Shipa Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 If mass vaccination of the population is not enough to lift restrictions, then what, if anything, will be? Zero Covid? Even if we were to achieve that within Scotland, to maintain it we would surely to either: a) reach zero Covid globally, or b) strictly close all our borders, including those with rUK, indefinately, or at least untilk a) can be attained. As for the risk of other strains, th "ones we don't know about yet," where do you draw the line? It could be argued that there are hundreds of animal species out there carrying diseases which could be harmful to humans if they were to cross the species boundary. Do we then lock down permanently just in case? As an aside, I do some concerns about where the likes of Australia/NZ go from here. Yes, they have done a great job of mainly keeping the virus out until vaccination can take place, and a result of this is that is that they have not had restrictions on day-to-day life to anywhere near the extent of ours. Will this result in lower vaccine uptake, the hope of return to normal here probably encouraging people who may otherwise have refused/not bothered, while Aus/NZ don't really have that carrot? Although being a success so far, are they still saving up problems for the future? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Paco said: The route map will come in time. Feb 22nd is the promised UK route map is it not? I can’t see Scotland being far behind on that. There are likely parts of the UK plan, particularly on furlough and border control, that kind of dictate what devolved governments can or can’t do in the longer-term so it makes sense they would wait for clarity on these before launching in with their own. There is a collective head loss on this thread over very little (I admit I found the Swinney comments troubling yet vague and Sturgeon should be pressed on these today). Calm down. We’ll get there. What will this be, the third route map that's been published by both governments? I want to see a definitive set of criteria for all restrictions and emergency powers taken out of law, and that this will happen when triggers are met, i.e. vaccination rates and hospitalisation data. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Binos Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Shipa said: If mass vaccination of the population is not enough to lift restrictions, then what, if anything, will be? Zero Covid? Even if we were to achieve that within Scotland, to maintain it we would surely to either: a) reach zero Covid globally, or b) strictly close all our borders, including those with rUK, indefinately, or at least untilk a) can be attained. As for the risk of other strains, th "ones we don't know about yet," where do you draw the line? It could be argued that there are hundreds of animal species out there carrying diseases which could be harmful to humans if they were to cross the species boundary. Do we then lock down permanently just in case? As an aside, I do some concerns about where the likes of Australia/NZ go from here. Yes, they have done a great job of mainly keeping the virus out until vaccination can take place, and a result of this is that is that they have not had restrictions on day-to-day life to anywhere near the extent of ours. Will this result in lower vaccine uptake, the hope of return to normal here probably encouraging people who may otherwise have refused/not bothered, while Aus/NZ don't really have that carrot? Although being a success so far, are they still saving up problems for the future? Australia have virtually achieved it, prior to any vaccinations, as you say yourself Edited February 8, 2021 by Binos 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Back Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, coprolite said: Was pandemic response an issue in many manifestos? Ah. If it wasn't in the manifesto the government(s) should have ignored the pandemic when it cropped up then? Your question is ridiculous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted February 8, 2021 Author Share Posted February 8, 2021 Quite a few people on here are going to be in shaky YouTube videos in the summer shouting about the Magners Carter as they get chucked into a police van aren't they? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Left Back said: Ah. If it wasn't in the manifesto the government(s) should have ignored the pandemic when it cropped up then? Your question is ridiculous. So we had a say by voting on policies that the parties didn't even have? My question was fair, you are ridiculous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Back Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, ICTChris said: Quite a few people on here are going to be in shaky YouTube videos in the summer shouting about the Magners Carter as they get chucked into a police van aren't they? Depends how drunk they are. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shipa Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Binos said: Australia have virtually achieved it, prior to any vaccinations My concern though is that they have done so with their borders all but closed, what happens when the time comes to open up? Presumably strict checks at borders can be kept in place long-term, but these are not a guarantee it will not get in. I imagine they will have plans in place, but again they will rely on sufficient vaccination and controls being strictly enforced. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1988 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 Just now, Left Back said: Ah. If it wasn't in the manifesto the government(s) should have ignored the pandemic when it cropped up then? Your question is ridiculous. No, but the point stands that no one voted for this. The public is accepting of an emergency response to a crisis where a health system may collapse. Indeed, it's right for the government to have the power to take appropriate action in an emergency without needing to consult the public. Once the emergency ends though we are talking about healthcare policies that the public really should be getting a say on. The measures are so pervasive that it isn't really acceptable just say just wait until the elections come around. Not to mention the fact that an election fought on the grounds of an end to lockdown is not very healthy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 19 minutes ago, The Moonster said: There could be any number of reasons that other countries don't want to use the AZ vaccine, political or otherwise. I have faith in our scientific methods though, so unless AZ have fraudulently claimed their results then I'm not too worried about efficiency there - having the AZ vaccine is still better than having no vaccine at all. And we have other vaccines and treatments to use alongside this. Agreed. It's also been shown to be effective against the Kent varient, which is a particular issue in the UK. It's obviously bad news it doesn't work as well against the SA varient, but neither is it an utter travesty. More a problem for SA given they now have a million doses of the vaccine that they won't be administering any time soon. Unless the SA varient takes hold in the UK and the vaccine doesn't protect against serious illness then this is not the disaster it might be made out to be. Unfortunately, disaster is exactly the type of reaction I expect from the politicians. In the meantime, we really do however need to bar all entry from SA. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dons_1988 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Michael W said: Agreed. It's also been shown to be effective against the Kent varient, which is a particular issue in the UK. It's obviously bad news it doesn't work as well against the SA varient, but neither is it an utter travesty. More a problem for SA given they now have a million doses of the vaccine that they won't be administering any time soon. Unless the SA varient takes hold in the UK and the vaccine doesn't protect against serious illness then this is not the disaster it might be made out to be. Unfortunately, disaster is exactly the type of reaction I expect from the politicians. In the meantime, we really do however need to bar all entry from SA. OK, I was willing to resist pedantry earlier as assumed it was a typo, but you've written 'varient' three times in that post. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Back Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, coprolite said: So we had a say by voting on policies that the parties didn't even have? My question was fair, you are ridiculous. Who has said we've had a say? I certainly haven't claimed anything of the sort.. The governement(s) had to respond on the best information they had at the time. You may agree or disagree with that response but they had to do something at the time to deal with an unforeseen event. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aladdin Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 To date, the arguments against restrictions have been made, in the main, by absolute moon howlers comprising of COVID deniers, Qanon believers and professional contrarians whose entire job is to generate clickbait. As the percentage of the population vaccinated increases and, provided it results in a measurable reduction in serious illness and hospitalisation, you will see reasoned challenges to restrictions based on human rights and civil liberties. Its not clear if Leitch et al genuinely want the kind of state where the government can impose sweeping restrictions without challenge or simply enjoy their current position of relevance but, if its the former, I think they may be disappointed. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Dons_1988 said: OK, I was willing to resist pedantry earlier as assumed it was a typo, but you've written 'varient' three times in that post. I will do better next time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GiGi Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 What time do people get angry about Sunday's vaccine figures? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 Dr Fauci doing a good interview on R4 just now. Talking especially about herd immunity he thinks between 70-80% should be about enough, but stressed measles herd immunity was 90% and we won't know until we pass it. Hopefully we start the background research to know the levels of natural anti bodies, but you would think you would only need to see about 50/60% vaccinated before you hit the overall baseline figure with natural immunity. Fingers crossed for positive news to keep coming. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, GiGi said: What time do people get angry about Sunday's vaccine figures? Last Friday. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realmadrid Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 23 hours ago, Billy Jean King said: I've just seen an interview with M O'Leary on Racing tv where he said he doesn't expect the majority of EU countries to be accepting UK or Irish tourists until September now due to a very slow vaccination response in the EU. The man who only a month ago was running adverts like this when they probably knew no flights would be possible this spring or early summer. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_carson Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 Must be working their way through the groups now, that's my Dad got his appointment at the EICC next Tuedsay. He's 66 with no health concerns, so that's a good sign (I think) we're are getting a shift on. Comparatively (and I know I've said comparisons to other countries are pointless, but this just an anecdote) my other half's mum is 67 with chronic respiratory problems (whole life on steroids) and her 94 year-old Nana haven't heard anything from the Irish health service about vaccinations yet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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