jimbaxters Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 8 hours ago, Bestsinceslicebread said: I'm not hear to put the junior cup down, there's interest in it, so that is without doubt so true. In regards to your post, your really calling the pot kettle black are you not by ignoring facts. If your trying to prove a point, inform of the positives and negatives, is that not best? The South Challenge cup has nothing to do with the junior cup, its just badly advertised and arranged. There were some suggestions on here how it should be improved and that's something that the organizers of the SCC should take it and hopefully improve the interest in the cup. So haven't got a clue why people who support the junior cup are on here trying to put the pros on for the SJC and cons on for the SCC when its two totally different cups I'm asking you the questions * Did the South Challenge Cup 22/23 have 163 entrants from the East, West and South of Scotland all the while the Scottish junior cup only had 108 entrants from the whole country, is this correct? * Can you tell me why there was more teams involved in the SCC than the SJC and a higher quality? * Many Highland, North and East of Scotland teams and a few West teams did not enter the junior cup this year 22/23, do you know why? * Quite a few teams took huge losses in the earlier rounds of the junior cup 22/23 in regards travelling, Some spending £800 odds a pop travelling long distance and only getting £220 /£260 towards the travel, giving teams over £500 loss or more. Did you know this, regarding the travelling expenses. * Outwit the junior cup, there isn't an apatite for a national trophy, from what I've heard from the past couple of years, the Highlands, North and East are not really interested, would that be fair to say? Me personally, I would like a national non league trophy but can't see it happening for a while. I genuinely loved playing in the junior cup but its outdated and is genuinely becoming less of an interest for many but as you concluded which I wholeheartedly agree with that there is still interest so I don't think it should be binned. The fact that is being pointed out here is that there were circa 400 at the SCC final v seemingly circa 3000 at the SJC final tomorrow. There's something horribly wrong with the SCC that needs fixed. 7 hours ago, Thejackdaw said: They just don't get it mate its like taking 99 percent of the top south American teams out the world cup and saying you've still got the same world cup. (In terms of real top nations it would probably just turn into a glorified European championship in the same way as the current junior cup has turned into a glorified West of Scotland cup ) Regardless of the crowd on Friday night , regardless of how some on here want to try and ham it up , the Scottish cup is a very poor shadow of its former self and I would say the same if the club I supported contested this final. Again, no-one is denying that the SJC is a vastly lesser tournament than it was in terms of participants but the numbers don't lie. People still enjoy it so instead of blindly dismissing it due to nothing more than the word Junior in the title, the formula should be acknowledged and taken on board by those in charge on non league football. It could be great! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
energyzone Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 I went to the recent Troon v Kilwinning match with a friend from work who loves Scottish football and played for several clubs when they were Junior clubs. He had no idea that the Junior Cup was no longer what it was, and was amazed that the winners of the West/East/South leagues played off to be promoted to the Lowland League. I kept having to explain to him what the pyramid was and how all the leagues (are supposed to) feed into each other. Sometimes I think we are in our own bubble here and the advertising and messages from this level really don't get through at all to the wider footballing support. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that most Premiership fans don't have a clue about the current B Team proposition or that we are (mostly) all part of the same league structure now. I would imagine even a lot of fans at this level don't truly appreciate how devalued the SJC is now and how the top East teams and quite a few West ones no longer play in it. We do, because we post on this forum and maintain an interest, but I would reckon a lot of fans of clubs at this level aren't that informed about the politics and just want to support their team. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thejackdaw Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, jimbaxters said: The fact that is being pointed out here is that there were circa 400 at the SCC final v seemingly circa 3000 at the SJC final tomorrow. There's something horribly wrong with the SCC that needs fixed. Again, no-one is denying that the SJC is a vastly lesser tournament than it was in terms of participants but the numbers don't lie. People still enjoy it so instead of blindly dismissing it due to nothing more than the word Junior in the title, the formula should be acknowledged and taken on board by those in charge on non league football. It could be great! The Scottish junior cup was my most favourite tournament at any level of football with Talbot being the undisputed kings of it , however we can't underestimate the role of the top East cracks in it either and for example if you take from the year 2000 until the year 2008 it saw 7 East of Scotland winners taking home the crown jewels, Whitburn Linlithgow x2 Tayport x2 Carnoustie Bathgate I would love the trophy to be kept but in another name and for it to incorporate teams at a ' non league ' level in our country , not in the ' south region cup ' guise or whatever its called as the name in itself needs explained probably even more than the word ' junior ' to outsiders . Jazz it up and get a good sponsor and promote the hell out of it and let's get what were the top East guns (as much as non league allows depending on their level)playing against the top West teams again to get their hands on the famous big trophy . Edited June 1, 2023 by Thejackdaw 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 Any idea if the SJFA are offering up another set of incentives to stay in membership? Wasn't it £400 and a couple of match balls if a club completed all their SJC games? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shannon Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 3 hours ago, energyzone said: I went to the recent Troon v Kilwinning match with a friend from work who loves Scottish football and played for several clubs when they were Junior clubs. He had no idea that the Junior Cup was no longer what it was, and was amazed that the winners of the West/East/South leagues played off to be promoted to the Lowland League. I kept having to explain to him what the pyramid was and how all the leagues (are supposed to) feed into each other. Sometimes I think we are in our own bubble here and the advertising and messages from this level really don't get through at all to the wider footballing support. