The Queen of the South thread

[Skyline Drifter]

32 minutes ago, QoS_Blue1919 said:

We’re at least £25’000 up, probably £35’000 (+ a potential big tie against a Celtic, Rangers, Hibs etc).

Excellent news. How exactly?

[baw heid]

1 hour ago, 19QOS19 said:

1 hour ago, baw heid said:

Great support last night who got right behind our young CB semple when he was getting abuse from the Motherwell fans. I really enjoyed the game. Set up to score in the first half but didn't take our chances. Tighter in the second and a clean second half sheet.  we will be fine this year. We must remember this is a new young back 4 and still need time to settle in. the managers ability to alter the set up gives me encouragement

They are still relatively young but they have had plenty of experience. 3 of the 4 were in our back 4 for the majority of last season. I'm not advocating our players being constantly criticised, but at the same time folk can't expect the fans not to air their views.

I would rather listen to the views of the fans at Fir Park yesterday. I have always been a fan of watching a good defence and yes they can be critised  My point is that little critism is posted regarding missed chances but with Callum Semple now playing the line is new and will only get better the more they play together 

[steakpiegravy]

I wasn’t comfortable with the defence last night either but to be fair they’re unlikely to come up against a Sammon every week. More worried about the lack of options off the bench when we need to change things up. Not convinced we’ve got the depth yet to keep up a sustained run in the championship.

[SUPERSOUTH]

14 minutes ago, steakpiegravy said:

I wasn’t comfortable with the defence last night either but to be fair they’re unlikely to come up against a Sammon every week. More worried about the lack of options off the bench when we need to change things up. Not convinced we’ve got the depth yet to keep up a sustained run in the championship.

Must get at least one other striker and a midfielder signed prob on loan. 

Edited July 25, 2018 by SUPERSOUTH

[jakeyman]

I may be wrong so open to any changes.

 

Qualification

 

Still some games to be played tonight so still a bit unclear.

 

Easiest scenario is Clyde and Motherwell draw or Clyde win. Either result would see us through as group winners.

 

Group A  Ross C play Arbroath tonight and assuming a win for them they would be on to  9 points and Alloa 8 points and they play each other last game. Assuming Ross C don’t win by 5 or more goals tonight then a win for Alloa or Ross County would mean we finish better than the 2^nd place team on GD. A draw would also do us provided Ross C won the penalties. Will know better tomorrow.

 

Group B Montrose play Forfar tonight and unless they win by 7 clear goals then we are better off than 2^nd place in that group.

 

Group C Inverness play Hearts on Sunday and we are bound to finish better off than one of them so that group can be discounted.

 

Group D They all play tonight so a bit more complicated

 

Group E Anything bar an Ayr win or a win for Partick by 3 clear goals would mean that 2^nd in that group would finish above us. They play each other in the last game.

 

Group F Livingston play Berwick and Airdrie play Hamilton. One would assume Livingston would beat Berwick so our best hope is Hamilton beating Airdrie by any score or a narrow win for Airdrie

 

Group H Kilmarnock play Queens Park and St Mirren play Dumbarton. Again you would assume Kilmarnock would win, however anything less than a win and we would be better off than them.  St Mirren would have to beat Dumbarton by 8 clear goals and they are yet to win a game with three draws all won on penalties.

 

We are already guaranteed finishing 7^th best 2^nd place, and barring strange results we should be better off than B and H, I know that doesn't quite get us there but our GD certainly helps.

 

[19QOS19]

Of course I am not saying that.
what I am saying if we draw say 1 1 .......as it stands quite a few will target the defence for conceding and not the front line for not taking their chances.
The defence is clearly in better shape than last season even with the inclusion of only Semple.
how many clean sheets do we need to move forward from Last season?
do you think the forward line deserve the same critique for missing several chances last night? Or is it just down to the back four? When does the midfield get questioned on their defensive qualities or are they just around to attack?
At the end of the day we all want the same thing so let’s not fall out over this
 
 

If we draw 1-1 and the defence lose a goal due to bad defending then they'll be questioned. Same as if Dobbie misses a one-on-one he'd be questioned. You're painting a picture that only the defence receives any sort of criticism. Did you not see and hear the abuse Dykes took last season? Even Dobbie had grumbles directed towards him. The GK debate still rages on, we still discuss and critique who should be our starting wide players and on a personal note the player I criticised last night was Jacobs. All over the pitch we discuss/praise/criticise the side. The defence gets it worse when they appear to concede the same goals time after time. Do I really need to pull out the crosses/setpiece stats again?

We're going to concede goals next season, that's a given. But we can always look into how we could have prevented the goal. It's not a coincidence that more often than not the finger can be pointed at poor defending.

