Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[10menwent2mow]

Leitch today
“ Getting out of this will be slow and it will be gradual. Schools and the wellbeing of children will be the priority and so will places of worship”
 

My place of worship is Pittodrie. Get it open.

[John Lambies Doos]

My place of worship is Pittodrie. Get it open.

false god mate

[Theroadlesstravelled]

28 minutes ago, budmiester1 said:

What I’d like hear from the Government is how they intend to implement the “Roadmap “ out of this situation. I don’t mean on such and such date we drop a level but once we reach a certain level of inoculations, infections and most importantly number of cases in hospitals then we can move down. If the government is honest about all these figures people can see that things are improving and getting closer to a more normal life, give the people a big carrot and they’ll follow.

They probably don't know.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sir-patrick-vallance-makes-clear-we-wont-see-the-back-of-the-virus-any-time-soon-12193338

 

Despite the vaccine, we may well be having the "lift or lockdown" debate all over again come March.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

9 minutes ago, Theroadlesstravelled said:

They probably don't know.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sir-patrick-vallance-makes-clear-we-wont-see-the-back-of-the-virus-any-time-soon-12193338

 

Despite the vaccine, we may well be having the "lift or lockdown" debate all over again come March.

The way this is going I genuinely think id lose the will to live if it wasnt for my wee boy and mrs, I couldnt go through years of this, its not living. 

[No_Problemo]

14 minutes ago, Theroadlesstravelled said:

They probably don't know.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-sir-patrick-vallance-makes-clear-we-wont-see-the-back-of-the-virus-any-time-soon-12193338

 

Despite the vaccine, we may well be having the "lift or lockdown" debate all over again come March.

So you can’t visit a care home after having two vaccinations despite care homes being prioritised and residents given two doses before those visiting them. Makes sense. 

[Bairnardo]

Every single person that passes comment on the long term strategy of this is doing so purely from a health point of view. That might seem an obvius thing to say, but in practice, they are actually all advocating a colossal amount of protection to an increasingly minute amount of people who need it for an indefinite amount of time. Why aren't the politicians stepping in? We don't have the fucking stomach to admit that even with covid still about, we will need to choose between a small number of unfortunate deaths or abject misery for millions.

Embarrassing If we really are a nation so emotionally immature that all we are fit to hear is this fucking drivel from Vallance etc

[Guest bernardblack]

“Fines of £800 for anyone found at a house party of 15 people or more”

What an absolute joke that is.

Basically says do you what you want as long as there’s less than 15 of you.

[Left Back]

5 minutes ago, bernardblack said:

“Fines of £800 for anyone found at a house party of 15 people or more”

What an absolute joke that is.

Basically says do you what you want as long as there’s less than 15 of you.

There are existing measures in place to fine people attending parties.  This will be supplemental to reflect a more serious transgression.

[renton]

7 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Every single person that passes comment on the long term strategy of this is doing so purely from a health point of view. That might seem an obvius thing to say, but in practice, they are actually all advocating a colossal amount of protection to an increasingly minute amount of people who need it for an indefinite amount of time. Why aren't the politicians stepping in? We don't have the fucking stomach to admit that even with covid still about, we will need to choose between a small number of unfortunate deaths or abject misery for millions.

Embarrassing If we really are a nation so emotionally immature that all we are fit to hear is this fucking drivel from Vallance etc

Is it emotional immaturity or is it the severe lack of nuance in public discourse. Not sure any politician would be courageous enough to try and release a statement with qualifiers without the media entirely removing those and presenting a stark "YOU ARE BEING LEFT TO DIE" headline for days on end. Really, there is no benefit for politicians sticking their head above the parapet right now, so they won't.

[Caledonian1]

10 minutes ago, bernardblack said:

“Fines of £800 for anyone found at a house party of 15 people or more”

What an absolute joke that is.

Basically says do you what you want as long as there’s less than 15 of you.

