Szamo's_Ammo Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 1 minute ago, welshbairn said: I'd like to see a link to that. https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence Bear in mind also that this study came to this conclusion using data from when India was under lockdown and schools were closed, which is even more concerning. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Szamo's_Ammo said: https://www.princeton.edu/news/2020/09/30/largest-covid-19-contact-tracing-study-date-finds-children-key-spread-evidence Bear in mind also that this study came to this conclusion using data from when India was under lockdown and schools were closed, which is even more concerning. I'd be wary of translating findings from India to Western Europe, there are a whole load of factors that can distort a meaningful comparison. Edited October 15, 2020 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 Why are you so convinced that only one factor is causing this second wave around Europe? It seems like some of you have tunnel vision.On 23 September - UNESCO said that around half the schools around the globe were still closed (some 875 million children) - due to high infection rates in their countries.Only a moron would obsessively attribute rising infections to one factor. When economic sectors were opened up it was always going to be the case that infections would increase. Increasing international travel was also going to be a factor.The experience of opening schools has been different across the globe. Israel opening is recognised as not being effective as it did lead to a rise in cases - other countries such as Japan and Uruguay have been far more successful.In some cases, for example, Sweden, schools never closed - remember when Sweden was being held up as the way to deal with Covid-19 without lockdowns? Yet cases have risen there as well with a complex explanation for this.No-one is saying opening schools is risk free - I for one was very apprehensive at first but so far the experience has been fairly positive - a lot of that has been down to the systems put in place - staggering of period times has certainly helped. If it does come to the point that schools need to close then so be it - I think we are probably in a better place now to deal with things than we were in March. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Szamo's_Ammo Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 Yeah the scientists in India, the USA and South Korea who have concluded that children are key to the spread of the virus and often carry higher viral loads than adults in ICUs are morons right enough. PS. Sweden did close schools. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Szamo's_Ammo said: PS. Sweden did close schools. Only for 16s and over. Potentially a significant factor when all the data comes in. Edited October 15, 2020 by welshbairn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 Only for 16s and over. Potentially a significant factor when all the data comes in.They made it compulsory up to the age of 16 - they did try to enforce some kind of social distancing but did not advise the use of face masks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Szamo's_Ammo Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 *inhales through teeth* Yeah... I think I'm washing my hair that weekend. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 *inhales through teeth* Yeah... I think I'm washing my hair that weekend.You would never guess that you're not a fan.[emoji23] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 17 minutes ago, Szamo's_Ammo said: Yeah the scientists in India, the USA and South Korea who have concluded that children are key to the spread of the virus and often carry higher viral loads than adults in ICUs are morons right enough. PS. Sweden did close schools. Don't forget the already long-established scientific understanding of how every seasonal respiratory virus spreads - which leads literally right through grotty weans in the school classroom - that apparently doesn't apply here for reasons. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzdrk Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 28 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: remember when Sweden was being held up as the way to deal with Covid-19 without lockdowns? No I don't watch love island. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTChris Posted October 15, 2020 Author Share Posted October 15, 2020 *inhales through teeth* Yeah... I think I'm washing my hair that weekend.Heavy “white witch - good guy” vibe about that tweet. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 10 minutes ago, virginton said: Don't forget the already long-established scientific understanding of how every seasonal respiratory virus spreads - which leads literally right through grotty weans in the school classroom - that apparently doesn't apply here for reasons. Covid19 is not the flu, neither has it been proven to be seasonal. Iran had its first cases in a cold winter, then it bloomed in the summer. The above sounds like something a proud University of Life graduate would say. Common sense innit! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, welshbairn said: Why are you so convinced that only one factor is causing this second wave around Europe? It seems like some of you have tunnel vision. Literally no-one is saying that only one factor (presumably you're referring to schools) are causing this second wave. There are a good few of us shaking our heads in disbelief at the apparent insistence of various governments that the virus does not have the power to enter school gates, kind of like how vampires can't enter a person's home without permission. Edited October 15, 2020 by Gaz 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 (edited) 43 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Covid19 is not the flu, neither has it been proven to be seasonal. Iran had its first cases in a cold winter, then it bloomed in the summer. The above sounds like something a proud University of Life graduate would say. Common sense innit! It's hilarious to see you claiming that there's no proof that it is a seasonal disease, as case rates, erm, surge all across Europe at the onset of autumn just like the cold and flu under the exact same circumstances like clockwork every year. Sure looks seasonal champ! The onus is on those advocating this obvious failure of a prevention strategy explain how exactly the infection cycle of a respiratory virus that spreads through close contact with others radically differs from all the other ones that we already know about. Edited October 15, 2020 by vikingTON 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 2 minutes ago, virginton said: It's hilarious to see you claiming that there's no proof that it is a seasonal disease, as case rates, erm, surge all across Europe at the onset of autumn just like the cold and flu every single year and in the exact same environment. The onus is on those advocating this obvious failure of a prevention strategy explain how exactly the infection cycle of a respiratory virus that spreads through close contact with others radically differs from all the other ones that we already know about. Aye, because we had a really Baltic September and early October likes. The flu's going through the roof! -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldbitterandgrumpy Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 1 minute ago, welshbairn said: Aye, because we had a really Baltic September and early October likes. The flu's going through the roof! Why, out of genuine interest, are you debating with this guy? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 15, 2020 Share Posted October 15, 2020 23 minutes ago, Gaz said: Literally no-one is saying that only one factor (presumably you're referring to schools) are causing this second wave. There are a good few of us shaking our heads in disbelief at the apparent insistence of various governments that the virus does not have the power to enter school gates, kind of like how vampires can't enter a person's home without permission. I don't think any Governments are saying that, only that opening up schools is important for multiple reasons, and that the consequences aren't as catastrophically the big spur of growth as 2 or 3 posters on here obsessively believe. There are plenty of studies indicating that younger pupils aren't major transmitters. Anyone claiming certainty at this stage an idiot, and needs to learn how to distinguish between coinciding events and causal chains. There are a multiplicity of possible causes of the current spike, opening schools has to be a factor but its significance amongst all the other's collective contribution is as yet unknown. -2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 16, 2020 Share Posted October 16, 2020 19 minutes ago, oldbitterandgrumpy said: Why, out of genuine interest, are you debating with this guy? I'm getting bored of the three of them greenying each others posts and red dotting anyone who disagrees with them. It's a wee game they're playing and they probably don't believe a word of what they're arguing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted October 16, 2020 Share Posted October 16, 2020 Literally no-one is saying that only one factor (presumably you're referring to schools) are causing this second wave. There are a good few of us shaking our heads in disbelief at the apparent insistence of various governments that the virus does not have the power to enter school gates, kind of like how vampires can't enter a person's home without permission.The problem is though that certain individuals here seem to equally shoot down any other factor that is contributing as well and immediately bring the schools into it. This related to an article published on 18 August about the initial sharp rise in infections in Italy - one that attributed 40% to returning Italian holidaymakers and tourists - yet the obsessed one and the Clique went to their go-to argument to try and shoot it down - ignoring the fact that schools in Italy hadn't returned at that date (and were not back until 17 September). No-one here is saying schools don't play a role (and certainly will have after 17 September in Italy) - I just find it frustrating that said poster seems unwilling to look at the more complex interactions that are driving this other than his "elephant in the room" argument. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tutankhamen Posted October 16, 2020 Share Posted October 16, 2020 On 22/01/2020 at 06:03, G_Man1985 said: No No No No Probably the biggest losing tipster since that chap said the Titanic was unsinkable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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