Ben Reilly Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 Arbroath took 4 points from their 2 Friday night games at Ochilview this season. Not much of a disadvantage really was it? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledLichtie Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 2 hours ago, mcjameos said: ....... but 2 of those were Arbroath home games and only 1 of the others was due to QP. Aye, a game moved for TV (which is fine), and a game moved for the Scotland game (which we should never have allowed). Plenty of complaints on the Arbroath thread at the time. 2 hours ago, D'Jaffo said: In hindsight it’s not really though. Most players will make arrangements to leave work early and they’re given enough warning to do so. The salient point is that Queens Park do not hold any sporting advantage by playing on a Friday night. It’s nonsense. So part time players will be more tired, and will have to make special work arrangements, giving Queens Park a sporting advantage. I'm amazed this is a controversial point. Football at the top level is all about fine margins and small gains. Being in the habit of playing Friday night games will help. Its just like having an artificial pitch gives you a sporting advantage as you get used to your own service. I am amazed that this is a controversial point. Part time players playing against full time teams on Friday nights face a disadvantage. How can this be controversial? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'Jaffo Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 7 minutes ago, ExiledLichtie said: Aye, a game moved for TV (which is fine), and a game moved for the Scotland game (which we should never have allowed). Plenty of complaints on the Arbroath thread at the time. So part time players will be more tired, and will have to make special work arrangements, giving Queens Park a sporting advantage. I'm amazed this is a controversial point. Football at the top level is all about fine margins and small gains. Being in the habit of playing Friday night games will help. Its just like having an artificial pitch gives you a sporting advantage as you get used to your own service. I am amazed that this is a controversial point. Part time players playing against full time teams on Friday nights face a disadvantage. How can this be controversial? I’m amazed you’re still going on about this despite talking utter nonsense. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Your Own Socks Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 1 hour ago, ExiledLichtie said: Aye, a game moved for TV (which is fine), and a game moved for the Scotland game (which we should never have allowed). Plenty of complaints on the Arbroath thread at the time. So part time players will be more tired, and will have to make special work arrangements, giving Queens Park a sporting advantage. I'm amazed this is a controversial point. Football at the top level is all about fine margins and small gains. Being in the habit of playing Friday night games will help. Its just like having an artificial pitch gives you a sporting advantage as you get used to your own service. I am amazed that this is a controversial point. Part time players playing against full time teams on Friday nights face a disadvantage. How can this be controversial? Here’s another solution, in your style. Part-time teams can’t enter the Championship in case the players get too tired. Ridiculous, eh? But just as nuts as your opinion. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlowspider Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 As far as I’m concerned Arbroath should only be allowed to play in the Championship if they do something about the wind, as playing in it every week obviously affords them a clear advantage. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledLichtie Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 8 minutes ago, harlowspider said: As far as I’m concerned Arbroath should only be allowed to play in the Championship if they do something about the wind, as playing in it every week obviously affords them a clear advantage. You know, firstly, its actually hardly ever windy. But then on the rare occasion that it is, that is an example of theoretical sporting advantage, yes. Wouldn't you agree? Just like playing all your home games on Friday nights is a sporting advantage. There's nothing controversial about what I'm saying, even the angry Ayr fan admitted that part time players would be more tired with Friday night football. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledLichtie Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 20 minutes ago, Bring Your Own Socks said: Here’s another solution, in your style. Part-time teams can’t enter the Championship in case the players get too tired. Ridiculous, eh? But just as nuts as your opinion. So here's a thought process that you should try, if there is no advantage to being a full time player over a part time player, why are all clubs not part time? What are the advantages of being a full time club? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlowspider Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 1 hour ago, ExiledLichtie said: You know, firstly, its actually hardly ever windy. But then on the rare occasion that it is, that is an example of theoretical sporting advantage, yes. Wouldn't you agree? Just like playing all your home games on Friday nights is a sporting advantage. There's nothing controversial about what I'm saying, even the angry Ayr fan admitted that part time players would be more tired with Friday night football. Whoosh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledLichtie Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 52 minutes ago, harlowspider said: Whoosh Do you agree or not? Because pretty much every opposition manager who loses a game at Gayfield whines about the wind being an advantage, real or imagined. Its almost a psychological thing. Are you whooshing them too? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuctifano Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 54 minutes ago, harlowspider said: Whoosh 1 minute ago, ExiledLichtie said: Do you agree or not? Because pretty much every opposition manager who loses a game at Gayfield whines about the wind being an advantage, real or imagined. Its almost a psychological thing. Are you whooshing them too? He was just making the sound of the wind at Gayfield imo 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiders4ever Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 7 hours ago, ExiledLichtie said: Do you agree or not? Because pretty much every opposition manager who loses a game at Gayfield whines about the wind being an advantage, real or imagined. Its almost a psychological thing. Are you whooshing them too? More often than not it has been windy at Gayfield when I have watched QP there. The last time I was very surprised that QP dealt with the wind much better than Arbroath did. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neilly Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 Always raises a chortle the absolute nonsense spouted on here during pre-season. We bloody need our football lads don't we? Eye bleeding last few pages. Fair play. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider1975 Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 11 hours ago, ExiledLichtie said: Just like playing all your home games on Friday nights is a sporting advantage. There's nothing controversial about what I'm saying, even the angry Ayr fan admitted that part time players would be more tired with Friday night football. After a very brief perusal of the BBC website for this seasons results, QP played 14 games in total on a Friday and 25 on a Saturday. Of those they won 19 and lost 12, on Saturday's they won 15 (60%) and lost 6 (24%), on Friday's they won 4 (29%) and lost 6 (43%), evidently the facts tend to disagree with your reckoning. With the greatest of respect to them all, I may also add that the opinion of one, solitary Ayr fan probably doesn't constitute consensus nor evidence. The 4G pitch issue is nonsense too, (the only advantage being for the fans who can pretty much guarantee that most games will be played when they are supposed too, save for when they're set alight); if it was an advantage I'm sure we'd have installed one at LH rather than the hybrid surface that we have. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'Jaffo Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 52 minutes ago, Spider1975 said: After a very brief perusal of the BBC website for this seasons results, QP played 14 games in total on a Friday and 25 on a Saturday. Of those they won 19 and lost 12, on Saturday's they won 15 (60%) and lost 6 (24%), on Friday's they won 4 (29%) and lost 6 (43%), evidently the facts tend to disagree with your reckoning. With the greatest of respect to them all, I may also add that the opinion of one, solitary Ayr fan probably doesn't constitute consensus nor evidence. The 4G pitch issue is nonsense too, (the only advantage being for the fans who can pretty much guarantee that most games will be played when they are supposed too, save for when they're set alight); if it was an advantage I'm sure we'd have installed one at LH rather than the hybrid surface that we have. Tbf I didn’t need evidence as the point he was trying to make was nonsense. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledLichtie Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 I really don't see what is so controversial here. As one advantage, teams have an advantage playing at their home ground. Studies show that teams tend to get more referee decisions in their favour at home, and home advantage is a thing. And yet, despite that, some teams still perform better away than at home. That doesn't mean that there isn't a theoretical sporting advantage to being the home team. I just can't believe that people find this to be a controversial point. In the last couple of pages, people have denied that preparation matters, dismissed the difference between full time and part time players, and denied that a familiar playing surface helps. All to deny a very uncontroversial point that regularly playing home games on a Friday presents a theoretical sporting advantage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider1975 Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 17 minutes ago, ExiledLichtie said: As one advantage, teams have an advantage playing at their home ground. Studies show that teams tend to get more referee decisions in their favour at home, and home advantage is a thing. Ah, but that's where your argument with reference, I assume, to QP, (as it's on our thread) breaks down somewhat, in that: a) We weren't playing 'at home' and haven't done for quite a while, and, b) According to most observers we have around 63 fans, so not much advantage to be had there. Genuine questions though; 1. Of your crop of players for the 22/23 season how many were genuine P/T and how many others were on-loan from f/t clubs? 2. Of these loanee's how many went to a P/T basis, (i.e. was Marcel Oakley working in a cafe in Broughty Ferry, part time to supplement his income and the year before was Joel Nouble having to ask for an early stack from tyre fitting at Kwik-Fit?) 3. Of those who were genuinely P/T, what industries were they engaged in? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williebraveheart Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 29 minutes ago, ExiledLichtie said: I really don't see what is so controversial here. As one advantage, teams have an advantage playing at their home ground. Studies show that teams tend to get more referee decisions in their favour at home, and home advantage is a thing. And yet, despite that, some teams still perform better away than at home. That doesn't mean that there isn't a theoretical sporting advantage to being the home team. I just can't believe that people find this to be a controversial point. In the last couple of pages, people have denied that preparation matters, dismissed the difference between full time and part time players, and denied that a familiar playing surface helps. All to deny a very uncontroversial point that regularly playing home games on a Friday presents a theoretical sporting advantage. May you live in your theoretical little world in peace 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Soo-sider Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 1 hour ago, ExiledLichtie said: I really don't see what is so controversial here. As one advantage, teams have an advantage playing at their home ground. Studies show that teams tend to get more referee decisions in their favour at home, and home advantage is a thing. And yet, despite that, some teams still perform better away than at home. That doesn't mean that there isn't a theoretical sporting advantage to being the home team. I just can't believe that people find this to be a controversial point. In the last couple of pages, people have denied that preparation matters, dismissed the difference between full time and part time players, and denied that a familiar playing surface helps. All to deny a very uncontroversial point that regularly playing home games on a Friday presents a theoretical sporting advantage. Stop digging, mate. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arachnophile Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 1 hour ago, ExiledLichtie said: I really don't see what is so controversial here. As one advantage, teams have an advantage playing at their home ground. Studies show that teams tend to get more referee decisions in their favour at home, and home advantage is a thing. And yet, despite that, some teams still perform better away than at home. That doesn't mean that there isn't a theoretical sporting advantage to being the home team. I just can't believe that people find this to be a controversial point. In the last couple of pages, people have denied that preparation matters, dismissed the difference between full time and part time players, and denied that a familiar playing surface helps. All to deny a very uncontroversial point that regularly playing home games on a Friday presents a theoretical sporting advantage. There may (or may not) be a theoretical advantage. However, as Spider 1975 clearly demonstrated there was not any actual advantage. Indeed, you might argue there was an actual disadvantage. There are lots of "theoretical" disadvantages to being a part time outfit. I would imagine, having to play a few games on a Friday night is pretty low down the list. Anyway, I'm quite sure that the great majority of fans of all teams prefer most games to be at 3pm on a Saturday. Hopefully, the fine folk in charge of our team will find a way to make that happen in a stadium where a reasonable number of visiting fans can attend 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arachnophile Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 I did the same exercise for Arbroath as Spider 1975 did for QP This season, Arbroath played 8 Friday night league games & averaged 1.25 points per game. In the rest of their games they averaged 0.86 points per game. I wonder, therefore if part time teams have an advantage when playing on Friday nights - maybe because they are used to running about at 7.45 pm while our pampered full timers are used to lying on their settees watching River City. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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