Granny Danger Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 25 minutes ago, Cream Cheese said: I don't think Corbyn is being rejected by the electorate. I think the party infighting is being rejected. The PLP are doing a grand job keeping a true Labour Party away from power and keeping the Conservatives in place until such times in which Labour out Conservative them. If it wasn't for the infighting being generated by the PLP then Labour wouldn't be doing nearly as bad as they are. That's a very valid point, Labour were previously doing better in the polls than they have since the PLP decided to start attacking Corbyn. It's impossible to say how well or badly they would be doing if the PLP were attacking the Tories with the same vigour as when attacking their own leader. The anti-Corbynists in the Party have created the infighting and are trying to blame Corbyn for the effects of this infighting on public opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 2 hours ago, Fide said: I take it the mumbleclown is Corbyn? I'm not a supporter of his as I'm not a Labour member or voter, but he is the democratically elected leader of their party and I think he's been treated disgracefully by some of his colleagues. I would therefore like every careerist chicken couper Labour MP and their supporters to therefore be fucked over for being spineless backstabbing twats. You quite clearly are a supporter. If Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage got knifed by his other members of their party (and Johnson looked finished for a week there), there would have been absolutely no candlelit vigil from you on their behalf. There is for Corbyn: because you're confirmed 'Laebur left me' roaster, desperate to bring back a party you can vote for. Like the one that got an absolute shoeing in 1983 because, yeah, the Labour left can't actually win the support of the electorate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cream Cheese Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 7 minutes ago, vikingTON said: You quite clearly are a supporter. If Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage got knifed by his other members of their party (and Johnson looked finished for a week there), there would have been absolutely no candlelit vigil from you on their behalf. There is for Corbyn: because you're confirmed 'Laebur left me' roaster, desperate to bring back a party you can vote for. Like the one that got an absolute shoeing in 1983 because, yeah, the Labour left can't actually win the support of the electorate. You can respect somebody in politics without giving them your backing. For example. Plenty of unionists secretly admire Nicola Sturgeon, but their shitebaggery will never allow them to support her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I know it's a bit like choosing to jump out a window or off a cliff but which route will actually be more damaging for Labour? Because that's the one I'd like to see happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 36 minutes ago, Granny Danger said: That's a very valid point, Labour were previously doing better in the polls than they have since the PLP decided to start attacking Corbyn. It's impossible to say how well or badly they would be doing if the PLP were attacking the Tories with the same vigour as when attacking their own leader. The anti-Corbynists in the Party have created the infighting and are trying to blame Corbyn for the effects of this infighting on public opinion. Erm no, that is utter bollocks: http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-2 Between November 2015 and February 2016 for example, the Tories led every single poll beyond the margin of error, with a lead between four and fifteen points: a median for that period looks to be around a nine point lead. Labour have led three - three - of what appears to be at least 100 polls conducted between September 2015, when Corbyn became leader and now. All three of which, btw, Labour led within the margin of error, and because the Conservative vote polled in the low 30s: a statistical outlier against the overwhelming amount of polls that put their support throughout that period at 35% or so. The evidence does not show that Corbyn is doing any worse now than he was before, but it also does not show that the PLP is having any impact on Labour's polls. They were flatlining before Corbyn took over but it's clear that he has made no progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cream Cheese Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 2 minutes ago, vikingTON said: but it's clear that he has made no progress. I wonder what is stopping him from making any progress..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I wonder what is stopping him from making any progress..... His competency and the fact he is unpopular. The PLP are hardly helping, but it's utter delusion to think he's got nothing to do with the lack of progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 39 minutes ago, vikingTON said: You quite clearly are a supporter. If Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage got knifed by his other members of their party (and Johnson looked finished for a week there), there would have been absolutely no candlelit vigil from you on their behalf. There is for Corbyn: because you're confirmed 'Laebur left me' roaster, desperate to bring back a party you can vote for. Like the one that got an absolute shoeing in 1983 because, yeah, the Labour left can't actually win the support of the electorate. I think everyone who isn't a Tory would quite like an effective opposition in Westminster. Otherwise, what's to stop them? Seeing Labour MPs