dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 May have been covered before but why are they cutting sides anyway? Could they not benefit from expanding their tourney perhaps into two leagues with promotion / relegation? Or am I asking a daft question?? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddfg Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 May have been covered before but why are they cutting sides anyway? Could they not benefit from expanding their tourney perhaps into two leagues with promotion / relegation? Or am I asking a daft question?? I am sure I read somewhere crowds are dwindling badly as supporters don't like the conference system.[emoji79] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 May have been covered before but why are they cutting sides anyway? Could they not benefit from expanding their tourney perhaps into two leagues with promotion / relegation? Or am I asking a daft question?? I think the format they had was awkward and confusing. That and crowd numbers were falling across super rugby. Jaguares have had decent couple of season but sun wolves aren't great although improving. And NZ are utterly dominant in the competitionI had read that an Australian franchise could join the Japanese top league so to still keep all the franchises and open up new markets to Australian rugby. But that was on the assumption it was the rebels to be cut as there would only be an hour of difference in the time zone. But Perth is out the way of everyone so who knows. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 I am sure I read somewhere crowds are dwindling badly as supporters don't like the conference system.[emoji79] That and the teams don't play each other at least once they play 15 rounds and then the playoffs. But you don't play every single team in those 15 rounds. In fairness it's pretty shit system but good rugby on show 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Oh.....so the conference format that we are adopting is unpopular with fans.....ahhh...awkward. Was there never any discussion about bringing in enough sides to make two tiers? Certainly what I'd personally like to see hope with pro14. Promotion n relegation would make for more meaningful games. Eta I get that the nz sides dominating isn't great but things can change. Not that long ago Glasgow were a joke n the Irish sides were dominant. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honestly united Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 (edited) been away so just catching up on things but thoughts on the following, Pro14 The Pro12 needs much more income or all the best players are going move to France or England who have much more money to spend. The 2 SA teams are going to double the existing TV money as a start. 2 conferences is not ideal but 26 league games would be too many. I think it will stick at 2 conferences if / when the US & Canadians join, then move to 2 leages of 10 if they can find another 4 teams from somewhere. Dont like the additional derby game just so the Irish and Welsh teams can play each other h&a, but its the best of a bad lot Semi-Pro Super 6 league Not sure what to make of this - something had to happen at the level below Pro14 in Scotland so kudos on the SRU for doing something, and I can see where they are trying to go with ringfencing all the professional players in one competition - it looks like 3 clubs each will come under the umberella (and obviously get fringe players from) Glasgow and Edinburgh so they are not spread as thinly as present ( at the moment in league games one club could be boosted by 2 or 3 pro's and the other wont have any). However the money they are talking about is peanuts - about £140 k over 35 players is £4k each or £200 a game. Also dictating that the other teams can pay players is abhorrent, does this include coaches etc as well? It means that players / coaches are not going to advance to bigger clubs as they are just going to stay local. I would like to see them trying to get involved with some cross border competitions with the Italian league or joining the 3rd tier European competition, but I suppose they should now at least be competitive in the B&I cup. Super Rugby I think the issue is their conference system was trying to copy the NFL system, and they also have a much shorter season traditionally than in hte NH hence only 15 games (and why they lose all the best players to France as they dont have as much income). Rugby has only recently introduced league systems (its only about 30 odd years since there was no league rugby in England and it was all just friendlies and the John Player cup). I dont know what format the Super Rugby are going to adopt now, I think its down to 3 conferences so will see how that pans out. Edited August 11, 2017 by honestly united 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 been away so just catching up on things but thoughts on the following, Pro14 The Pro12 needs much more income or all the best players are going move to France or England who have much more money to spend. The 2 SA teams are going to double the existing TV money as a start. 2 conferences is not ideal but 26 league games would be too many. I think it will stick at 2 conferences if / when the US & Canadians join, then move to 2 leages of 10 if they can find another 4 teams from somewhere. Dont like the additional derby game just so the Irish and Welsh teams can play each other h&a, but its the best of a bad lot Semi-Pro Super 6 league Not sure what to make of this - something had to happen at the level below Pro14 in Scotland so kudos on the SRU for doing something, and I can see where they are trying to go with ringfencing all the professional players in one competition - it looks like 3 clubs each will come under the umberella (and obviously get fringe players from) Glasgow and Edinburgh so they are not spread as thinly as present ( at the moment in league games one club could be boosted by 2 or 3 pro's and the other wont have any). However the money they are talking about is peanuts - about £140 k over 35 players is £4k each or £200 a game. Also dictating that the other teams can pay players is abhorrent, does this include coaches etc as well? It means that players / coaches are not going to advance to bigger clubs as they are just going to stay local. I would like to see them trying to get involved with some cross border competitions with the Italian league or joining the 3rd tier European competition, but I suppose they should now at least be competitive in the B&I cup. Super Rugby I think the issue is their conference system was trying to copy the NFL system, and they also have a much shorter season traditionally than in hte NH hence only 15 games (and why they lose all the best players to France as they dont have as much income). Rugby has only recently introduced league systems (its only about 30 odd years since there was no league rugby in England and it was all just friendlies and the John Player