It's still early days for me to agree that "the defence is clearly in better shape than last season" given we haven't really been tested yet. They didn't disgrace themselves last night but lets give it 10 games or so in our league to see if we've improved.

I would rather listen to the views of the fans at Fir Park yesterday. I have always been a fan of watching a good defence and yes they can be critised  My point is that little critism is posted regarding missed chances but with Callum Semple now playing the line is new and will only get better the more they play together 

I was at the game last. See above: did you miss the criticism Dykes received last season? He was the most criticised player in our side. Even this season Dobbie has been criticsed for not passing or taking too many touches.

The back line is 75% the same as last season so it's not really "new" just slightly different. I think Semple is better than Brownlie from what I've seen so hopefully we improve as a unit with him in there.

[Guest Flash]

16 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Yeah, I think we're pretty much there looking at it. St Mirren failing to beat Queens Park gets us over the line just about I think.

Motherwell now need to win outright at Clyde to win the group (or draw 4-4 or higher and win the penalty shoot out). Presuming they do so though we're probably still good for a best runner up spot:

We are guaranteed already to be better than the runner up in Group C. We will finish above the runner up in Group B unless Montrose beat Forfar by SEVEN tomorrow. We will finish above the runner up in Group H unless St Mirren beat Dumbarton by EIGHT goals.  We will finish above the runner up in Group F unless Airdrie beat Hamilton by 3 goals.

Even if one of those things happened:
We finish above the runner up in Group A unless County beat Arbroath and then lose to Alloa on penalties.
We finish above the runner up in Group E unless Ayr and Partick draw in 90 minutes or Partick win by a single goal margin.
We finish above the runner up in Group D if Dundee don't win their last two games by a combined five goal margin (or 4 goals whilst scoring at least 9 goals in the two games).

It would take a heck of a combination of results to knock us out. We could even get through tomorrow night if County don't win, Montrose don't win by 7 and Dundee fail to win. Granted that's fairly unlikely.

Motherwell are unlikely to be seeded with a best possible of 10 pts so we won't meet them again in the next round. Dunfermline will likely get 12. So might County (if they beat Arbroath and Alloa) and any winner in the Ayr / Partick game will too. Inverness might still get 12 though they were fortunate tonight and Livingston appear very likely to get 11. St Johnstone should probably also get 11. Motherwell would likely be 6th or 7th of the group winners if they win (and if they don't beat Clyde we'd be the 8th ranked).

SD covered it last night, although I think if Thistle beat Ayr 5-3, Ayr will finish above us. If it is 4-2, our record and Ayr’s will be identical, including away goals scored, meaning a drawing of lots if both teams aren’t already through or out. So a 2 goal defeat for Ayr could, in theory, be enough for them, provided they score at least twice.

[baw heid]

16 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

If we draw 1-1 and the defence lose a goal due to bad defending then they'll be questioned. Same as if Dobbie misses a one-on-one he'd be questioned. You're painting a picture that only the defence receives any sort of criticism. Did you not see and hear the abuse Dykes took last season? Even Dobbie had grumbles directed towards him. The GK debate still rages on, we still discuss and critique who should be our starting wide players and on a personal note the player I criticised last night was Jacobs. All over the pitch we discuss/praise/criticise the side. The defence gets it worse when they appear to concede the same goals time after time. Do I really need to pull out the crosses/setpiece stats again?

We're going to concede goals next season, that's a given. But we can always look into how we could have prevented the goal. It's not a coincidence that more often than not the finger can be pointed at poor defending.

It's still early days for me to agree that "the defence is clearly in better shape than last season" given we haven't really been tested yet. They didn't disgrace themselves last night but lets give it 10 games or so in our league to see if we've improved.
I was at the game last. See above: did you miss the criticism Dykes received last season? He was the most criticised player in our side. Even this season Dobbie has been criticsed for not passing or taking too many touches.

The back line is 75% the same as last season so it's not really "new" just slightly different. I think Semple is better than Brownlie from what I've seen so hopefully we improve as a unit with him in there.

Not tested  Didn't you see the game against Hearts  Its that performance that gives me encouragement

[19QOS19]

Not tested  Didn't you see the game against Hearts  Its that performance that gives me encouragement

I didn't. I never look into friendlies too much though. Time will tell if we've improved at the back.

[SueSue]

44 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

If we draw 1-1 and the defence lose a goal due to bad defending then they'll be questioned. Same as if Dobbie misses a one-on-one he'd be questioned. You're painting a picture that only the defence receives any sort of criticism. Did you not see and hear the abuse Dykes took last season? Even Dobbie had grumbles directed towards him. The GK debate still rages on, we still discuss and critique who should be our starting wide players and on a personal note the player I criticised last night was Jacobs. All over the pitch we discuss/praise/criticise the side. The defence gets it worse when they appear to concede the same goals time after time. Do I really need to pull out the crosses/setpiece stats again?

