MarreZ Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 That's disingenuous. Almost everyone on here is in favour of 8-4 or 9-3 rather than 11-1. However, 11-1 is in place for a lot of issues at the moment, and it's no surprise that people would be a bit surprised and annoyed that 8-4 could be used for a Rangers decision while 11-1 is required for TV money and suchlike. Exactly right, you cant pick and choose whether its 11-1 or 8-4 based on whether you are likely to win an 8-4 but lose an 11-1. This is the one time where there is a benefit to it being an 11-1 vote so what happens? Goalposts are moved. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No8. Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 If they are living within their means they will be no bigger than Aberdeen and their travelling support will diminish, plus how much will Sky/ESPN pay to televise four thrashings a year of the type we saw last weekend from Celtic? Honestly FFS There was nothing to play for in the last Glasgow Derby...when there was at Ibrox it was Rangers that dished out the thrashing. As for the Aberdeen comment...I just don't know what to say to such an absurd statement..For once words fail me. I am sure even the Aberdeen posters are cringing at that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Connolly Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Do you only choose to read what you want...I DON'T WANT RANGERS TO BE PARACHUTED BACK INTO THE SPL!! IT IS MORALLY WRONG!!! I BELIEVE WE SHOULD START FROM THE 3rd DIVISION!! I am merely highlighting why chairmen will vote in favour of the Newco. I don't actually agree with it myself!!! I have also said i would be reluctant to renew my season ticket if we face financial penalties in the SPL!! Just out of interest, do you believe that a newco should have to apply to the 3rd Division? I can understand Rangers in their present form (such that it is) being demoted, but should a newco be formed, why should they have any more right to a place than Spartans for example? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Exactly right, you cant pick and choose whether its 11-1 or 8-4 based on whether you are likely to win an 8-4 but lose an 11-1. This is the one time where there is a benefit to it being an 11-1 vote so what happens? Goalposts are moved. Spot on. I laughed when I heard Doncaster claim it would be an 8-4 vote at the weekend. Or really? Label me stunned! I'm amazed they are bothering with a vote. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I DON'T WANT RANGERS TO BE PARACHUTED BACK INTO THE SPL!! IT IS MORALLY WRONG!!! I BELIEVE WE SHOULD START FROM THE 3rd DIVISION!! Isn't Newco getting into the Third Division instead of Spartans/Cove/etc also morally wrong? It's more moral than staying in SPL - but I'd suggest it's soiled nonetheless. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarreZ Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Isn't Newco getting into the Third Division instead of Spartans/Cove/etc also morally wrong? It's more moral than staying in SPL - but I'd suggest it's soiled nonetheless. Its not any more moral - they should and would go through the same process as other clubs looking to enter the league, they would obviously get it, but they should be made to go through the same process as anyone else. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjc Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) People are getting a bit silly now. All this angst over "8-4". As I said last night, it doesn't appear to be clear whether it even meant 8-4 when voting on a Newco application OR just on changing the rules from it being the Board's decision to a General Meeting's decision. They could also be creating a new rule, or amending an existing one, such that the existing higher supermajority (10-2) on related cases wasn't applicable. People need to make up their minds anyway. Either you're for fairer voting... 9-3 or 8-4... or your not. If not, no complaints over 11-1 when it doesn't suit. I've no doubt whatsoever that they'll alter the voting structure to suit their agenda..........yet we're the ones being fickle HJ ?! Edited May 8, 2012 by sjc 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz FFC Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 You still don't get it do you? There is a strong case for us being better off in the long term without you; remember, we've been in this set up for years and it disnae work...it disnae phuckin work! Even you can see that we've"been struggling" and that's with 20 years of RFC being crucial to our survival with their piles of dosh that they give us. If we keep doing the same things then guess what? We'll get the same result. Even more importantly of course is that if AFC or anyone else goes under beacause we put the commercial interests of the biggest team in the country first rather than sport then so be it. Especially if said big team is seen to have been shafting all and sundry for the last 10-20 years. The definition of stupid is to keep doing the same thing and expect different results. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Thompson Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 How many United supporters do you honestly think are not going to go because of the way he votes...Honestly? Have you seen their crowds recently? Did you see the crowd at the recent Aberdeen v United game? They are down to the loyal few and they wont turn their back on the club when they are needed most. I keep hearing about boycotts by the Rangers support and Tannadice being the main one..the time when we would show the diddies they couldn't mess us about. There was a total of 20 outside the Jerry Kerr stand demonstrating and pleading with supporters not go in..Of course nobody listened and 15 minutes into the game i saw them sitting just a long from us. I dont know the answer, but then neither do you, or Thomson or anyone else, for that matter. What we dont, also, know is how much TV would be lost or what the net effect of not having Rangers in the SPL would have on crowds. And, as ribzanelli points out, a reliance on the TV money is a dangerous. What happens if Rangers are relegated? What if Sky simply bore of the one-sidedness of the "new" SPL? Theres also the other scenario, where Rangers are voted back in, but under conditions that theyre fans dont like. What happens then, when the Rangers fans boycott away games and the SPL chairmen lose much of the revenue they were so desperate to protect? As I said, all these unknowns point to just one course of action. No easy path for Rangers, ensure they are punished fairly and not allowed to be seen to waltz back into the SPL. That way, and only that way, will the clubs keep the support of their own fans, who will then rally and support them, should the doomsday scenarios of a Rangers-less SPL come to fruition. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz FFC Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Isn't Newco getting into the Third Division instead of Spartans/Cove/etc also morally wrong? It's more moral than staying in SPL - but I'd suggest it's soiled nonetheless. Is moving leagues like buying a house to Rangers? I want to live there. Has someone told them you have to apply for the 3rd and their are terms and conditions that Newco Soccerball utd don't meet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) Its not any more moral - they should and would go through the same process as other clubs looking to enter the league, they would obviously get it, but they should be made to go through the same process as anyone else. Sorry, for clarity I was meaning in the context of them having to apply for a vacancy, then winning it. It requiring the application and the contest makes it less immoral, IMO - but winning the process, denying a non-leaguer in doing so, would prevent it being moral. I've no doubt whatsoever that they'll alter the voting structure to suit their agenda..........yet we're the ones being fickle HJ ?! Potentially. At the moment there is no threshold for this matter*. It's also not even clear if 8-4 is going to be the threshold (it might just mean the rule change threshold). If it is it might well be joined by 9-3 on other matters, which is being voted upon on the same day. Even if it isn't, some areas moving towards 8-4 or 9-3 is surely welcome. *as it's a Board decision; infact it's a board decision which can be passed 3-3 with chairman's cast Edited May 8, 2012 by HibeeJibee 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No8. Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 That way, and only that way, will the clubs keep the support of their own fans, who will then rally and support them, should the doomsday scenarios of a Rangers-less SPL come to fruition. Surely you realise there are many clubs in the SPL who need these fans to 'Rally' now!! They have turned their backs on the clubs for a whole host of reasons and 2 horse race just being one of them. Maybe if those fans rallied a bit more often the league wouldn't be the 2 horse borefest it has come. But i know...It is all the Old Firms fault and at this time mostly Rangers fault for the 'other clubs' failings. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barney sumner Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 so pretty much a summary of what is going to happen is: Rangers go into liquidation and all creditors incl the British tax payers and public services are humped for all money the club have not bothered to pay due to living a life they could not afford. Rangers by some strange loophole get to lose all the debt but manage to trade under the same name in the same stadium. Due to being bullied by the afore mentioned, the SFA and SPL immediately buckle and impose no sanctions on Rangers. If this is how it pans out, then Hearts, Killie and Dundee Utd should do the exact same. All the money you should have spent on paying creditors can now be spent on players (well, not all or you'll be back to square one). I've missed 90% of this thread and have kind of lost interest in the whole saga, but i'm assuming now that this is how it's going to pan out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ribzanelli Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Honestly FFS There was nothing to play for in the last Glasgow Derby...when there was at Ibrox it was Rangers that dished out the thrashing. As for the Aberdeen comment...I just don't know what to say to such an absurd statement..For once words fail me. I am sure even the Aberdeen posters are cringing at that. Nothing to play for and you got embarrased. Take away your top players and replace them with 17 year olds and it'll be year upon year of that 'performance' and result. Won't be great when it is TV contract renewal time. Your support has been galvanized recently by the reckless comments of those at Ibrox, but given the glory hunting nature of your support there is no reason to think that you will take any more fans to Tynecastle, Easter Road etc than a team like Aberdeen if you are mid table mediocrities at best. