Junior Pub League Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 46 minutes ago, sweep said: I have been against this from day one. What have I said all along ?and all I got was people disagreeing. It was NEVER going to happen under this proposal. Think junior Think leave behind a dying level of football where, as Clydebank have indicated, the Chief Executive has just lied to the SFA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
not man of the match Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 What a shock.Said nobody. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glensmad Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 TJ opposed WoSFL as expected saying none of his members were interested in moving to a senior league.He said what ? [emoji44]That's astonishing if true. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Wonder where the lurker is now? You think he turned right at Albuquerque? Contender for this year's "Done Deal"? [emoji23] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 You don't think the man would do that, really? He entered into this to keep what he had, he has misinformed and misled all his membership throughout the process. Junior clubs need to wake up to the truth that is literally staring them in the face.He said what ? [emoji44]That's astonishing if true. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 5 minutes ago, glensmad said: He said what ? That's astonishing if true. Quote TJ said that the requirement for a club license might focus the attention of some SJFA clubs. However he pointed out that there would be some clubs who would never be interested in promotion. Quote GF asked TJ if there was any feedback from SJFA clubs on the floodlight issue. TJ stated there was none at all. He said that the SJFA clubs have always known they would need floodlights to progress. Quote TJ said that the SJFA has Tayside and West Lothian clubs and he would not be willing to tell them that they had to join the EOS FA to progress. Quote TJ said that the matter had already been agreed by the Scottish FA Board and that AR and JG were going over old ground. The decision has been made at Scottish FA Board level and it has to be agreed how it will work. It cannot be changed or challenged at this stage. A selection of quotes from the Nov 2018 and Jan 2019 PWG minutes. Why would you be astonished when he says whatever he wants. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 TJ can’t speak for every member club. Bet he thought no-one would go senior in 2016, and that definitely nobody other than the mad mob from fife would follow. as long as he remains in a job the juniors will be outside the pyramid, he will always prioritize his little kingdom over the good of his members. The only action now is for a WoS(or LL2) league to get set up. question is who has the energy to do it?. The other league bodies seem happy to support but unlikely to be the driving force, and the sfa largely don’t care enough. Somebody is going to need to come forward and risk the theats of the SJFA. It’s probably considered too risky for one club, but 4 or 5 with LL help will succeed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz5 Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 I think the LL2 right now is too messy to solve the problem of a proper West feeder right now. You have to run with the idea of a WoSFL since LL and EoS have shown previous support for setting one up. I'm not sure how the likes of the Matt Bamford can continue long term as President of the West Region while representing a club that wishes to move senior. So there will be some breakaway within the West Region. For me the LL/EoS/SoS Confirm how the WoSFL will operate within the pyramid playoff. One promotion spot / Two promotion spots? That's going to be a common question. Set basic expectations for how it will operate. A bit like the pros and cons list that kefc may have put together for joining the EoSFL. Tier 6 entry single division up to 18 clubs / Split conferences for a year if too many. Access to the SFA South Region Challenge Cup (70 clubs contest the 2019/20 edition) Access to the Alba Cup against SOSFL non-SFA members. The winner contests the South and East Cup Winners Shield as a qualifier to the Scottiish Cup Access to the LL Development League League Cup competition contested by WoSFL clubs. Access to SFA Licencing process. Set a deadline. Organise a meeting with enough time before that to answer any questions. Worse case if not interest change the LL pyramid playoff so that the EoS licenced Champions and SoS licenced Champions are guaranteed automatic promotion. Direct any notes of interest in the WoSFL to the SoSFL to apply to. If the SoS has a single season pathway to the Lowland League there will be some clubs that take it up. Then the SoS eventually morphs into more of a West of Scotland League by default. Unless of course it's LL2 West & LL2 East...... Licenced EoS premier clubs making up the East Division and the West Division open to application to licenced clubs or those who could be licenced within a year and commit to that timescale. SoS moved down a level to where it possibly ought to (and wants to) be as a result. Problem Solved. My assumption if a WoSFL is off the table, is LL2 East and West solves arguably more of the issues in one swoop with potentially less of the mess. Just a thought. ETA: it also kills option z forever, consigned to the sea where it should have been sent to begin with. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedEd Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 16 minutes ago, parsforlife said: The only action now is for a WoS(or LL2) league to get set up. question is who has the energy to do it?. The other league bodies seem happy to support but unlikely to be the driving force, and the sfa largely don’t care enough. Somebody is going to need to come forward and risk the theats of the SJFA. It’s probably considered too risky for one club, but 4 or 5 with LL help will succeed. Exactly. There are clubs in the West interested in joining the pyramid. They would much rather have done it en masse, but if that isn't happening then they may be willing to join a new league. Like what happened in the East, if there is a trickle it will soon become a flood. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Just now, gaz5 said: Unless of course it's LL2 West & LL2 East...... Licenced EoS premier clubs making up the East Division and the West Division open to application to licenced clubs or those who could be licenced within a year and commit to that timescale. SoS moved down a level to where it possibly ought to (and wants to) be as a result. Problem Solved. My assumption if a WoSFL is off the table, is LL2 East and West solves arguably more of the issues in one swoop with potentially less of the mess. Just a thought. Well for me this where a WoSFL is less messy than a LL2 East and West split. WoSFL opens you up to everyone that wants to apply. LL2 West limits it to a single division. Is the 2020-21 EoS Premier Division just taken in as the LL2 East, or is that open to application seing non-licenced Premier Division teams lose out? Would the EoSFL even be okay with that? There's 16+ clubs licenced clubs in the East that can easily fill a LL2 East. The concerns are that there might no be enough applicants in to even justify a WoSFL, doesn't that apply to the LL2 West? The Lowland League is represented on the Professional Game Board. Does that mean all these new members get voting rights? Less than a year after the SFA just implemented the rule to limit lower league clubs presence on voting matters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amigan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Out of interest does anyone know if the SoS league supported either of the proposals? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 There is also an assumption that a woeful and a LL west would be solely consistent of wrsjfa clubs.there may be clubs playing their trade in sos or sos for that matter that would wish to apply. For me that's 2 stabs at it the junior clubs have had, it is time to have this as an application only process, then those that wish to be in the pyramid are in the pyramid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz5 Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Well for me this where a WoSFL is less messy than a LL2 East and West split. WoSFL opens you up to everyone that wants to apply. LL2 West limits it to a single division. Is the 2020-21 EoS Premier Division just taken in as the LL2 East, or is that open to application seing non-licenced Premier Division teams lose out? Would the EoSFL even be okay with that? There's 16+ clubs licenced clubs in the East that can easily fill a LL2 East. The concerns are that there might no be enough applicants in to even justify a WoSFL, doesn't that apply to the LL2 West? The Lowland League is represented on the Professional Game Board. Does that mean all these new members get voting rights? Less than a year after the SFA just implemented the rule to limit lower league clubs presence on voting matters. I think you're looking for problems where they don't exist to be honest. 1. You would still need a West league under LL2 West. It could still be plugged in later/now if more than 16 applicants. 2. If you're giving me teams in the West a year to get a licence, you give the same to non licenced EoS premier teams 3. If you went LL2 without splitting East and West then at the moment it would be filled by the EoS teams anyway as they are the only ones with a licence 4. Voting rights are based on Tier I believe, so only Tier 5 would have a vote as now 5. You seem to be arguing we might not get enough applicants at the same time you are arguing there isn't space for more than 16, which is an opposing position. I genuinely don't think it's any different from a WoS in anything other than name and licence requirement. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTID Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 (edited) Wait hold on didn’t we apply for deferred membership of the *east of scotland* league never mind a much more convenient west league. If that’s not showing an interest what is??? It’s well known across junior football our membership would vote for a move to a wosl, we really need other clubs to put their heads up now *if* there is as much interest as is suggested. We can’t just do it on our own. Scunnered but not surprised at the outcome. Fed up with all the politics. Hope there is another east exodus this summer just to weaken the juniors hand even more. Will deserve everything they get. Edited January 29, 2020 by BTID 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranaldo Bairn Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Just when you think you've scraped the bottom of the idiocy barrel, along comes another Juniors masterclass.If the SFA really want to push this through, can they not simply say they will no longer supply officials to SJFA competitions after this season? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 5 minutes ago, Ranaldo Bairn said: Just when you think you've scraped the bottom of the idiocy barrel, along comes another Juniors masterclass. If the SFA really want to push this through, can they not simply say they will no longer supply officials to SJFA competitions after this season? The SFA don't run leagues, they facilitate discussions and make suggestions but can't force any league to do what they don't want to do. The Pyramid is organised and run by LL, EoS and SoS. The LL could still push on with a WoSFL if they can be sure there's a demand out there for it, otherwise they might just go their own way with a LL2. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTID Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 9 minutes ago, Ranaldo Bairn said: Just when you think you've scraped the bottom of the idiocy barrel, along comes another Juniors masterclass. If the SFA really want to push this through, can they not simply say they will no longer supply officials to SJFA competitions after this season? Could be wrong but the fact a west leagues still hasn’t been setup makes me think the SFA aren’t really that bothered about it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 12 minutes ago, gaz5 said: I just think a WoSFL comes before a LL2 West and LL2 East. I think you're looking for problems where they don't exist to be honest. 1. You would still need a West league under LL2 West. It could still be plugged in later/now if more than 16 applicants. So a WoSFL is still getting created? Why jump to a LL2 West 2. If you're giving me teams in the West a year to get a licence, you give the same to non licenced EoS premier teams One of the questions I asked and one of the potential answers. 3. If you went LL2 without splitting East and West then at the moment it would be filled by the EoS teams anyway as they are the only ones with a licence A single LL2 division doesn't solve the problem of entry to West of Scotland clubs. Still would need a WoSFL in addition to it. 4. Voting rights are based on Tier I believe, so only Tier 5 would have a vote as now The way I understood it is that it is tied to membership of the Professional Game Board. Tiers can be changed. We've already seen the SPFL trying to implement an additional tier. 5. You seem to be arguing we might not get enough applicants at the same time you are arguing there isn't space for more than 16, which is an opposing position. I'm not arguing anything. I think if the LL/EoS organise a WoSFL they will get enough clubs to fill it. Other people don't. However I do believe that the LL2 limits the clubs that would apply compared to a WoSFL. I genuinely don't think it's any different from a WoS in anything other than name and licence requirement. There are clubs that don't believe they can get licenced immediately, take all those clubs without floodlights for instance. So making licencing rather than pyramid entry a focus could limit the number of applicants. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranaldo Bairn Posted January 29, 2020 Share Posted January 29, 2020 Yes I know that, but they do provide the referees, don't they? And that's all I was referring to. The SFA don't run leagues, they facilitate discussions and make suggestions but can't force any league to do what they don't want to do. The Pyramid is organised and run by LL, EoS and SoS. The LL could still push on with a WoSFL if they can be sure there's a demand out there for it, otherwise they might just go their own way with a LL2. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 29, 2020 Author Share Posted January 29, 2020 Just now, Ranaldo Bairn said: Yes I know that, but they do provide the referees, don't they? And that's all I was referring to. They won't do anything like that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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