The Falkirk FC Thread

[Shadwell Dog]

11 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

21 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said:

We now know what this league is about and should be able to change our approach to correct the wrongs of last season.  There's some decent players in this league that also know what its all about. We could do worse than cherry picking some of the best players at other league one sides.

Problem with that is a lot of them are part time and that's for a good reason. Going hybrid to accommodate may be an option. I reckon there will be a lot of players open to part time terms that maybe werent before. There must surely be players who have thought long and hard about security for themselves and their family during all of this. It's a hard transfer window though as we will be getting bombarded with agents of all sorts of dross, as a perceived lower level cash cow.

Might well be the way to go. We've tried bringing in players from higher levels and it didn't work. 

[AL-FFC]

The trouble is being too tight with the money every man knows their worth and what they are willing to work for. if you lowball too many good players word will get out we are still a full time side, mind you in the midst of this pandemic and with the jobs market especially in football its a case of weighing up having some money coming in or risk having no money coming in so this might be the first year where its a better market for the club than the player in negotiating deals.

[Reggie Perrin]

Might well be the way to go. We've tried bringing in players from higher levels and it didn't work. 

To be fair it didn’t work because the players were shite.
Much, much better recruitment required and I am not at all confident that will happen.

[Bairnardo]

Might well be the way to go. We've tried bringing in players from higher levels and it didn't work. 

I think if we did it, we would become the most attractive part time option in the country overnight. Probably the best payer of PT wages and also well located for guys to live and work anywhere in the central belt and still be able to get along to training etc without having to travel long distances.

Could be wrong about there being more players considering it but if I earned an average wage from full time pro football around Scotlands lower leagues and covid came along and shut the whole thing down almost overnight, I would be giving serious thought to my financial security/exit strategy/life after football.

Seems foolish to me not to consider such eventualities.

[Shadwell Dog]

Just now, Reggie Perrin said:

To be fair it didn’t work because the players were shite.
Much, much better recruitment required and I am not at all confident that will happen.

But all of them had played regularly at a higher level recently.  People including myself keep on saying so and so should be more than good enough for this level only to be disappointed. Mcshane a couple of years ago was a mainstay in St Mirrens championship winning side and yet was murder in league one and he's only 29. The trick is to get players that are good enough and motivated enough to play at this level.

[AL-FFC]

2 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said:

But all of them had played regularly at a higher level recently.  People including myself keep on saying so and so should be more than good enough for this level only to be disappointed. Mcshane a couple of years ago was a mainstay in St Mirrens championship winning side and yet was murder in league one and he's only 29. The trick is to get players that are good enough and motivated enough to play at this level.

I think the motivating factor was who brought them in whether it be Hartley or McKinnon in some cases with the likes of Dixon improved when M and M took over as well as likes of Connolly, Sammon lost a good bit weight but he needs to be motivated whether his lack of goal scoring is down to McManus wanting to take the chances himself instead of using another player as an option for a goal scoring chance, but he needs to have his finger out his arse from day one this season.

[Reggie Perrin]

But all of them had played regularly at a higher level recently.  People including myself keep on saying so and so should be more than good enough for this level only to be disappointed. Mcshane a couple of years ago was a mainstay in St Mirrens championship winning side and yet was murder in league one and he's only 29. The trick is to get players that are good enough and motivated enough to play at this level.

Good point about motivation, it’s not always lack of ability that makes a player shite.
A poor attitude will drag any player down.

[TxRover]

16 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

I think if we did it, we would become the most attractive part time option in the country overnight. Probably the best payer of PT wages and also well located for guys to live and work anywhere in the central belt and still be able to get along to training etc without having to travel long distances.

Could be wrong about there being more players considering it but if I earned an average wage from full time pro football around Scotlands lower leagues and covid came along and shut the whole thing down almost overnight, I would be giving serious thought to my financial security/exit strategy/life after football.

Seems foolish to me not to consider such eventualities.

 

People seem to over-estimate the part-time aspect of a hybrid scheme. Raith’s mix was heavily full-time with a sprinkling of part-time players. We had a couple of players who, exactly as you posit, liked fitba but also liked their outside jobs.  There are players who don’t want to play full-time because of the security of the job outside the game, and some of them are quite good. If FFC are, de facto, the top hybrid team, there is an attraction there, especially if the day job is reasonably close to the team...and Falkirk are “pretty close” to the majority of Scotland. The one fly in the ointment is the somewhat free spending by some lower teams angling to move up.