attacking their own leader whilst not lifting a finger in anger against the Tories does tend to ruffles ones feathers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 15 minutes ago, BerwickMad said: His competency and the fact he is unpopular. The PLP are hardly helping, but it's utter delusion to think he's got nothing to do with the lack of progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 :lol: From my experience, his supporters love him, but outside of those people, he's seen as a joke. All of the polling and popularity ratings would back this up. As would the people I have spoken to going door to door campaigning for Labour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 UK public // On who would make the best Labour leader:J. Corbyn: 43%O. Smith: 57%(via BMG / 22 - 26 Jul) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arsenal till I die Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Hung Parliaments is the elephant in Labour's room. The Scottish stuff last year was an excuse - they were boasting about talks with the Lib Dems breaking down in 2010. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 23 minutes ago, BerwickMad said: UK public // On who would make the best Labour leader: J. Corbyn: 43% O. Smith: 57% (via BMG / 22 - 26 Jul) That poll surprises me only in as much as a 7% swing would make them even. I would have thought the vilification campaign against Corbyn orchestrated by the Labour careerists, supported by pretend socialist members and given massive publicity by the MSM would have had an even more detrimental effect on Jeremy Corbyn. The fact that most folk take no more than a passing interest in politics suggests the PLP detractors have not been nearly as succesful in their campaign as they would have hoped. I can't wait to see Corbyn winning again and the tears and spotters from these odious time-serving cretins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Did someone post a New Statesman article written by Martin Robbins? lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 That poll surprises me only in as much as a 7% swing would make them even. I would have thought the vilification campaign against Corbyn orchestrated by the Labour careerists, supported by pretend socialist members and given massive publicity by the MSM would have had an even more detrimental effect on Jeremy Corbyn. The fact that most folk take no more than a passing interest in politics suggests the PLP detractors have not been nearly as succesful in their campaign as they would have hoped. I can't wait to see Corbyn winning again and the tears and spotters from these odious time-serving cretins. Two weeks ago barely anyone had heard of Owen Smith. It's terrible for Corbyn imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmothecat Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I do wonder, if a year ago, someone told me that I would be volunteering to help Owen Smith become leader of the Labour Party how I would have reacted. Yet here we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 You quite clearly are a supporter. If Boris Johnson or Nigel Farage got knifed by his other members of their party (and Johnson looked finished for a week there), there would have been absolutely no candlelit vigil from you on their behalf. There is for Corbyn: because you're confirmed 'Laebur left me' roaster, desperate to bring back a party you can vote for. Like the one that got an absolute shoeing in 1983 because, yeah, the Labour left can't actually win the support of the electorate. 1983 was a very long time ago. I think it's about time the electorate got a genuine left wing alternative government option. Unfortunately it's right wing p***ks like you, in the labour party, that are desperate to avoid this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 2 hours ago, BerwickMad said: Two weeks ago barely anyone had heard of Owen Smith. It's terrible for Corbyn imo. Sure it is, tiger. Sure it is. 28 minutes ago, jmothecat said: I do wonder, if a year ago, someone told me that I would be volunteering to help Owen Smith become leader of the Labour Party how I would have reacted. Yet here we are. I'd have thought it more likely you'd be leafleting for Ruth Davidson, if I'm honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I think everyone who isn't a Tory would quite like an effective opposition in Westminster. Otherwise, what's to stop them? Seeing Labour MPs attacking their own leader whilst not lifting a finger in anger against the Tories does tend to ruffles ones feathers. An effective opposition at Westminster doesn't involve the mumbleclown. Not that anyone should care anyway, as Westminster's deficiencies only hammer home the case for Scottish independence. Unless you're a "Laebur left me" roaster like yourself, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 1983 was a very long time ago. I think it's about time the electorate got a genuine left wing alternative government option. Unfortunately it's right wing p***ks like you, in the labour party, that are desperate to avoid this. I'm not in the Labour Party, chump, and look forward to their inevitable death as a rump outfit. Which is coming regardless of which way they choose to get roundly fucked in the next election.Ultimately it's people like me, easily capable of grasping basic, literally undergraduate psephology, who can state with facts that a left-wing Labour party cannot win a general election. Not a single scrap of evidence based on the actual UK electorate supports your delusional, fanboy claims. Gutted for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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