Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[rowsdower]

The WS is the owner. Why is this hard for people to grasp?

[Swello]

7 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

The WS is the owner. Why is this hard for people to grasp?

It's not "can't grasp", it's "don't want to grasp" - I think the Barmack stuff is the first time that the previous board had to fully confront the reality of majority fan ownership - and given their conduct, they didn't like it at all. 

[Desp]

I'm actually awright with us leaving Fir Park.  If we can plant a new stadium just next to where the college sits just now, that would be close enough to actual Motherwell for me.  Could still get a few pints in the New Century before walking up through the new road they're building to the new stadium.

[Handsome_Devil]

11 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

The WS is the owner. Why is this hard for people to grasp?

 

Just now, Swello said:

It's not "can't grasp", it's "don't want to grasp" - I think the Barmack stuff is the first time that the previous board had to fully confront the reality of majority fan ownership - and given their conduct, they didn't like it at all. 

Certainly true of the board but of the broader support, I suspect it's because the WS never acted like owners.

As ever, this is not to be massively critical - there's no point in reviewing every decision with hindsight, a fairly passive 'owner' was what virtually everyone agreed was the path to take.

Where it went wrong was the 'Alan will do it' era which while logical basically saw all pretence at good governance vanish. Which matters not at all when things are going well and suddenly matters hugely when they're not.

There's now a tonne of catch up to be done - the work of the governance stream, for example, is probably one of the least exciting topics around the club and of true interest to only a handful of geeks like me but is absolutely essential.

I wish the Society hadn't been quite as concrete in promising a strategic partner by October, that always seemed bold and I suspect it'll turn into a stick to hit them with. But ultimately the same facts apply as during the takeover bid - we're in an excellent financial position which means time can be taken to do things right. There will be whining and sniping while this happens, it just has to be ignored.

[Neil86]

33 minutes ago, Vietnam91 said:

We’re certainly getting to a fork in the road where a definitive decision is needed wither we make the best of Fir Park we can or move. Whatever it is, we then have to back it 100%.

It’s the most emotive of all subjects for a supporter of any team, where your home is and it’s a discussion driven by the full WS membership.

If it’s something new, then Ravenscraig offers the only way we have to continue to stay within the boundary of the town but the land needed may need to be secured before it becomes unavailable.

I produced something for the WS to consider recently and I’ll share it on here if there’s interest.

interest 

[StAndrew7]

10 minutes ago, Handsome_Devil said:

I wish the Society hadn't been quite as concrete in promising a strategic partner by October, that always seemed bold and I suspect it'll turn into a stick to hit them with. But ultimately the same facts apply as during the takeover bid - we're in an excellent financial position which means time can be taken to do things right. There will be whining and sniping while this happens, it just has to be ignored.

Aye, that was the one bit of the strategic plan that worried me; putting dates/timescales on something as complicated and nuanced can quickly open up the inevitable banging of the drum about broken promises etc.

[Swello]

6 minutes ago, Desp said:

I'm actually awright with us leaving Fir Park.  If we can plant a new stadium just next to where the college sits just now, that would be close enough to actual Motherwell for me.  Could still get a few pints in the New Century before walking up through the new road they're building to the new stadium.

I think if they put "both" options (there might be more than 2) out there - ie - what's achievable at Fir Park and what's achievable at a brown field site with the money we can get access to, it would be a really close run thing - as I don't think either option will be as appealing as folk think they would be.

I doubt we could fundamentally "fix" Fir Park as we don't have the cash that Hearts or Hibs did to redevelop an old ground in a pretty tight location - and I doubt we could afford the sort of new build that folk won't call "lego" and compare to St Mirren's ground. 

Dundee and Aberdeen have both put nice concepts out there recently but when you look at the costs involved in those, that type of thing is simply not for us unless we get (an actually rich) benefactor to build us one.

Also - don't launch any consultation after a cup quarter final win as everyone will choose Fir Park.

[thisGRAEME]

25 minutes ago, Desp said:

I'm actually awright with us leaving Fir Park.  If we can plant a new stadium just next to where the college sits just now, that would be close enough to actual Motherwell for me.  Could still get a few pints in the New Century before walking up through the new road they're building to the new stadium.

Stick it behind the college and stick a big spooky tunnel from Orbiston street under the railway line to get there please.

Honestly, I'm just not sure I see it as feasible for us. I appreciate that Fir Park is a 'cost', but that cost will never be such a colossal up front one that a new stadium would. I would also have it as a bit of a wrench to do it as well, as we sit bang within the community we're part of. 

St. Mirren got the deal of the century, and it was absolutely the right thing to do, and it certainly is a nice place to play and watch football at. I've absolutely no idea the practical concerns of it, but a re-developed over however many decades Fir Park would be immediately my preference. Leave the Cooper and the South, cantilever the east and re-build the steps, and start again with the main?

