Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Self-raising Lazarus]

Has this become the sportsound thread? 

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

5 hours ago, thisGRAEME said:

Actually agree with this, tbh. Having a fucking omnipotent all seeing eye wading into games willy-nilly is somehow even worse. Referees actually dealing with the players throughout the game should be making the ultimate decision. 

Whilst theoretically I may agree with you, if the on field ref is agreeing with the omnipotent in well over 99% of cases, isn't the time spent making the decision more of a drain on the game than who is making it?

[Jastons6]

1 minute ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Whilst theoretically I may agree with you, if the on field ref is agreeing with the omnipotent in well over 99% of cases, isn't the time spent making the decision more of a drain on the game than who is making it?

The 'authorities' did us dirty when they said 'clear and obvious' . Clear and obvious doesn't suggest a 5 minute wait before a questionable decision is made.  

[Swello]

18 minutes ago, Self-raising Lazarus said:

Has this become the sportsound thread? 

Another reason that I hate VAR - international breaks on this thread was just a week of Lionel Ainsworth goals and now we talk about VAR.

[StAndrew7]

18 hours ago, MurrayWell said:

The conclusion I've come to in recent months is the referees in Scotland are either drastically under qualified or they are determined to be the main characters in the Scottish game, going out of their way to chop off goals and make sure everyone knows they are in charge. Best referees are the ones you don't really notice. The experience as a fan at the moment has absolutely been damaged and it lies at the door of those running the game, they'll likely never change their attitude.

Can't say I ever watched a game with this lad in charge when I didn't notice him... 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

43 minutes ago, Jastons6 said:

I understood that VAR checks every goal in every game. The game you mentioned is the norm.

Aye I meant checks that delayed the game and got announced over the tannoy. For now that still doesn't happen for most goals.

[StAndrew7]

2 hours ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

I mean I'd be happy to do away with VAR generally and just let the referee decide on the pitch. But in this Challenge system I devised ten minutes ago I'd still just let the referee be God and whatever he decides is "right" and if you lose a YassinChallenge then tough shit.

They have something similar in the NHL; each team gets a coach's challenge that they can use for goals and other dodgy decisions (tight offsides, interference etc.). Granted, it's much easier for the referees there to miss things because of the speed, puck etc. but when the team is wrong, they're automatically assessed a penalty and the other team gets a man advantage for 2 minutes (if it gets it wrong again it doubles to 4 minutes).

The issue is there would be no way to impose consequences in a football match which would inevitably waste time, other than adding on extra time I guess.

[CoF]

32 minutes ago, Swello said:

Another reason that I hate VAR - international breaks on this thread was just a week of Lionel Ainsworth goals and now we talk about VAR.

I’ll start - 

 

 

 

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

 

Edited March 21 by Jim McLean's Ghost

[capt_oats]

Bring him home.

Also...if we're revisiting traditional international break topics this hits a bit different now that we've battered them in the league.

[ropy]

The thing that actually annoys me most about VAR is that the ref makes no attempt to move towards the TV when a check is underway.  On Saturday Collum stood on the other touchline for the last minute decision.  It makes their charade of a TV sign more dramatic but lengthens the time for them to start their own review if required.

There would be more acceptance of the decisions and the delays if there was consistency, a hand ball in one game is play on in another, a goal awarded for Ross County is a goal denied to Motherwell.  If the decisions were consistent people would accept that taking the time to get there was required.

[Swello]

 

[SIWY86]

One of my all time favourite players in a Well shirt, for goals like this one:

 

[well fan for life]

 

No tap ins. Only belters. The Human Highlight Reel. 

Edited March 21 by well fan for life

[Cloontang]

 

[capt_oats]

5 hours ago, Swello said:

Technology to help with objective decisions (ie - goal line tech or offside) is completely fine - but we now know that having multiple people using technology for subjective decisions makes things actively worse - the assumptions around what VAR would be useful for were completely flawed from the outset and the promises about how it would be used (clear and obvious) were naïve or dishonest.

And for what it's worth, I think the offside rule is miles better than it was. The idea of interfering with play can still be subjective of course but it's *so* much better than the older, much stricter interpretation of the rule. Handball has been fucked beyond all recognition - but a lot of the changes over the past couple of decades have been pretty positive I think.

I want VAR gone - but if there was a compromise proposal to massively pare it back so that it was only used for obvious stuff and with strict time limits, I could probably live with it.

This is kind of it for me. It's very much a case of the genie being out of the bottle so it seems unlikely that it'll be binned however it's be a sensible step for there to be a genuine discussion about why VAR has been as much of a shitshow (even though anyone who had been paying attention could see it coming).

That said, while I don't have much sympathy for the clubs - as I've said it's a Leopards Eating People's Faces Party situation where it seems actual adults seemed to think it wouldn't affect them and we'd just be levelling out the decisions that were going against them - but I think it's probably fair to say that what they're getting isn't what was pitched to them. Naive as the expectations of what they'd get might have been.

For me, as @Busta Nut and others have said the one thing that VAR is actually good for is offside specifically because it's a binary choice.

In which case narrowing the scope of VAR feels like a logical step.

Leave it for these Yes/No decisions eg: is someone offside or not, is a ball in or out, was a foul inside/outside the area and leave the on field ref to officiate the game as they see fit without having someone in their ear second guessing decisions.

Edited March 21 by capt_oats

[Swello]

11 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

 

No tap ins. Only belters. The Human Highlight Reel. 

Someone usually pops up - probably a VAR supporter - and says "Ah - but he only did that once every couple of months, he was lazy"

 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

I'm terrible at avoiding the score to watch a game back later but the one time I've managed it without caving is the 2-2 game at Tannadice where Lionel scored the best goal of all time (on his debut?). One of the most mental things I've ever seen.

[Swello]

18 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

I'm terrible at avoiding the score to watch a game back later but the one time I've managed it without caving is the 2-2 game at Tannadice where Lionel scored the best goal of all time (on his debut?). One of the most mental things I've ever seen.

With that goal, Higdon's and Humphrey's - we've probably seen better goals at Tannadice than a lot of United supporters.

[ropy]

To take the delays out the game, the players should just get on with it then the refs can tell them the score on the Monday morning once they have had a good look back over all the incidents.