Nathan Paterson

[accies1874]

To everyone's surprise, Celtic fans in general have now fully turned on Ralston and are saying he shouldn't be near their squad, never mind the starting line up.

They just get bored of players, especially Scottish ones, and it doesn't help that they build them up beyond belief.

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[2426255]

36 minutes ago, accies1874 said:

They just get bored of players, especially Scottish ones, and it doesn't help that they build them up beyond belief.

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They're like children, but then there's National Team fans like that too let's face it, they're at every club.

[gannonball]

Didn’t think Ralston was particularly bad last night? Anyway would rather he wasn't in this squad as he's been playing 2 games a week for a while and not been used to it. Still think his time with Scotland will come soon enough though.

[craigkillie]

Ralston is more likely to be playing in League 1 than for Scotland in the next 5 years.

[RandomGuy.]

26 minutes ago, gannonball said:

Didn’t think Ralston was particularly bad last night? Anyway would rather he wasn't in this squad as he's been playing 2 games a week for a while and not been used to it. Still think his time with Scotland will come soon enough though.

If you had a competent board Ralston would've been away out on loan to the Championship this season.

[oneteaminglasgow]

Anthony Ralston will never play for Scotland, thankfully. If we want a clearly not quite up to it stopgap, we can just stick with O’Donnell

[gannonball]

10 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

If you had a competent board Ralston would've been away out on loan to the Championship this season.

Agreed he would most likely be bottom 6 or lower if he left. We have finally ironed out the bad habits he picked up at his last loan club and now becoming a solid enough full back tbh.

[HuttonDressedAsLahm]

55 minutes ago, gannonball said:

Agreed he would most likely be bottom 6 or lower if he left. We have finally ironed out the bad habits he picked up at his last loan club and now becoming a solid enough full back tbh.

We're finally in the enviable position of generally needing international class players for the national team to usurp any of the existing squad.  Days of bodies filling shirts are gone (hopefully, forever) - no more Craig Forsyth etc.

Realistically, unless someone is either already established in the national team, or performing exceptionally well in their position, they don't have a realistic shout at a call up.

The shocking performances of Scottish clubs in Europe this season goes some way to demonstrating the skill gap between our 'average' players and those in Czechia, Sweden, Denmark etc.

Right now, the only player in contention to making the jump would surely be Ramsay, and even then, he is probably a year or two away, and only being considered because the other options are SOD (a limited footballer taking his chance by null alternatives) and Patterson (exciting talent, but zero game time and very little experience).

Outwith Doig and Hickey there's nothing in the most recent u21 graduates, nor the current team to be particularly excited* about right now is there?  

*Could make the jump into full the full NT this season 

Edited October 1, 2021 by HuttonDressedAsLahm

[Tartan Blood]

6 hours ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

We're finally in the enviable position of generally needing international class players for the national team to usurp any of the existing squad.  Days of bodies filling shirts are gone (hopefully, forever) - no more Craig Forsyth etc.

Realistically, unless someone is either already established in the national team, or performing exceptionally well in their position, they don't have a realistic shout at a call up.

The shocking performances of Scottish clubs in Europe this season goes some way to demonstrating the skill gap between our 'average' players and those in Czechia, Sweden, Denmark etc.

Right now, the only player in contention to making the jump would surely be Ramsay, and even then, he is probably a year or two away, and only being considered because the other options are SOD (a limited footballer taking his chance by null alternatives) and Patterson (exciting talent, but zero game time and very little experience).

Outwith Doig and Hickey there's nothing in the most recent u21 graduates, nor the current team to be particularly excited* about right now is there?  

*Could make the jump into full the full NT this season 

Great point. We are quickly moving away from padding out the squad with guys who are just available. Even getting a game for Celtic these days doesn't guarantee you a place, the way it always has in the past.

With the exception of 1 or 2 positions (backup GK, backup striker), it's become incredibly difficult to break into the squad. A purple patch of form (e.g Ralston, Welsh, Morgan, Henderson, Hickey, Gauld) doesn't result in a knee jerk reaction to getting them in. Our standards have risen significantly just in the last couple of years. Lewis Ferguson had to play consistently well for a long period before he got in.

Although you are saying there is no one to be excited about, there always seems to be unknown or unexpected guys to emerge during the season. Think about this time last year. Gilmour, Patterson, Adams and Turnbull were no where near the national team. Ramsey is the most recent new star, but there will be more.

[DiegoDiego]

Think about this time last year. Gilmour, Patterson, Adams and Turnbull were no where near the national team. Ramsey is the most recent new star, but there will be more.

Adams was only nowhere near it as he hadn't committed to Scotland. If it hadn't been for his injury Turnbull would have most likely been in a Scotland squad.

You're correct though, new blood will continue to find its way into the national team.

[sergie's no1 fan]

10 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

If you had a competent board Ralston would've been away out on loan to the Championship this season.

Scottish or English? 

Anyway I'm aboard the Ramsey hype train. 

[Tartan Blood]

1 hour ago, DiegoDiego said:

Adams was only nowhere near it as he hadn't committed to Scotland. If it hadn't been for his injury Turnbull would have most likely been in a Scotland squad.

You're correct though, new blood will continue to find its way into the national team.

Those were the 2 I was referring to as "unexpected". Adams, because we didn't even know he was willing, and Turnbull, because we didn't know if he could recover fully and fulfill his potential.

You can also add in player renaissance like Hanley and Hendry. Who knows what "known" entities will pop their head up as well. My money would be on Souttar. 

