Conspiracy Theories

[coprolite]

On 03/09/2023 at 22:01, Boo Khaki said:

Think management dropped them after their difficult 2nd Caliphate. Probably be a comeback stadium tour in about 30 years, and loads of angsty teens walking aboot in ISIS teeshirts their maws bought in Primark.

The band Al Qaeda could have been 

[coprolite]

6 minutes ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

I can understand why conspiracy theories about 9/11 exist. Speculating about who was responsible for it and why makes some sense because of the sheer scale of the event and the preparation that must have gone into it. Along with it happening at a time when the internet wasn't ubiquitous and life in general wasn't as digitally catalogued and immediately observable as it is now, I can see why people might be sceptical. Especially when you consider the American presidency at the time and their subsequent foreign policy. 

What I really don't get is people who go in for saying there was no plane. Or it was a missile. Or it was lasers. I remember one (permanently stoned and or drunk) loser on another forum I post on saying years ago "it'd be like an aluminium drinks can hitting a brick wall" and you just think... how can you argue with these people? Are they so incapable of processing something so horrible that they just refuse to believe it could be possible, and will cling on to any alternative explanation no matter how stupid? People physically stood and watched planes flying. They were filmed. Yet you'll get people arguing otherwise. Wild.

I think there are also cover ups around the event and the whole situation that result in people not trusting the official version. 

Personally i think that the replacement of the official narrative with a deep state false flag narrative lacks evidence and logic and is a bit nuts. But i don't think it's that nuts, compared to likes of qanon or thinking that climate scientists made up global warming to get grants. 

There's a bit of murkiness about what the authorities knew and how, and what the involvement of the handler was with the security services. I think it's reasonable to question the official line on that. 

Personally I'm sceptical of the official narrative about the fourth plane and wouldn't be at all surprised if it had been shot down. 

I would be very surprised if Dick Cheney and Donnie Rumsfeld had sat down for a wee chat about Halliburton's share price and ended up hatching a plan to attack New York. 

But, you know they did anthrax themselves so it's not completely out there. 

[Richey Edwards]

Osama Bin Laden and well-known football terrorist Lee Bullen are one and the same person.

[welshbairn]

2 hours ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

the sheer scale of the event and the preparation that must have gone into it.

When it came down to it was just training a handful of people how to steer a plane in mid flight on simulation software and a dozen or so others on basic knife fighting and strong arming. Along with convincing them that dying on the mission would be a privilege, of course. I doubt it would have cost more than $100,000 all in. The conspiracy theorists can't cope with how easily some audacious and suicidal extremists could cause that much death and destruction, it's more comforting to think only a state could do it, especially a powerful one like the United States, rather than some nutters guided by a man in a cave.

Edited September 7, 2023 by welshbairn

[Cosmic Joe]

Petty as anything, but does anyone else get slightly annoyed that it doesn't get referred to as 11/9?

[welshbairn]

9 minutes ago, Cosmic Joe said:

Petty as anything, but does anyone else get slightly annoyed that it doesn't get referred to as 11/9?

Given that it happened in the US, not really. The bombers could have been more considerate though, like they were on 7/7. 

[ICTChris]

Whenever I read conspiracy theories about those Israeli tourists celebrating the attack, I always think of a certain former P&Ber who posted of reacting in a similar manner.

[Cosmic Joe]

31 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

Whenever I read conspiracy theories about those Israeli tourists celebrating the attack, I always think of a certain former P&Ber who posted of reacting in a similar manner.

Was there not a completely fake video of Palestinians celebrating doing the rounds? 

[welshbairn]

There were real videos of Palestinians celebrating in Gaza and/or the West Bank, the fake ones were in New Jersey, that Trump claimed to have seen at the same time he claimed to have been helping out in Manhatten, and joked that with the Trade Centre collapsing he now owned the tallest building in New York. 