We're going to concede goals next season, that's a given. But we can always look into how we could have prevented the goal. It's not a coincidence that more often than not the finger can be pointed at poor defending.

It's still early days for me to agree that "the defence is clearly in better shape than last season" given we haven't really been tested yet. They didn't disgrace themselves last night but lets give it 10 games or so in our league to see if we've improved.
I was at the game last. See above: did you miss the criticism Dykes received last season? He was the most criticised player in our side. Even this season Dobbie has been criticsed for not passing or taking too many touches.

The back line is 75% the same as last season so it's not really "new" just slightly different. I think Semple is better than Brownlie from what I've seen so hopefully we improve as a unit with him in there.

Answered every point my friend.

lets see where the season takes us

[QosLoyal]

I wasn’t comfortable with the defence last night either but to be fair they’re unlikely to come up against a Sammon every week. More worried about the lack of options off the bench when we need to change things up. Not convinced we’ve got the depth yet to keep up a sustained run in the championship.

This. 2 or 3 new faces are a must. Bench is young and i wouldnt be too confident of any of the guys coming on and changing the game in our favour.

[QoS_Blue1919]

3 hours ago, the tactician said:

dont see where people are getting the 4-4-2 formation from? it looked an obvious 4-2-3-1 in both halves the just switched players around the second half which suited us more

Was a 4-4-2/4-4-1-1 in the first half, Lyndon dropping deeper than dobbie often. Any manager would be absolutely insane to play Harkins CDM and Doyle RAM. Was obviously a 4-4-2, and when it went 4-2-3-1, it was clear KJ and Doyle were deeper 2nd half

[Skyline Drifter]

3 hours ago, Flash said:

SD covered it last night, although I think if Thistle beat Ayr 5-3, Ayr will finish above us. If it is 4-2, our record and Ayr’s will be identical, including away goals scored, meaning a drawing of lots if both teams aren’t already through or out. So a 2 goal defeat for Ayr could, in theory, be enough for them, provided they score at least twice.

Yes, fair enough. I didn't even consider the prospect of such a high scoring game but given that:

1 - There's already been a 5-3 in our own games.

2 - I went to the trouble of mentioning a potential 4-4 draw for Motherwell against Clyde, and

3 - I'm a complete pedant,

I should have detailed it anyway. You are absolutely right.

I'm still going to stick my neck out and say we've done enough to make the last 16 though. We'll probably end up being 2nd or 3rd runner up. I'll be interested to see if anyone does get 9 and not get through though. Fair chance Montrose might.

[Skyline Drifter]

So presuming Motherwell do win the group we are all but through after tonight anyway.

We are now guaranteed to be better than the runner up in Groups A, B and C.

We will finish above the runner up in Group H unless St Mirren beat Dumbarton by EIGHT goals. 

We will finish above the runner up in Group F unless Airdrie beat Hamilton by 3 goals.

We finish above the runner up in Group E unless Ayr and Partick draw in 90 minutes or Partick win by a single goal margin or by 4-2 or a higher two goal margin.

We finish above the runner up in Group D if Dundee don't win by three at Brechin.

Just need one of those four scenarios to happen. I expect at least two of them to do so. 

Edited July 25, 2018 by Skyline Drifter

[Dumfries Boy(new acc)]

When's the draw, Straight after the Inverness game? We SHOULD be in it but if st mirren win by 8 goals then im calling a match fixing scandal.

[queenslad]

injury time equaliser to grab a draw against mid annandale tonight

[SueSue]

Good news after tonight’s fixtures.

well deserved and a massive positive compared to last seasons Betfred Cup nightmare.

 

[Dumfries Boy(new acc)]

Just now, queenslad said:

 

injury time equaliser to grab a draw against mid annandale tonight

 

What was the team?

[Guest Flash]

14 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

So presuming Motherwell do win the group we are all but through after tonight anyway.

We are now guaranteed to be better than the runner up in Groups A, B and C.

We will finish above the runner up in Group H unless St Mirren beat Dumbarton by EIGHT goals. 

We will finish above the runner up in Group F unless Airdrie beat Hamilton by 3 goals.

We finish above the runner up in Group E unless Ayr and Partick draw in 90 minutes or Partick win by a single goal margin or by 4-2 or a higher two goal margin.

We finish above the runner up in Group D if Dundee don't win by three at Brechin.

Just need one of those four scenarios to happen. I expect at least two of them to do so. 

Airdrie will finish above us if they win 4-2 by virtue of scoring more away goals. 

[weeredbook]

9 minutes ago, Dumfries Boy(new acc) said:

What was the team?

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