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that most Premiership fans don't have a clue about the current B Team proposition or that we are (mostly) all part of the same league structure now. I would imagine even a lot of fans at this level don't truly appreciate how devalued the SJC is now and how the top East teams and quite a few West ones no longer play in it. We do, because we post on this forum and maintain an interest, but I would reckon a lot of fans of clubs at this level aren't that informed about the politics and just want to support their team. Totally agree will be a lot of fans at our games that won't know about what's happened with pyramid over last 4-5 years, B teams in the Lowland League, Conference League, 4th Division in West etc and even some people on the committee too. Its only through this and Twitter that most of us keep up to date on what is happening - supporters without access will just go along to games and support their local team and wont care too much about politics of it all. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossilYM Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 3 hours ago, energyzone said: I went to the recent Troon v Kilwinning match with a friend from work who loves Scottish football and played for several clubs when they were Junior clubs. He had no idea that the Junior Cup was no longer what it was, and was amazed that the winners of the West/East/South leagues played off to be promoted to the Lowland League. I kept having to explain to him what the pyramid was and how all the leagues (are supposed to) feed into each other. Sometimes I think we are in our own bubble here and the advertising and messages from this level really don't get through at all to the wider footballing support. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that most Premiership fans don't have a clue about the current B Team proposition or that we are (mostly) all part of the same league structure now. I would imagine even a lot of fans at this level don't truly appreciate how devalued the SJC is now and how the top East teams and quite a few West ones no longer play in it. We do, because we post on this forum and maintain an interest, but I would reckon a lot of fans of clubs at this level aren't that informed about the politics and just want to support their team. Only one major forum outside of P&B which regularly discuss our level of football, B teams and wummins fitba. Going by what's written on it it's obvious a lot of the posters have a connection to Wosfl and Eosfl teams and maybe not just as fans. Seen some pretty detailed knowledge which could only have come from coaching staff or blazers. Oh and the the forum is called..........Follow Follow Worth thinking about when words like bigots get fired about on here. Btw for the five Russian sleepers living in that cottage opposite Faslane submarine base that haven't heard of Follow Follow it's the top fans forum for Glasgow Rangers FC 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marten Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 40 minutes ago, Shannon said: Totally agree will be a lot of fans at our games that won't know about what's happened with pyramid over last 4-5 years, B teams in the Lowland League, Conference League, 4th Division in West etc and even some people on the committee too. Its only through this and Twitter that most of us keep up to date on what is happening - supporters without access will just go along to games and support their local team and wont care too much about politics of it all. I get that in this part of the country too. At Lochee United I get the idea that most people know that if we were to win the league, we get in a play-off for promotion to the Highland League as we are licensed. But that's largely down to the club communicating to the fans about this and making clear that our medium-term objective is to achieve exactly that. When I speak to fans and even committee members of other clubs in the area I often get puzzled looks when I talk about a potential HL play-off if the ML has a licensed champion. People are more aware of changes in the East due to the amount of clubs leaving our league, but the HL pyramid being established is something many people here are still not really aware of. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, energyzone said: I went to the recent Troon v Kilwinning match with a friend from work who loves Scottish football and played for several clubs when they were Junior clubs. He had no idea that the Junior Cup was no longer what it was, and was amazed that the winners of the West/East/South leagues played off to be promoted to the Lowland League. I kept having to explain to him what the pyramid was and how all the leagues (are supposed to) feed into each other. Sometimes I think we are in our own bubble here and the advertising and messages from this level really don't get through at all to the wider footballing support. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that most Premiership fans don't have a clue about the current B Team proposition or that we are (mostly) all part of the same league structure now. I would imagine even a lot of fans at this level don't truly appreciate how devalued the SJC is now and how the top East teams and quite a few West ones no longer play in it. We do, because we post on this forum and maintain an interest, but I would reckon a lot of fans of clubs at this level aren't that informed about the politics and just want to support their team. That's not surprising though is it, if you rely on the bigger media outlets and your own club to keep you informed. The SJFA aren't going to come out and shout about how they've lost 50 clubs from the Junior Cup in recent years when promoting their competition. Clubs that are still in the cup aren't going to point out how it's easier to get to the latter stages without the east clubs, or how it's basically a WOS Cup at the last 16 or QFs. The BBC Alba coverage of the last two finals didn't cover the loss of clubs either. Same with promotion from the WOS and the B teams, if you're not in the top half of the Premier Division then it doesn't really affect your club all that much. I know people say 200 clubs would be relegated, but in reality if you are a club in tier 9 then it doesn't really matter if that becomes tier 10. Edited June 1, 2023 by Ginaro 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) Off topic ano.There is another subject that has been undervalued, the east and west forums.Before it was the junior forum for both.Now it's east and west.Above is the Lowland league forum,league 2 etc etc Why is it not the tier 5 forum,tier 6 etc etc? We were all a bit more informed back in the day when we were all reading from the same pages. We are missing out on all the banter and the threads when east teams draw west teams in cup competitions and league leaders heading for the play offs. No am not stuck in the dark ages of the junior forum.I support a tier 6 team which has different leagues, same as before, maybe something that Div should look at as the previous set up had loads of views. Edited June 1, 2023 by happy 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Pennel Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 3 hours ago, happy said: I support a tier 5 team. Who do you support, Happy ? Talbot are still in tier six at the moment. Not making a point, just saying... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy Posted June 1, 2023 Share Posted June 1, 2023 55 minutes ago, Black Pennel said: Who do you support, Happy ? Talbot are still in tier six at the moment. Not making a point, just saying... FTFY (senior moment) and at this rate it could be tier 7. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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