No it doesn't...you can still be fined....just not £800

 

ETA - didnt see Left Back reply above 

Edited January 21, 2021 by Caledonian1

[Left Back]

Just now, 8MileBU said:

That’s pathetic! 

c***s will just text 40 of their mates and say they’ll have a party round their house as long as everybody sticks £20 in the “Just incase we get busted” jar!

How will they pay the other 39 fines?

[djchapsticks]

Think we're genuinely at the stage where the media are fully immersed in dampening any optimism of the public by rolling out doom and gloom merchants. However, I genuinely don't believe this to be the case and as the situation inevitably improves, so too will the confidence and resolve of people. A lessening of cases, ICU admissions and deaths, coupled with the lifting of total lockdowns will lead to people realising that there's actually nothing more to be genuinely scared about than already lurks out there. 

As I mentioned yesterday, we are still in that stage where scientists and medical experts' views trump all and a medical expert is always going to err on the side of caution. Of course they are.

As this winter, where we all are still accepting of restrictions and waiting for a vaccination programme to pick up, gradually becomes spring, the groundswell of dissent (not from the public, the govt. don't give a f**k about their dissent) from several corporate sectors will become loud and will do so quickly. And will be impossible for them to ignore and disregard as the severity of the disease is hammered by the vaccination.

As cases drop, as hospitals empty, as deaths fall away and the burden of the health staff is lessened significantly, the cautious voices of folk like Vallance, van Tam and Leitch will fade into the background and be weighted against that of economists, businessmen and educators.

Will it go away? No. Will people still get it in certain numbers? Of course. But in the presence of a full and completed vaccination programme, you will be no more worried taking covid into the care home and infecting your vaccinated granny than you would be bringing in seasonal flu. 

Edited January 21, 2021 by djchapsticks

[8MileBU]

1 minute ago, Left Back said:

How will they pay the other 39 fines?

Ah, FFS - I read the original post wrong. Thought it read anyone having a house party of 15 folk or more.

[10menwent2mow]

Every single person that passes comment on the long term strategy of this is doing so purely from a health point of view. That might seem an obvius thing to say, but in practice, they are actually all advocating a colossal amount of protection to an increasingly minute amount of people who need it for an indefinite amount of time. Why aren't the politicians stepping in? We don't have the fucking stomach to admit that even with covid still about, we will need to choose between a small number of unfortunate deaths or abject misery for millions.
Embarrassing If we really are a nation so emotionally immature that all we are fit to hear is this fucking drivel from Vallance etc

Harsh though it sounds, you are spot on. This whole idea of one death is one death too many has been a ridiculous position to be in since day 1. Yes, we must prevent as many deaths as possible but we could prevent all road deaths by stopping folk from driving, however, that would be ridiculous. While not disagreeing with the need for restrictions, continuing them for any longer than is absolutely necessary, which erring on the side of caution would be, is going to do more harm than good.

[Ron Aldo]

Think we're genuinely at the stage where the media are fully immersed in dampening any optimism of the public by rolling out doom and gloom merchants. However, I genuinely don't believe this to be the case and as the situation inevitably improves, so too will the confidence and resolve of people. A lessening of cases, ICU admissions and deaths, coupled with the lifting of total lockdowns will lead to people realising that there's actually nothing more to be genuinely scared about than already lurks out there. 
As I mentioned yesterday, we are still in that stage where scientists and medical experts' views trump all and a medical expert is always going to err on the side of caution. Of course they are.
As this winter, where we all are still accepting of restrictions and waiting for a vaccination programme to pick up, gradually becomes spring, the groundswell of dissent (not from the public, the govt. don't give a f**k about their dissent) from several corporate sectors will become loud and will do so quickly. And will be impossible for them to ignore and disregard as the severity of the disease is hammered by the vaccination.
As cases drop, as hospitals empty, as deaths fall away and the burden of the health staff is lessened significantly, the cautious voices of folk like Vallance, van Tam and Leitch will fade into the background and be weighted against that of economists, businessmen and educators.
Will it go away? No. Will people still get it in certain numbers? Of course. But in the presence of a full and completed vaccination programme, you will be no more worried taking covid into the care home and infecting your vaccinated granny than you would be bringing in seasonal flu. 

