Sermani Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 23 hours ago, Clyde01 said: I did say COULD rather than SHOULD but the SoS has already lost Threave, if a couple of other bigger teams defect over is there much of a future for the league, especially at tier 6? Progression into the lower reaches of the west would be gentler than straight into the lowland league which Dalbeattie indicated they didn’t really fancy anyway (despite also being miles off it on the field). It would also allow some new blood into the league, the likes of Kello rovers could easily drop in there. The SOSFL teams COULD easily say stuff that, were quite happy as we are. Over the years some of the "bigger teams" have came and went EOSFL, sometimes putting a reserve team in the south. Annan left 2008, Threave and Star 2012 but have since came back. The league is still going, Teams with long histories and hard working volunteers. Tier 6 ? is that what all this debating is all about? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AML67 Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 On 31/05/2024 at 04:47, Benidorm said: The SOS ability wise is at or lower than div 4 of the West. We seen Dalbeattie barely beat Carluke last year who finished what 4th/5th bottom of d4, despite having an extra man for about 70 minutes of the game. Coupled with heavy defeats against higher ranked teams this tells the story. Don't see any reason why division 4 couldn't be further regionalised with say South Ayrshire/Lanarkshire teams playing in the South whilst it saves the outliers at the other end like Campbeltown from having to travel this far on a regular basis. If it wants to be a senior league then it can't shy away from travel of some sort or playing other clubs with infrastructure IMO. If you don't want that, join the Dumfries Sunday amateurs, set up your own local amateur league solely for clubs within your preferred travel area or there's even Sat/Sun leagues in and around Carlisle as well. Travelling to Girvan or Stonehouse from D&G should not be a far off land for a senior football club. In recent times Lochar have beaten EOSFL Premier side Jeanfield Swifts away from home , Newton Stewart beat Preston Athletic in the Scottish Cup and gave Lowland League side Caley Braves a real game for an hour in the next round then beat Cambuslang Rangers ( who were in the Premier at the time away from home ) in the Challenge Cup ! Both these teams have defeated LL side Gretna 2008 this season too so what’s to say we should be pegged on to the very bottom of the West even if it was an option ? The regionalisation you suggest would be fantastic in my opinion but will the teams from the West ever consider such an option ? Travelling isn’t the problem as some matches involve 150 / 200 mile round trips for the Wigtownshire sides to Uppers / Sanquhar etc and vice versa so for you to suggest they simply join the local Sunday league is frankly embarrassing Have you ever been to a South match and do you really know anything about the member Clubs ? 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clinically Proven Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 (edited) There are teams in the Sunday Central League who play at places with floodlights, dugouts and barriers like Renfrew Leisure Centre, the teams all turn up in club tracksuits as opposed to their own clothes, one club in Glasgow last year I even knew had a fitness coach. Doesn't make those clubs anything more than mere amateurs either. I'm not sure that a poor South team would beat a team in the Sunday Central, especially the good ones, so what's the difference? The simple status of being tier 6? Cause I'm not certain that it's setup or ability. Edited June 1 by Clinically Proven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amigan Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 It doesn't matter. Apart from the play off game being pretty one sided, everyone is happy where they are so why change it? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hossy87 Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 4 hours ago, Clinically Proven said: There are teams in the Sunday Central League who play at places with floodlights, dugouts and barriers like Renfrew Leisure Centre, the teams all turn up in club tracksuits as opposed to their own clothes, one club in Glasgow last year I even knew had a fitness coach. Doesn't make those clubs anything more than mere amateurs either. I'm not sure that a poor South team would beat a team in the Sunday Central, especially the good ones, so what's the difference? The simple status of being tier 6? Cause I'm not certain that it's setup or ability. Three beers? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 13 hours ago, amigan said: It doesn't matter. Apart from the play off game being pretty one sided, everyone is happy where they are so why change it? A: The former West Juniors are unhappy that having followed a bunch of clowns and being late to the party, their inevitable rise to the top of the non-SPFL ranks (and onwards) hasn't come to pass. This is the SoS' fault because Reasons. I suspect the bigger agenda at play is that the West Juniors want automatic promotion at tier 6 - joined in this cause by assorted pyramid anoraks who need to fulfil their bizarre fixation with 'ventilation'. But automatic promotion can only be sold as a viable option if the South can be removed from the equation and put in their rightful wee box well beneath Irvine Meadow XI and other such real non-league clubs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 13 hours ago, Hossy87 said: Three beers? Three jellies. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 (edited) 15 minutes ago, virginton said: A: The former West Juniors are unhappy that having followed a bunch of clowns and being late to the party, their inevitable rise to the top of the non-SPFL ranks (and onwards) hasn't come to pass. This is the SoS' fault because Reasons. I suspect the bigger agenda at play is that the West Juniors want automatic promotion at tier 6 - joined in this cause by assorted pyramid anoraks who need to fulfil their bizarre fixation with 'ventilation'. But automatic promotion can only be sold as a viable option if the South can be removed from the equation and put in their rightful wee box well beneath Irvine Meadow XI and other such real non-league clubs. I genuinely don't understand why those West Superleague loyalists insist on linking further promotion spots with the SOSL's place at tier 6. It gains absolutely nothing and alienates people who may otherwise be in agreement with them. Edited June 2 by Bad Wolf 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amnarab Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Maybe consider the SoS Champions nominating which League they would like to join e.g WOSL 4,3,2,1 and then play the 3rd team in the League above in a play off. So if they want to join WOSL 2 then they would play the third team in WOSL 3 in a two legged play off. At least this would give the SoS a more realistic chance of advancing up the pyramid and maybe making the SoS more competitive. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Absolute Imposter Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 6 hours ago, amnarab said: Maybe consider the SoS Champions nominating which League they would like to join e.g WOSL 4,3,2,1 and then play the 3rd team in the League above in a play off. So if they want to join WOSL 2 then they would play the third team in WOSL 3 in a two legged play off. At least this would give the SoS a more realistic chance of advancing up the pyramid and maybe making the SoS more competitive. I understand a lot of posters are sympathetic to the position the SOSFL is in with regards to being at tier 6 and struggling against the 2 other leagues in the Lowland area. The only long term answer for me is a properly thought out dialogue mainly between the WOSFL and SOSFL to have a better balanced pyramid in the west of the Lowland. Then the agreed plan put forward to the other leagues and the SFA for 'ratification'. The format for tier 6 and below is probably best served with a further regionalisation starting at possibly tier 8. But the only solution is for all parties to talk and agree on a path forward. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 7 hours ago, amnarab said: Maybe consider the SoS Champions nominating which League they would like to join e.g WOSL 4,3,2,1 and then play the 3rd team in the League above in a play off. So if they want to join WOSL 2 then they would play the third team in WOSL 3 in a two legged play off. At least this would give the SoS a more realistic chance of advancing up the pyramid and maybe making the SoS more competitive. How would joining WoSL 4 be part of a team advancing up the pyramid? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amnarab Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 2 hours ago, virginton said: How would joining WoSL 4 be part of a team advancing up the pyramid? Not exactly saying that. I said the SoS Winners might nominate the League they think they are capable of competing in. Dalbeattie could choose to compete in WOSL 2, but to prove their worth would play off against 3rd place in WOSL 3. Argument is not about pyramid as much as playing more competitive matches thereby attracting better players. The jump to Lowland League is obviously too great a leap. I don't think they would match any WOSL 1 Clubs. Therefore have a 5 year plan of getting to WOSL Premier. That gives them time to bring players through and work on sponsorship. But as others have mentioned, Clubs and Associations need to get together and work out what they themselves want. Supporters have suggestions but only the Clubs themselves can make proposals. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) How does playing more competitive matches attract better players? And why would it magically attract them to, say, Dalbeattie over all the other clubs playing in the same division? Edited June 21 by vikingTON 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annan4eva Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 19 hours ago, An Absolute Imposter said: I understand a lot of posters are sympathetic to the position the SOSFL is in with regards to being at tier 6 and struggling against the 2 other leagues in the Lowland area. The only long term answer for me is a properly thought out dialogue mainly between the WOSFL and SOSFL to have a better balanced pyramid in the west of the Lowland. Then the agreed plan put forward to the other leagues and the SFA for 'ratification'. The format for tier 6 and below is probably best served with a further regionalisation starting at possibly tier 8. But the only solution is for all parties to talk and agree on a path forward. For me this is now officially Rocket Science, lets just play Fitba. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sermani Posted June 22 Share Posted June 22 On 21/06/2024 at 09:52, amnarab said: Maybe consider the SoS Champions nominating which League they would like to join e.g WOSL 4,3,2,1 and then play the 3rd team in the League above in a play off. So if they want to join WOSL 2 then they would play the third team in WOSL 3 in a two legged play off. At least this would give the SoS a more realistic chance of advancing up the pyramid and maybe making the SoS more competitive. When would the SOSFL clubs decide what league they might try to get promoted to? Pre-mid-end of season? What would happen to the beaten WOSFL club? would a Glasgow based club fancy being relegated to the much maligned South league? or would the West leagues just reshuffle? The SOSFL could just play 3rd in the Premier with no intention of promotion, get a big crowd in, make some money, do that every season and the gap between the teams in the South would widen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dev