dubs Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Why are you not patriotic though? I don't think there's any point in pursuing this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 I don't think there's any point in pursuing this. Fair enough 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SeD Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 I don't think there's any point in pursuing this. The question could always been turned round, though - why are people patriotic? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 The question could always been turned round, though - why are people patriotic? It's completely natural to me, and I always (somewhat naively) assumed that everyone was patriotic in some way, but perhaps to different extents; eg. crying when Scotland lose, going home and away for qualifiers, Scotland tattoos... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuart. Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Anyone that cries over any sporting event is a bit of a loser in my opinion. That gives me an idea for a topic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 It's completely natural to me, and I always (somewhat naively) assumed that everyone was patriotic in some way, but perhaps to different extents; eg. crying when Scotland lose, going home and away for qualifiers, Scotland tattoos... I wouldnt go as far as saying i cry when Scotland lose. If they lost a big game i might, i have only came close to tears twice at the fibta, when Queens got beat 1-0 by Stranraer to move 12 points behind and when St Mirren beat us 1-0 in the 93rd minute. i wouldnt get a Scotland tatoo but when i hear folk slagging Scotland off i will back them up to the hilt and i am patriotic enough to hate England. I do go to all Scotland home games and in future hope to go to all away. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SeD Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 I wouldnt go as far as saying i cry when Scotland lose. If they lost a big game i might, i have only came close to tears twice at the fibta, when Queens got beat 1-0 by Stranraer to move 12 points behind and when St Mirren beat us 1-0 in the 93rd minute. i wouldnt get a Scotland tatoo but when i hear folk slagging Scotland off i will back them up to the hilt and i am patriotic enough to hate England. I do go to all Scotland home games and in future hope to go to all away. Surely patriotism shouldn't involve an opinion on another country? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Surely patriotism shouldn't involve an opinion on another country? Its a tradition. Scotland have always hated the "auld enemy" 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SeD Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Its a tradition. Scotland have always hated the "auld enemy" So, without the English to hate, you would lose some of your Scottishness? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 So, without the English to hate, you would lose some of your Scottishness? I suppose so 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 For me it's more a dislike of the media fanfare and fans' arrogance than the actual players. If the England players all played for anyone else I wouldn't mind them winning it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 For me it's more a dislike of the media fanfare and fans' arrogance than the actual players. If the England players all played for anyone else I wouldn't mind them winning it. Same but not all the players are saints. Rooney TO ME comes across as a cocky wee so and so 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 I wouldnt go as far as saying i cry when Scotland lose. If they lost a big game i might, i have only came close to tears twice at the fibta, when Queens got beat 1-0 by Stranraer to move 12 points behind and when St Mirren beat us 1-0 in the 93rd minute. i wouldnt get a Scotland tatoo but when i hear folk slagging Scotland off i will back them up to the hilt and i am patriotic enough to hate England. I do go to all Scotland home games and in future hope to go to all away. Oh dear, he's off again. I predict another 4 or 5 pages! Twynholm, if you want to be patriotic that's fine. But there's nothing patriotic about "hating" anyone. That's just bigotry. It's not the same thing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neiljb Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 So, without the English to hate, you would lose some of your Scottishness? No, it's just part of the fun of being Scottish. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Oh dear, he's off again. I predict another 4 or 5 pages! Twynholm, if you want to be patriotic that's fine. But there's nothing patriotic about "hating" anyone. That's just bigotry. It's not the same thing. So i am a bigot because i hate England 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David W Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 So i am a bigot because i hate England Bloody hell. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codfish Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 You cant compare clay and grass court tennis. Its like two different sports. I'd pick Nadal to beat Federer every day of the week on a clay court, but Id give you 100/1 that he beats him at Wimbledon. Murray has an outside shot of the final. He has no chance whatsoever of beating Federer on grass at this stage of his career and probably knows this. Played very well against Roddick, but Roddick really needs to go away and have a major rethink. Outside the top 10 in the world now and can only see things getting worse for him. I also agree with Sam that Murray is a Brit at Wimbledon. That is the country he represents, as you will see if you look on the Wimbledon site and see Murray (GBR). I think the commentators are very fair with the amount of times they mention he is a Scot. I cant believe how precious people get about that to be honest. I know it's a completely different style of tennis, and that's why I said that Fed is probably the best grass court player I've ever seen. The reason I pointed out his clay record was that although it's not his strongest surface, he still looks really strong up to that point where Nadal arrives on court to play against him - for a guy like Federer, any sign of weakness on any point of his game is a nice thing to be able to point out He's not had much luck with the draw this year. Getting a seed in the first round was unfortunate but given that he was a clay specialist not a problem. But getting into the same quarter of the draw as Roddick and Hewitt, probably the best two grass players other than Federer was damned unfortunate and both are better players on the surface than Nadal and Nalbandian whose quarters would have been an easier chance to reach last four. To have beaten Roddick on grass is remarkable. To have done so in the manner he did and without Roddick playing at all badly was incredible. Easily the best I've seen Murray play. It would be a shame if he then blew it against Bhagdatis. Yeah, draw-wise it's been pretty unfortunate, but you've got to face the very best at some point. It's quite strange that up against two of these top grass players, Murray has the upper hand in the head-to-head (he definitely did against Roddick, and I'm not sure if he's faced Hewitt anywhere other than San Jose). I disagree and I think whatever the official name is of the British tennis body will disagree too since they help fund Andy Murray! Murray seems to have been lucky in that his family have backed him well but a lot of guys (maybe not especially in Britain) wouldn't have a chance without funding from their national associations so I would say they do represent their country at every tournament they play in. Look at Peter Nicol, he has to represent a foreign country because of the lack of funding Sport Scotland were giving him. Also disagree with Codfish - Andy Murray represents Great Britain. As for Murray I think Codfish is probably half right. First and foremost he is out there doing it for Andy Murray. But he is also representing GBR as our number two tennis player(I think) and he is also proud to be Scottish. Its not that complex really is it? As for the BBC I think they have been tremendously fair with the Scottish thing and its probably mainly because Murray himself wants to be seen as Scottish. They have been pretty respectful of that IMHO. The way I see it, in an individual sport you represent yourself first and foremost, not your country, or a national association. Some exceptions to that, like in the Olympics when there's a medal table to "compete" on, but IMO at events like Wimbledon, or in the Open Championships, or in an IAAF Grand Prix athletics meeting, the country you're representing isn't particularly important. I'd agree about the BBC for the most part as well, although they probably find it difficult to forget that the kid's Scottish when he opens his mouth and puts everyone to sleep 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Twynholm Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 Who does Murray play and when? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codfish Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 (edited) Who does Murray play and when? He plays Marcos Baghdatis on Centre Court on Monday afternoon. He's on second, after a mouthwatering clash between Justine Henin-Hardenne and Daniela Hantuchova Incidentally, he also plays in the mixed doubles with Kirsten Flipkens on Monday afternoon - that match is fourth on Court 2 Edited July 2, 2006 by codfish 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuart. Posted July 2, 2006 Share Posted July 2, 2006 So i am a bigot because i hate England Of course you are. What if I said I hated France, or Jews, or Black people? That is bigotted as is saying you hate an entire country. Do you understand? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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