I would expect M&M to bring in youth to salt among the more experienced players, and probably take a few flyers in there because the payments are much lower than trying to pick the ideal older player looking to move down and extend a career. It could result in a genuinely exciting team for you for the first time in a few seasons.

[Bairnardo]

 
People seem to over-estimate the part-time aspect of a hybrid scheme. Raith’s mix was heavily full-time with a sprinkling of part-time players. We had a couple of players who, exactly as you posit, liked fitba but also liked their outside jobs.  There are players who don’t want to play full-time because of the security of the job outside the game, and some of them are quite good. If FFC are, de facto, the top hybrid team, there is an attraction there, especially if the day job is reasonably close to the team...and Falkirk are “pretty close” to the majority of Scotland. The one fly in the ointment is the somewhat free spending by some lower teams angling to move up.
I would expect M&M to bring in youth to salt among the more experienced players, and probably take a few flyers in there because the payments are much lower than trying to pick the ideal older player looking to move down and extend a career. It could result in a genuinely exciting team for you for the first time in a few seasons.

I'm not speculating on what the split would or should be between FT and PT. I imagine given the "ambitions"* of those in charge we would be best served to remain as heavily FT as possible. All I am saying is that we should be open to the possibility of an emerging player market rather if it transpires. We shouldnt allow the best players in the league to be ones lining up against us because we werent willing to accommodate their needs.


*admittedly, they might be happy to continue their wee tea party with zero regard to what league we are in, as long as Kieran is still doing a great job bringing in the sponsors.

[ebobsboy]

21 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said:

But all of them had played regularly at a higher level recently.  People including myself keep on saying so and so should be more than good enough for this level only to be disappointed. Mcshane a couple of years ago was a mainstay in St Mirrens championship winning side and yet was murder in league one and he's only 29. The trick is to get players that are good enough and motivated enough to play at this level.

If you look at that St.Mirren team it had, McGinn, Magennis, Morgan, Mullen, Cammy Smith, Ross Stewart to name a few, there's always going to be a weak link but if the players round about have better ability then it's not as noticible. Put McShane in our team and it sticks out like a sore thumb he's mince. 

[TxRover]

2 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

I'm not speculating on what the split would or should be between FT and PT. I imagine given the "ambitions"* of those in charge we would be best served to remain as heavily FT as possible. All I am saying is that we should be open to the possibility of an emerging player market rather if it transpires. We shouldnt allow the best players in the league to be ones lining up against us because we werent willing to accommodate their needs.


*admittedly, they might be happy to continue their wee tea party with zero regard to what league we are in, as long as Kieran is still doing a great job bringing in the sponsors.

Exactly, a willingness to entertain a few part-time players would be intelligent on M&M’s part, as it could lead to some players you wouldn’t get otherwise or a nice “find”.

[Grangemouth Bairn]

8 minutes ago, TxRover said:

 

People seem to over-estimate the part-time aspect of a hybrid scheme. Raith’s mix was heavily full-time with a sprinkling of part-time players. We had a couple of players who, exactly as you posit, liked fitba but also liked their outside jobs.  There are players who don’t want to play full-time because of the security of the job outside the game, and some of them are quite good. If FFC are, de facto, the top hybrid team, there is an attraction there, especially if the day job is reasonably close to the team...and Falkirk are “pretty close” to the majority of Scotland. The one fly in the ointment is the somewhat free spending by some lower teams angling to move up.

I would expect M&M to bring in youth to salt among the more experienced players, and probably take a few flyers in there because the payments are much lower than trying to pick the ideal older player looking to move down and extend a career. It could result in a genuinely exciting team for you for the first time in a few seasons.

Exciting team ?? This league is and always has been fucking honking. The majority of players in it are utter dugmeat.

[Reggie Perrin]

A wee word of caution with regard to players being willing to go part time.
We are on the verge of an unemployment shit storm and it would be realistic to think that salaries / wages for any vacancies that do arise will take a hit just as happened in the wake of the banking crisis a dozen years ago.
Not a great time to be looking for work.

