vikingTON Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, WhiteRoseKillie said: 2 hours ago, EdinburghPar1975 said: Yeah,I just don't understand why there isn't a specific effort being mounted to vaccinate all school employees in the time between now and reopening. I know some on here raised the possibility of other occupations demanding special queue jumping permission, but if schools have been "infection factories" all this time, surely we should be starting this road to normality with as many protections as possible? School employees are not driving the numbers caused by infection factories - and those who are at risk will be vaccinated soon. The infections will be driven by the mixing of 20-30 kids indoors on an ongoing basis and then bringing it back to their household, and you cannot vaccinate children yet (which I find ludicrous, but here we are) to solve that problem. School opening should have been punted into the tier system like everything else. Edited February 24, 2021 by vikingTON 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elixir Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madwullie Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 Posters with WEANS, will you be vaxxing them when it comes online assuming the trials etc go well? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteRoseKillie Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 School employees are not driving the numbers caused by infection factories - and those who are at risk will be vaccinated soon. The infections will be driven by the mixing of 20-30 kids indoors on an ongoing basis and then bringing it back to their household, and you cannot vaccinate children yet (which I find ludicrous, but here we are) to solve that problem. School opening should have been punted into the tier system like everything else. Again, I'm not an expert, but perhaps you could explain why vaccination of all employees before the reopening would not have at least some beneficial effect, rather than wait for "soon", which won't be soon enough to stop an outbreak. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Burnieman said: Yin and Yang Asked about opening up for the summer, Nicola Sturgeon says she hopes to see the Scotland football team play England in June at Wembley but says she cannot give a cast iron guarantee that fans will be able to make their way to London. A statement yesterday on the roadmap from my local SNP MSP goes some way further than that: Quote Compared to the announcements made by the Prime Minister on how restrictions will be eased elsewhere in the UK, the First Minister’s statement adopts a more cautious approach. As an example, Boris Johnson wants to see a full return to normality in England by 21 June. Coincidently, the Euro 2021 football tournament begins on 11 June with the first match in the UK taking place on 13 June. At the same time, the PM has said it will take until the end of July for all adults in the UK to be offered their first dose of the vaccine. Therefore, the drive to have people in football stadia for Euro 2021 looks like it is being rushed before the vaccination programme has been completed. In contrast, I firmly believe that the Scottish Government’s approach balances expectations while being honest with the population that we’re still very much in the midst of a pandemic. Where to even begin with this blubbering, non-sequitur drivel, honestly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madwullie Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Elixir said: Sounds like good old British exceptionalism to me. See also: free born Englishmen won't suffer being locked down; Masks are culturally inappropriate in Scotland, amongst others. Like @Detournement says above, if you own a business and can have 25% of your premises filled with social distancing and no passport, or the place jumping with a passport, there's only really one option Edited February 24, 2021 by madwullie 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdinburghPar1975 Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, madwullie said: Posters with WEANS, will you be vaxxing them when it comes online assuming the trials etc go well? I'm assuming that if tests go well then the kids might get a vaccination along with their flu jags - as mine have always had those then i'd have no issue with them getting a COVID jag either 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said: 8 minutes ago, virginton said: Again, I'm not an expert, but perhaps you could explain why vaccination of all employees before the reopening would not have at least some beneficial effect, rather than wait for "soon", which won't be soon enough to stop an outbreak. Vaccinating employees will not stop an outbreak when the non-vaccinated to vaccinated ratio in their indoor workplace is 25:1 if not higher. Would you similarly expect vaccinating prison officers to stop an outbreak taking place at a prison? The beneficial effects on transmission are marginal while the costs of not vaccinating priority health groups are higher, though not by too much IMO. Edited February 24, 2021 by vikingTON 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, virginton said: School employees are not driving the numbers caused by infection factories - and those who are at risk will be vaccinated soon. The infections will be driven by the mixing of 20-30 kids indoors on an ongoing basis and then bringing it back to their household, and you cannot vaccinate children yet (which I find ludicrous, but here we are) to solve that problem. School opening should have been punted into the tier system like everything else. If the schools are the 'Infection Factories' you bang on about most of them would have already achieved herd immunity and there would be many large local clusters linked to schools (there were only a couple that I can recall). There was a Norwegian study which proved schools are safe which looks a lot more credible than listening to the permanently angry guy who posts photos of Ainsley Harriot. https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2020.26.1.2002011 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Detournement said: If the schools are the 'Infection Factories' you bang on about most of them would have already achieved herd immunity and there would be many large local clusters linked to schools (there were only a couple that I can recall). There was a Norwegian study which proved schools are safe which looks a lot more credible than listening to the permanently angry guy who posts photos of Ainsley Harriot. https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2020.26.1.2002011 One study doesn't 'prove' anything champ and the government's own actions speak for themselves. We were told schools were safe and yet transmission has ticked up ever since they were opened in August; 'circuit breakers' have been implemented to take advantage of holidays when they are no longer spreading plague as much; before they then had to be closed down for fully two months at the start of this year because, err, they were driving up the infection rate and overwhelming the NHS! A solution whose impracticality was ridiculed by chumps like yourself until... the Government caved in to the facts that were pointed out on here and of course elsewhere and did it no bother. If you believe that a fraction of the public getting Covid in a work or employment setting at any one time confers herd immunity then supermarkets, care homes etc. must be bastions of herd immunity by now as well and so we can open up everything tomorrow with no ill effects. Edited February 24, 2021 by vikingTON -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_carson Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 The debate about much kids contribute to infection rates aside, vaccinating staff wouldn't be much help dealing with community transmission if it were the case. For example if I were to be vaccinated, but it was to spread around my class they could potentially be taking it home and spreading to their parents. So I may be protected, but there is a scenario whereby 20-odd sets of parents would be infected. Any teachers who need the vaccine by virtue of age or health concerns will be done fairly quickly (if not already done so). I get there are some that are concerned about covid, or potentially transmitting it to someone vulnerable they know but that's a risk for anyone who is currently working. I'll happily take the jab, but I'll wait my turn. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Stig Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, virginton said: One study doesn't 'prove' anything champ and the government's own actions speak for themselves. We were told schools were safe and yet transmission has ticked up ever since they were opened in August, 'circuit breakers' have been implemented to take advantage of holidays when they are no longer spreading plague as much before they then had to be closed down for fully two months at the start of this year because, err, they were driving up the infection rate and overwhelming the NHS! A solution whose impracticality was ridiculed by chumps like yourself until... the Government caved in to the facts that were pointed out on here and of course elsewhere and did it no bother. If you believe that a fraction of the public getting Covid in a work or employment setting at any one time confers herd immunity then supermarkets, care homes etc. must be bastions of herd immunity by now as well and so we can open up everything tomorrow with no ill effects. what is it they say "swing and a miss champ" 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Mahelp Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Bairnardo said: Someone take a bit of time to mock up a vaccine lighting a fat stogie with the dental qualifications of J. Leitch plz That matters not to Leitch. Leitch is obsessed with the 'know unknowns' scenario.....that is, there may be a variant out there that evades vaccines, but we don't know what it is or if it even exists. If you say to him that every single factual indication so far points to the fact that vaccines work against all variants, he'll just turn round and say 'ah, but what if.....' ? That's the thing that 100% guides his thinking, and is there in pretty much every statement he makes. As I said yesterday, this philosophy is dictating policy at the moment. At some point in the next 6 weeks or so, Nicola Sturgeon is going to either have to continue with this ultra-cautious, safety first way of thinking and keep us locked down, or accept that we can't destroy the country based on something that may never happen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, virginton said: One study doesn't 'prove' anything champ and the government's own actions speak for themselves. We were told schools were safe and yet transmission has ticked up ever since they were opened in August, 'circuit breakers' have been implemented to take advantage of holidays when they are no longer spreading plague as much before they then had to be closed down for fully two months at the start of this year because, err, they were driving up the infection rate and overwhelming the NHS! A solution whose impracticality was ridiculed by chumps like yourself until... the Government caved in to the facts that were pointed out on here and of course elsewhere and did it no bother. If you believe that a fraction of the public getting Covid in a work or employment setting at any one time confers herd immunity then supermarkets, care homes etc. must be bastions of herd immunity by now as well and so we can open up everything tomorrow with no ill effects. It proves a lot more than you slavering nonsense. Infections trended down while schools were open in November and December and we have seen similar infection curves to the UK in other countries like Spain and Sweden which kept schools open so it's unlikely that closing schools caused the downturn rather than just seasonality. If you take two minutes to think about it school kids have a minimum of 30 hours a week social contact with a large number of other children. Compare that to the average UK adult at the moment and it's likely to be minimum 5 times higher in terms of time and close contacts. It's probably much greater than that considering many millions of adults barely go outside. When you also factor in that kids on average live in larger households than adults and are far more likely to live with front line key workers then again it drives up the likelihood of them being infected versus the average adult. So with 1/5th of adults having been infected you either need to conclude that infections amongst kids will be far higher than that 20% or as the Norwegian study shows kids don't catch or transmit the virus the same way adults do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David W Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Todd_is_God said: More reason to be positive This whole affair has proved that forecasters haven't improved much since Michael Fish's days. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibsFan Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 (edited) And now we have a weapon, we've never used before. Edited February 24, 2021 by HibsFan 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 47 minutes ago, virginton said: Vaccinating employees will not stop an outbreak when the non-vaccinated to vaccinated ratio in their indoor workplace is 25:1 if not higher. Would you similarly expect vaccinating prison officers to stop an outbreak taking place at a prison? That's a nonsense comparison. A prison is a large intimidatingly bleak institution full of people who have failed to be useful members of society who find themselves there through poor judgement, poor character and desperation Are you seriously drawing parallels between that and a Weathers... oh hang on.. I appear not to have thought this post through fully, sorry to have bothered you 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post G51 Posted February 24, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted February 24, 2021 Johnson and Johnson. You've done it again. First it was the no more tears shampoo, now it's a vaccine for the rona. 22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, HibsFan said: And now we have the weapons, we've never used before. I want a categorical assurance that neither of the Johnsons in "Johnson & Johnson" is related to the PM before I trust this one 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin_Nevis Posted February 24, 2021 Share Posted February 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, HibsFan said: And now we have a weapon, we've never used before. ABSOLUTE SCENES 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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