[HuttonDressedAsLahm]

2 hours ago, Tartan Blood said:

Those were the 2 I was referring to as "unexpected". Adams, because we didn't even know he was willing, and Turnbull, because we didn't know if he could recover fully and fulfill his potential.

You can also add in player renaissance like Hanley and Hendry. Who knows what "known" entities will pop their head up as well. My money would be on Souttar. 

Souttar‘s return seems a decent prospect. You sense Gallagher may struggle to hold a place. After that, Cooper is the oldest, but has a few years left.

Gauld should feel hard done by that he hasn’t been given a chance yet.

Beyond Ramsay and Hickey, no one appears close, simply on the basis they aren’t performing consistently at a decent level.

Other than Patterson, Rangers haven’t brought through a decent Scottish youngster in years, and they seldom seem to have any more than a couple in their match day squad, and without the keepers, they’d often have zero. Celtic’s are either already established, or young and - right now - far from it (Ralston, Montgomery, Welsh).

Looking at the u21 squad, it’s probably the weakest and least experienced in living memory. That said, those situations can bring surprises.

[RandomGuy.]

4 minutes ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Other than Patterson, Rangers haven’t brought through a decent Scottish youngster in years.

TBF Billy Gilmour is, technically, Rangers developed. He was there from the age of 8 until 16, so they surely deserve some credit for him?

[HuttonDressedAsLahm]

24 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

TBF Billy Gilmour is, technically, Rangers developed. He was there from the age of 8 until 16, so they surely deserve some credit for him?

You’re not wrong, but it goes to show how few it has been.

I wonder how many Celtic-developed players have been capped in the last decade or so, in comparison to Rangers? Maybe the number is higher than I realise.

[Gordopolis]

Dapo Mebude seems a decent prospect too (now at Watford on loan at Wimbledon).
But yeah, by and large it's grim to see the lack of Scottish names on the Rangers first XI and bench.

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[Tartan Blood]

11 hours ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

Souttar‘s return seems a decent prospect. You sense Gallagher may struggle to hold a place. After that, Cooper is the oldest, but has a few years left.

Gauld should feel hard done by that he hasn’t been given a chance yet.

Beyond Ramsay and Hickey, no one appears close, simply on the basis they aren’t performing consistently at a decent level.

Other than Patterson, Rangers haven’t brought through a decent Scottish youngster in years, and they seldom seem to have any more than a couple in their match day squad, and without the keepers, they’d often have zero. Celtic’s are either already established, or young and - right now - far from it (Ralston, Montgomery, Welsh).

Looking at the u21 squad, it’s probably the weakest and least experienced in living memory. That said, those situations can bring surprises.

I'm not sure I agree the u21s are the weakest they've been in decades. Partly because Patterson and Gilmour are still eligible, but are too good for that level. It would look far stronger with them in it. Welsh started the season very well, but has unfortunately been dropped. He may turn out to be a player.

11 hours ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:

You’re not wrong, but it goes to show how few it has been.

I wonder how many Celtic-developed players have been capped in the last decade or so, in comparison to Rangers? Maybe the number is higher than I realise.

Even just looking at the Euros squad alone, you have 8 players that were developed at Celtic: Marshall, Tierney, Robertson, Forrest, Gallagher, Hendry, O'Donnell, McGregor. Then another 5 that were signed by Celtic: Gordon, Taylor, Armstrong, Christie, Turnbull. 13 players directly related to Celtic.

Rangers had 4 in total: McLaughlin, Patterson, Gilmour, Fleck. None of which have been regulars for them (yet). And, yes, Rangers deserve some credit for Gilmour and Patterson, but I think the Performance Schools should get a lot of credit, too.

A pretty shocking disparity between the 2 "biggest" teams in Scotland.

[craigkillie]

Rangers deserve "some" credit for Gilmour and Patterson, but Celtic are quite happily given credit for folk that kicked about in their youth teams for a couple of years but were actually developed into Scotland players elsewhere.

[eez-eh]

1 hour ago, Tartan Blood said:

I'm not sure I agree the u21s are the weakest they've been in decades. Partly because Patterson and Gilmour are still eligible, but are too good for that level. It would look far stronger with them in it. Welsh started the season very well, but has unfortunately been dropped. He may turn out to be a player.

Even just looking at the Euros squad alone, you have 8 players that were developed at Celtic: Marshall, Tierney, Robertson, Forrest, Gallagher, Hendry, O'Donnell, McGregor. Then another 5 that were signed by Celtic: Gordon, Taylor, Armstrong, Christie, Turnbull. 13 players directly related to Celtic.

Rangers had 4 in total: McLaughlin, Patterson, Gilmour, Fleck. None of which have been regulars for them (yet). And, yes, Rangers deserve some credit for Gilmour and Patterson, but I think the Performance Schools should get a lot of credit, too.

A pretty shocking disparity between the 2 "biggest" teams in Scotland.

In what world do Celtic get credit for Robertson, Gallagher, Hendry and O’Donnell?

Edited October 2, 2021 by eez-eh

[Tartan Blood]

1 hour ago, eez-eh said:

In what world do Celtic get credit for Robertson, Gallagher, Hendry and O’Donnell?

In the same world where Rangers get credit for Gilmour - 4 years performance school, and gone at 16. I included them to give Rangers recognition for Gilmour. But you can remove him from Rangers impressive count of 4 if you want.

Edit: Robertson left Celtic at around 15. Hendry left Celtic at 16. O'Donnell left at 19. Gallagher left at 20. If they don't count then Gilmour definitely doesn't count.

Edited October 2, 2021 by Tartan Blood