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeTeeJag Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I wonder what other countries league associations would do if it were the likes of Man Utd, Bayern, Barcelona, etc? And we all know what the Italian league did!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Surely you realise there are many clubs in the SPL who need these fans to 'Rally' now!! They have turned their backs on the clubs for a whole host of reasons and 2 horse race just being one of them. Maybe if those fans rallied a bit more often the league wouldn't be the 2 horse borefest it has come. But i know...It is all the Old Firms fault and at this time mostly Rangers fault for the 'other clubs' failings. Wow 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarreZ Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Surely you realise there are many clubs in the SPL who need these fans to 'Rally' now!! They have turned their backs on the clubs for a whole host of reasons and 2 horse race just being one of them. Maybe if those fans rallied a bit more often the league wouldn't be the 2 horse borefest it has come. But i know...It is all the Old Firms fault and at this time mostly Rangers fault for the 'other clubs' failings. Its exactly the same for Rangers and Celtic as it is for fans of other clubs, your fans stay away when the going is tough, as did Celtics, sure you still pull in bigger crowds but the appetite is not there. Even the last two Rangers home games the season ticket holders have not bothered to show up, what was there, something like 15,000 missing seats against Dundee United? Its just scaled, theres supporters of clubs like mine that will go through thick and thin home and away, guys like me who goto every home game and the occasional away game, guys who goto a few home games, etc etc Success would see the guys not going every week coming back most weeks, just as failure would see a drop off of Rangers and Celtic's fans. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby_F Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Spot on. I laughed when I heard Doncaster claim it would be an 8-4 vote at the weekend. Or really? Label me stunned! I'm amazed they are bothering with a vote. Well, they are having elections in Syria - although I guess that is a more transparent and democratic regime than the SPL. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngsod Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 In other news, the Glasgow Gallery Of Modern Art has announced an exhibition over the summer capturing the spirit and dynamic leadership of Scottish football in the 21st Century. The central piece of the show will be the following. For the duration of the exhibition, the Estate of Pablo Picasso has agreed that it will be renamed "Succulent Lamb". WaffenThinMint. You git, for a split second I thought Guernica *was* coming to GOMA. I was already planning a trip! May as well, as it seems I certainly won't be coming up to watch any SPL games any more. No wonder The Guardian calls us the Euro Disnae League. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenolly Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 If he does vote for Rangers Newco do you not think he is acting in the best interests of your club? I have made my feelings clear but the Chairman of your/my club club is better placed than you or i to decide what is best for the league and their club in particular. It is easy to sit here and say 'f**k Them/ f**k It 3rd division with them/us'. If season ticket money doesn't come in from the glory hunters we will suffer....If your club don't get the TV revenue , sponsors money and the Rangers supporters visiting your club will suffer..i believe you have been struggling recently. Chairmen are always going to vote for what they see as the best financial deal. We can all sit here and be as idealistic as we like but we know what will happen in the end. This is where they have to then do their sums correct if this happens say 400 fans lost times 19 league games = 7600 tickets lost + catering, programmes, lottery, merchandise against 4000 rangers times 2 or 3 games = 8000 or 12000 tickets gained (presuming your team is not on the Rangers boycott list) Plus the 400 your team lose will probably be lost for good, If the OF get their long term plan and get to go to England/Atlantic/Legoland league you'll have lost that figure on the long run. That figure of 400 may actually be low for some clubs, they are looking at shortterm gain instead of trying to grow their own fanbase and own product they are relying on the old firm to top up their coffers 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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