Posted June 23 Share Posted June 23 On 21/06/2024 at 16:56, An Absolute Imposter said: I understand a lot of posters are sympathetic to the position the SOSFL is in with regards to being at tier 6 and struggling against the 2 other leagues in the Lowland area. The only long term answer for me is a properly thought out dialogue mainly between the WOSFL and SOSFL to have a better balanced pyramid in the west of the Lowland. Then the agreed plan put forward to the other leagues and the SFA for 'ratification'. The format for tier 6 and below is probably best served with a further regionalisation starting at possibly tier 8. But the only solution is for all parties to talk and agree on a path forward. This. The lowest Divisions of the WoS should be regionalised. The only way forward for clubs from the SoS area (excluding current SPFL clubs), even after Gretna eventually comes down to the SoS, would be for a wealthy backer or backers to come along and to buy a club's way back up the Pyramid. Without that it's down to the League and its' clubs to work on improving standards via more and better coaching from early ages. Improving facilities would help to keep youngsters in the sport too - see Lochar Thistle's efforts to improve. Also, eventually, helping women's football will help men's football too as more people are brought into the sport. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Absolute Imposter Posted June 24 Share Posted June 24 23 hours ago, Dev said: This. The lowest Divisions of the WoS should be regionalised. The only way forward for clubs from the SoS area (excluding current SPFL clubs), even after Gretna eventually comes down to the SoS, would be for a wealthy backer or backers to come along and to buy a club's way back up the Pyramid. Without that it's down to the League and its' clubs to work on improving standards via more and better coaching from early ages. Improving facilities would help to keep youngsters in the sport too - see Lochar Thistle's efforts to improve. Also, eventually, helping women's football will help men's football too as more people are brought into the sport. I don't see enough of youth football, but there does appear to be a vibrant youth system in D&G. Did see both Lochar and Threave at U20 last season and was impressed with the talent on show. So feel the area is producing talent. A big problem down here as I am now learning, is the numbers of players available. The population of the whole of D&G is circa 150K and when you look at the population of the towns and villages that support teams it highlights the issues. In Wigtonshire there are 3 clubs all close to one another, the total population in the area is around 10K or even less, same issue in the Stewartry 3 clubs maybe 15K in whole area. When Broxburn played Star I read the town of Broxburn alone has a population of 17K, that shines a light on football in the SOSFL. Honestly the clubs for the most part down here are flourishing being clubs for their community and until the EOSFL increased and the WOSFL came on the scene, nobody cared about football down here. It's only a problem now because the SOSFL shouldn't be at tier 6 and should do the decent thing and just drop down to wherever they want get in the way. Doing this would allow all those proper teams to get on with making the pyramid work properly for them. South clubs are in the pyramid and deserve to be treated with respect. If the pyramid had been set up properly then the south clubs would be at a level where they could flourish and not be seen as this joke of a league that really should know its place. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted June 24 Share Posted June 24 1 hour ago, An Absolute Imposter said: It's only a problem now because the SOSFL shouldn't be at tier 6 and should do the decent thing and just drop down to wherever they want get in the way. Doing this would allow all those proper teams to get on with making the pyramid work properly for them. South clubs are in the pyramid and deserve to be treated with respect. If the pyramid had been set up properly then the south clubs would be at a level where they could flourish and not be seen as this joke of a league that really should know its place. Being seen that way by a handful of ex-Junior roasters who are venting about a) their own league's failure to get on board with the pyramid setup and b) additional failure to produce a licensed champion for promotion really should not influence anyone running the SoSL, or change its place within the Scottish pyramid system. There's absolutely no obstacle put in the way of any club 'making the pyramid work' by the current inter-league structure. Those obstacles are entirely self-contained to the WoSL but will likely be resolved soon enough anyway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Absolute Imposter Posted June 24 Share Posted June 24 5 minutes ago, virginton said: Being seen that way by a handful of ex-Junior roasters who are venting about a) their own league's failure to get on board with the pyramid setup and b) additional failure to produce a licensed champion for promotion really should not influence anyone running the SoSL, or change its place within the Scottish pyramid system. There's absolutely no obstacle put in the way of any club 'making the pyramid work' by the current inter-league structure. Those obstacles are entirely self-contained to the WoSL but will likely be resolved soon enough anyway. For once we are in agreement, I know we disagree on the souths future 'place' in the pyramid. Nothing wrong with that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParkTheBusFitbaPod Posted July 24 Share Posted July 24 https://parkthebusfitbapodcast.buzzsprout.com/1595431/15466249-south-of-scotland-preview Our podcast previewing the South of Scotland league Please be kind 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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