cup). I dont know what format the Super Rugby are going to adopt now, I think its down to 3 conferences so will see how that pans out. Re coaches yeah they would also have to be strictly amateur. This would have a devastating effect on coaching at almost all levels. If the sru try to push strict amateurism for players and coaches we will lose a large number of coaches and players as they simply won't be able to afford to participate and 6 franchises could not possibly accommodate all of those being paid to play / coach. It would also drag down the standards of senior xvs and massively impede youth development. I can't even see what the proposed benefits would be beyond not having top 6 embarrassed if other sides were playing a better brand of rugby. Strongly disagree with no promotion or relegation too as it's no incentive to improve. As others have said if they wanted a closed tier then a district championship would have been way to go. As for pro14 moving on would defo like to see two tiers with Georgian Romanian sides etc and promotion/relegation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afca32 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Eednud said: Western Force for the chop when it should have been the Rebels. It would have ended up in the Court if it had been the Rebels but it might still. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-11/western-force-super-rugby-arbitration-ruling/8789736 Just the 17 points above the Rebels and the 2nd best Australian side last season. Joke of a decision. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Oh.....so the conference format that we are adopting is unpopular with fans.....ahhh...awkward. Was there never any discussion about bringing in enough sides to make two tiers? Certainly what I'd personally like to see hope with pro14. Promotion n relegation would make for more meaningful games. Eta I get that the nz sides dominating isn't great but things can change. Not that long ago Glasgow were a joke n the Irish sides were dominant. This format isn't all that bad for the pro 14. Of course we have to wait and see but you will at least play everyone at least once derby games are kept and there is more to play for with more playoff opportunities. There is also the added bonus only the best in the league will go to the Champions cup. That effectively kicks the Italians out of that competition but also to their benifit where I think they could be more competitive in the challenge cup. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 This format isn't all that bad for the pro 14. Of course we have to wait and see but you will at least play everyone at least once derby games are kept and there is more to play for with more playoff opportunities. There is also the added bonus only the best in the league will go to the Champions cup. That effectively kicks the Italians out of that competition but also to their benifit where I think they could be more competitive in the challenge cup. Yeah it will take a season before everyone has bedded in with new format. Suspect it will be the 'casual' fans who find it most off putting. Hopefully it doesn't cost in terms of crowds or TV audience but think once it gets to business end of season it will be fine. Agree Italian sides are better suited to challenge cup. Eta really liking the new embra n Glasgow kits this season 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajwffc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Glasgow's new kit New sponsor to be revealed on Monday 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Just the 17 points above the Rebels and the 2nd best Australian side last season. Joke of a decision. What was the criteria used for making that decision? Really don't like idea of teams being bumped on issues other than sporting merit. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eednud Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 What was the criteria used for making that decision? Really don't like idea of teams being bumped on issues other than sporting merit. Criteria probably based on not having to as much in legal fees. Totally stupid decision. ARU CEO Bill Pulver has resigned. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-11/western-force-super-rugby-demise-marks-death-of-national-game/8790062?section=sport http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-11/western-force-cut-from-super-rugby-competition/8789736?section=sport 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Criteria probably based on not having to as much in legal fees. Totally stupid decision. ARU CEO Bill Pulver has resigned. http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-11/western-force-super-rugby-demise-marks-death-of-national-game/8790062?section=sport http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-11/western-force-cut-from-super-rugby-competition/8789736?section=sport Christ that's just a mess. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afca32 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Yes the VRU takeover of the Rebels seems to have been the key factor. Melbourne is obviously a much bigger city (I believe it should soon overtake Sydney as the largest in the country) and although it's a largely an Aussie Rules area maybe they looked at the success of the Melbourne Storm and think that could be replicated in union. Most Australians I've seen discussing it thought a Melbourne merger with the Brumbies was the best option. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bully Wee Villa Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 What's wrong with having teams with crap crowds? On that basis you could make a case for getting rid of over 99% of sports teams on the planet.They should be adding teams in Fiji, Samoa, Tonga and Brazil, not cutting them, imo. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peasy23 Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Glasgow's new kit New sponsor to be revealed on Monday Prefer the white one out of the two. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 Western Force being axed does directly affect us. Hadn't known we had such an arrangement in placehttp://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/40900821 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Jo Jo Junior Shabadoo Posted August 11, 2017 Share Posted August 11, 2017 3 hours ago, peasy23 said: Prefer the white one out of the two. ^^^Reported for racism. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmc Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 What's wrong with having teams with crap crowds? On that basis you could make a case for getting rid of over 99% of sports teams on the planet.They should be adding teams in Fiji, Samoa, Tonga and Brazil, not cutting them, imo. Exactly. On that criteria we would have been dumped from 6n and Celtic league a few years back. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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