[YassinMoutaouakil]

I only know the bit of Motherwell that's between Brandon Parade and Fir Park so I'm quite excited to see how badly I'll get lost the first time I try and go to New Fir Park wherever it ends up. 

Edited 46 minutes ago by YassinMoutaouakil

[mcfadden22]

Cant believe an unknown from the bench at West Ham is in the Scotland squad ahead of Lennon Miller

[tamthebam]

Just now, mcfadden22 said:

Cant believe an unknown from the bench at West Ham is in the Scotland squad ahead of Lennon Miller

I was saying the same sort of thing at lunchtime. There is a pecking order regarding international caps

play for rangers/celtic/no mark english also rans/abroad: cap guaranteed

play for aberdeen/hearts/hibs at a push: possible cap if Scotland are desperate for bodies

play for everyone else: you're joking! you could score 60 a season but play for Motherwell rather than sit on Celtic's bench each week... 

 

[Alanos]

I’d happily move to a new purpose built stadium with top notch facilities etc.

[StAndrew7]

13 minutes ago, thisGRAEME said:

Leave the Cooper and the South, cantilever the east and re-build the steps, and start again with the main?

I'd maybe take some of the South Stand top tier away, if it's possible. Would save a fair bit on winter pitch maintenance with it blocking out the sun so much. Or re-clad it in the light up shit from the Hydro for a giggle so sunlight still gets in.

[Feet in the Wishing Well]

The move away from Fir Park would be such a huge risk for the club.

If you look at our support it's hardly full of spring chickens. I'd worry we'd lose a huge chunk of our support if they had to go elsewhere.

[thisGRAEME]

10 minutes ago, tamthebam said:

I was saying the same sort of thing at lunchtime. There is a pecking order regarding international caps

play for rangers/celtic/no mark english also rans/abroad: cap guaranteed

play for aberdeen/hearts/hibs at a push: possible cap if Scotland are desperate for bodies

play for everyone else: you're joking! you could score 60 a season but play for Motherwell rather than sit on Celtic's bench each week... 

I mean, it's a million percent (as last time) because the U21's have a chance of qualification for their EUROs, IMO. 

Whether I care about that in the slightest is kind of a different question, and I do think that Miller would benefit more from training at a full international level than playing at Under-21. That said, this is actually a good U-21 group, with a collection who look like they'll make it. 

5 minutes ago, StAndrew7 said:

I'd maybe take some of the South Stand top tier away, if it's possible. Would save a fair bit on winter pitch maintenance with it blocking out the sun so much. Or re-clad it in the light up shit from the Hydro for a giggle so sunlight still gets in.

Basically turning the roof into a see-thru death ray on the 4 days of sun a year is a good idea IMO.

[StAndrew7]

2 minutes ago, thisGRAEME said:

Basically turning the roof into a see-thru death ray on the 4 days of sun a year is a good idea IMO.

Douglas Dickie's parting gift:

[Handsome_Devil]

8 minutes ago, Alanos said:

I’d happily move to a new purpose built stadium with top notch facilities etc.

I think the vast majority would agree but the numbers behind such a project are eye-watering and the risk to the club, throughout the entire project, isn't a kick in the arse off existential.

Properly costed renovations of FP - over decades if needed - are a must as comparison.

[StAndrew7]

Just now, Handsome_Devil said:

I think the vast majority would agree but the numbers behind such a project are eye-watering and the risk to the club, throughout the entire project, isn't a kick in the arse off existential.

Properly costed renovations of FP - over decades if needed - are a must as comparison.

Aye, a new flat pack stadium of 8-10k capacity will start at about £60-80m without even thinking about it. That's a lot of fundraising or sponsorship deals needed, because you won't get anywhere near that for the sale of the ground FP is on despite it being prime residential real-estate.

There will (very soon, like within the next 2-5 years) be a situation where we're going to have to accept that naming rights and other deals like that are going to be required to make sure Fir Park remains safe and is renovated.

Or we'll sell Lennon for £100m to Barcelona and build a stadium in his honour.

[standupforthemotherwell]

I'm not sure there's much that can be done with Fir park given the constraints around it. I doubt we'll ever manage a full length stand to replace the Main Stand and at the other side, the East is also tightly hemmed in. The best we could do is probably buy Knowetop from the council, build a new Main Stand at that side with all the administrative facilities, changing rooms etc then a basic East stand-esque structure to replace the main.

This would cost an absolute fortune and you're still left with the end stands which are now 30 years old.

I think we would basically need some kind of joint investment from somewhere. What about going halfers with NLC and including a new concert hall under a stand?

[Neil86]

In terms of Fir park, Main stand the main money pit? is a new main stand out the question?

are the Cooper and South stand okay for now?

assume the East as well? with the amount of Money that's been spent on it. Obviously all three will require the usual maintenance.