[Shadwell Dog]

12 minutes ago, ebobsboy said:

If you look at that St.Mirren team it had, McGinn, Magennis, Morgan, Mullen, Cammy Smith, Ross Stewart to name a few, there's always going to be a weak link but if the players round about have better ability then it's not as noticible. Put McShane in our team and it sticks out like a sore thumb he's mince. 

They had a decent squad though. Ross wouldn't have played him unless he thought he was a player. He's well liked at queens too and he wasn't playing with the same level of player there.

[Bairnardo]

A wee word of caution with regard to players being willing to go part time.
We are on the verge of an unemployment shit storm and it would be realistic to think that salaries / wages for any vacancies that do arise will take a hit just as happened in the wake of the banking crisis a dozen years ago.
Not a great time to be looking for work.

That's true, but if a player has one eye on re training as a plumber for his post football work, he might see now as a sensible time to get the ball rolling.

It's just an example, but no ones knows what will happen with covid, hopefully this major impact is a one time deal, but one things for certain, in the context of covid impact, getting your money from a spectator funded professional sport in Scotland must be one of the most precarious revenue streams there is.

In the event of any subsequent lockdown or virus related measures, football will be first in the chopping block every time.

[Shadwell Dog]

3 minutes ago, Reggie Perrin said:

A wee word of caution with regard to players being willing to go part time.
We are on the verge of an unemployment shit storm and it would be realistic to think that salaries / wages for any vacancies that do arise will take a hit just as happened in the wake of the banking crisis a dozen years ago.
Not a great time to be looking for work.

There are a few decent part timers already out there that would do a job never mind players turning part time mind you.

[Dawson Park Boy]

Part time for a few players is a good idea.

Quite a few will be looking to go to college/university after this Covid disaster and part time football will fit in perfectly with studying especially as you don’t need to work terribly hard nowadays to get a degree.

I think Telfer is doing a law degree or something related.

We should actively be encouraging this as an enducement to get in some talent.

[AL-FFC]

A bit of realism here the fact it "Just" worked for Raith we are kidding ourselves on if it hadnt been for a pandemic and the league getting called 8 games early and a dodgy vote to promote the sides and if it doesnt pay off then what do we start comparing ourselves to Partick who are full time for it not working and the difference between PT and FT being night and day.  Theres no magic formula to this and its a case of getting the best team we can and hoping lady luck is on our side on match day.  I seen enough of last season with m and m to know they can change a game and got the tactics pretty much spot on in the majority of games

[Bairnardo]

A bit of realism here the fact it "Just" worked for Raith we are kidding ourselves on if it hadnt been for a pandemic and the league getting called 8 games early and a dodgy vote to promote the sides and if it doesnt pay off then what do we start comparing ourselves to Partick who are full time for it not working and the difference between PT and FT being night and day.  Theres no magic formula to this and its a case of getting the best team we can and hoping lady luck is on our side on match day.  I seen enough of last season with m and m to know they can change a game and got the tactics pretty much spot on in the majority of games

It's not about copying Raith as some sort of winning model though, it's about being realistic about and open to the possibility that lower league Scottish football is going to lookn very different post pandemic

[AL-FFC]

Just now, Bairnardo said:

4 minutes ago, AL-FFC said:

A bit of realism here the fact it "Just" worked for Raith we are kidding ourselves on if it hadnt been for a pandemic and the league getting called 8 games early and a dodgy vote to promote the sides and if it doesnt pay off then what do we start comparing ourselves to Partick who are full time for it not working and the difference between PT and FT being night and day.  Theres no magic formula to this and its a case of getting the best team we can and hoping lady luck is on our side on match day.  I seen enough of last season with m and m to know they can change a game and got the tactics pretty much spot on in the majority of games

It's not about copying Raith as some sort of winning model though, it's about being realistic about and open to the possibility that lower league Scottish football is going to lookn very different post pandemic

then its up to us to exploit it to our favour as much as we can, the weakening teams to our advantage theres no guarantee they would gel and look what happened to livvy first time round we lost the likes of Marino Keith, Crabbe etc to them only for 2 season down the line to find out they couldnt afford them and pretty much doing what Sevco done.  All we can do is speculate and see how it pans out, we must have tried everything we can do find that formula and PH and RM were definitely not the solution.  

A bit of youth with experience and a bit creativity is the main thing we need and hoping defensively we have replacements for Doyle, Buchanan and possibly Hall and Durnan (just get us an actual right back this time)