Edited September 7, 2023 by welshbairn

[alta-pete]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Given that it happened in the US, not really. The bombers could have been more considerate though, like they were on 7/7. 

I think they covered off that potential confusion with the bus bomb in London on 7/7. 

[ICTChris]

3 hours ago, Cosmic Joe said:

Was there not a completely fake video of Palestinians celebrating doing the rounds? 

Celtic fans the day after the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbour. Shocking.

[Shotgun]

6 hours ago, welshbairn said:

There were real videos of Palestinians celebrating in Gaza and/or the West Bank, the fake ones were in New Jersey, that Trump claimed to have seen at the same time he claimed to have been helping out in Manhatten, and joked that with the Trade Centre collapsing he now owned the tallest building in New York. 

But weren't the Palestinian videos old footage showing celebrations of a completely different event? Or maybe I just read something that had been made up. Who knows?

Re a 9/11 conspiracy, I'm more inclined to believe incompetence on behalf of the Bush Administration / US security services contributed to the event being allowed to happen, rather than them specifically causing it.

[hk blues]

17 hours ago, Cosmic Joe said:

Petty as anything, but does anyone else get slightly annoyed that it doesn't get referred to as 11/9?

Yip. 

[Fullerene]

I think conspiracies are mainly carried out by people who find them convenient and don't really care if they get uncovered later on.

For example, regarding 9/11, there is no question that a conspiracy took place.  I am referring to 50 years ago, when the CIA and others undermined the government of Salvador Allende in Chile and helped enable a military coup on 11th September 1973.  By the time this was revealed, General Pinochet was firmly in charge.

Similarly the overthrow of a democratically elected government in Iran.  The UK and the US helped with that.  Oncxe the Shah was in place, it did not matter who knew about it.

Regarding 9/11 in 2001, nobody was behind it who would be in serious trouble if it was ever found out.  Certainly not the US government apart from a conspiracy of incompetence and certainly not Israel.  By contrast, Al Qaeda were delighted when the finger was pointed at them.  They were as happy with the wars that followed as anyone else.

That is how I see it.

[welshbairn]

I read somewhere that Bin Laden's colleagues were furious with him for not discussing what he was planning, as soon as it happened they knew the best they could hope for was spending the rest of their lives in hiding with no safe place, most likely something far worse, and also making their goal of establishing a Caliphate even more unlikely. Even Bin Laden was amazed what happened to the Twin Towers, he was hoping for death and destruction in a spectacular fashion of course, but he didn't expect them to totally collapse with the death toll that entailed.

Edited September 8, 2023 by welshbairn

[craigkillie]

On 29/08/2023 at 08:53, Salt n Vinegar said:

Oh FFS...

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/05/health/anti-vax-pets-gbr-scli-intl/index.html

Some of the anti-vax lot are now refusing to have their pets vaccinated.

"Daniella Dos Santos, the British Veterinary Association’s junior vice president, said the findings came as no surprise:

“Vets are deeply concerned about the creep of anti-vax sentiments into animal care. Our member survey found that 98% of vets have been questioned by clients about the need for vaccination.”"

I find things like this deeply unhelpful to be honest. I can imagine many pet owners asking that sort of question in perfectly good faith - "My cat never leaves the house, does it really need all these vaccines?", particularly given the cost involved in vaccinating animals.

[Fullerene]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Even Bin Laden was amazed what happened to the Twin Towers, he was hoping for death and destruction in a spectacular fashion of course, but he didn't expect them to totally collapse with the death toll that entailed.

Coming from a family involved in the construction business you would have thought he would have known better.

[welshbairn]

16 minutes ago, Fullerene said:

Coming from a family involved in the construction business you would have thought he would have known better.

Nobody told him about melting girders and that the towers had already been primed with explosives.

[coprolite]

Just realised that according to the South Park AIDS rule, 9/11 should be funny in January, so you’re a bit ahead of schedule with the jokes here.

[HarleyQuinn]