Completely agree. We're in a shitty situation right now but one which, in my view, is immeasurably better than last March.

I remember last summer when cases were in single figures and we (Scotland that is) didn't record a death in weeks. I remember thinking (probably a bit foolishly, looking back) that this was almost done and dusted with a slow return to normality on the horizon and that there would be a vaccine at some point just to keep the virus under control.

Obviously that didn't turn out to be the case. Like you say, cases are already falling so deaths and hospital admissions should follow. I'd expect numbers to massively decrease again as summer kicks in with the key difference this year being that we do have a vaccine to hopefully keep it that way. Even if cases do creep up by next winter, that shouldn't matter a jot if the vaccine does its key job and prevents most people becoming seriously ill.

We'll probably have another 2-3 months of utter shite and days where we wonder what the point is but after that I hope things will start to massively improve.

[Aladdin]

Let's be honest, neither the Scottish or Westminster governments have a fucking clue how to roadmap out of the lockdown apart from the vaccines.

Leaving aside the prevalence of the virus, our track and trace systems don't work. The tiered approach of local restrictions, as they were applied last year, dont work. Blaming the public hasn't worked.

If they are going to pin everything on the vaccine then I would expect to see projections on which restrictions can be lifted once X number of people have been vaccinated. That nothing has been produced to date is pretty fucking poor to say the least and does nothing to increase compliance with the restrictions.

[Left Back]

Regardless of the content Patel’s delivery and confidence is night and day from Hancock who comes across like he’s won a raffle to be in the job.

[s_dog]

19 minutes ago, djchapsticks said:

As cases drop, as hospitals empty, as deaths fall away and the burden of the health staff is lessened significantly, the cautious voices of folk like Vallance, van Tam and Leitch will fade into the background and be weighted against that of economists, businessmen and educators.

Will it go away? No. Will people still get it in certain numbers? Of course. But in the presence of a full and completed vaccination programme, you will be no more worried taking covid into the care home and infecting your vaccinated granny than you would be bringing in seasonal flu. 

I get that you'd like that 'end result' to happen, I think most of us would settle for that right now. But is this the right way to go about it, as wasn't it exactly what happened in Spring/Summer last year, and look at us now? By doing that aren't you just repeating the same actions, but with the hope that vaccinations alone will lead to a radically different outcome.  Not even the scientists and other so-called experts know with any great certainty what is going to happen in the months ahead while we wait for the vaccination programme to be completed. The vaccinations will stop so many people becoming seriously ill, but will it work long-term, have any affect on transmission, will the virus mutate further to become resistant to vaccines, etc, etc. It's just all so unknown, how can anyone be certain of anything right now? 

Edited January 21, 2021 by s_dog

[Ron Aldo]

I get that you'd like that 'end result' to happen, I think most of us would settle for that right now. But is this the right way to go about it, as wasn't it exactly what happened in Spring/Summer last year, and look at us now? By doing that aren't you just repeating the same actions, but with the hope that vaccinations alone will lead to a radically different outcome.  Not even the scientists and other so-called experts know with any great certainty what is going to happen in the months ahead while we wait for the vaccination programme to be completed. 
[/quote

]So if the vaccination program isn't as successful as hoped (assuming that's what you're getting at), what's your solution?

Keeping everyone under restrictions forever is not a viable solution whichever way this pans out.

[Glen Sannox]

5 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Regardless of the content Patel’s delivery and confidence is night and day from Hancock who comes across like he’s won a raffle to be in the job.

Hancock may indeed have won a raffle, but it’s not as big a raffle as the one that Gavin Williamson won.