitor website, you know that the Alloa thing is a crock of shite but you'll continue to post that he doesn't have an agenda till the cows come home. I don't particularly want to convince you that My Team: Alloa Athletic; but I am curious to know in a Popper-falsifiability sort of way whether there's any evidence that, in principle, could persuade you of that. Is there? I would have thought that I could have taken care of the Celtic thing (as opposed to the non-Alloa thing) with my previous explanation that they rank very close the bottom of my preferred-teams list. It's hard for a non-OFer to understand OF thinking* in this area: for most of the rest of us, expressing such a view about your own team would be unthinkable. So, bennett, that's a genuine question which I'll repeat: is there any evidence that, in principle, could persuade you that I am not a Celtic fan? * Perhaps that's the crux: for the rest of us, to a first approximation, Rangers and Celtic count as one choice. The OFers see their clubs, perhaps, as opposites; but the rest of us see them as a cigarette paper apart, and the opposite of all the other, non-OF teams. Just my conjecture, although it would go some way to explaining why there's this "one of them" thinking that completely baffles non-OFers like me. [edited to spell bennett's name properly] Edited October 7, 2015 by sugna 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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