PeeTeeJag Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 The one thing that really grinds my gears is the fans insistence that you have to be a "rangers man" to manage the club. Just a couple of stats for you.......... Sally has the worst games lost to games played ratio (not including the handful of games under Tommy McLean and Durrant) in rankers 1.0 history. The Cardigan has the worst record of any manager that stayed at Everton more than a season. "Aye, but they win titles and trophies at rangers!!!" True, but would they have if they weren't cheating? Ofcourse not. Sally couldn't manage to open a letter on his own, and no club other than rankers would be stupid enough to let them manage their players. Oh sure, a lower league team would take him on for a bit of pubicity to start with, but after a season they'd realise he really doesn't have a clue (as was blatantly evident this past season). So by all means rankers 2.0 keep Sally, because no one else in Scotland wants him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fife Saint Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I actually think the EBTs thing needs to be put to bed to an extent. There are two aspects of it. Firstly, the SPL/SFA/whoever sporting investigation DOES need to continue, and Rangers need to be penalised for that. So dont get me wrong there. However, when it comes to hectoring Walter Smith and Ally McCoist about them, we're done with that. It doesnt affect Rangers any more. That is partly why HMRC wanted the club liquidated. They can carry out their investigation, and punish those that were responsible. It isnt illegal to receive ebts as far as I know, and this aspect of it is no longer relevant to the newco Rangers. So I think this side of the story isnt really a big deal. It might not matter to you because you haven't shelled out thousands of pounds following your club who were competing in a competition where the club winning everything was cheating. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Well Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) I actually think the EBTs thing needs to be put to bed to an extent. There are two aspects of it. Firstly, the SPL/SFA/whoever sporting investigation DOES need to continue, and Rangers need to be penalised for that. So dont get me wrong there. However, when it comes to hectoring Walter Smith and Ally McCoist about them, we're done with that. It doesnt affect Rangers any more. That is partly why HMRC wanted the club liquidated. They can carry out their investigation, and punish those that were responsible. It isnt illegal to receive ebts as far as I know, and this aspect of it is no longer relevant to the newco Rangers. So I think this side of the story isnt really a big deal. Completely wrong it's about Integrity. Every question re EBT's to Sir Watty and Ally should be answered fully and evidence shown to back up their claims. If they are to have any future within a newco, no sorry Scottish Football they should be above reproach. Edited June 17, 2012 by Well Well 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drooper Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Sounds like the biggest cop out in history. Let me take a mad stab at what might happen. Rangers will go to SPL2 to allow them entry back into the big league asap. SFA will go for a top league of 10 as the SPL(read Old Firm) have been wanting since they started to reorganise to ensure the Old Firm maximised their revenue. Rangers don't get investigated further, will accept their slap on the wrist and we will be back to the big two with their voting rights intact and all the TV revenue and sponsorship being channelled straight back into the Old Firm. A pyramid system to keep the fans onside but under the bonnet virtually no change. It will be a pyramid system with all the cash going to the top two teams aka the old firm. Whilst Doncaster will probably become SFA spokesman as his reward for the stitch up. Borrowing someone else's words this is clearly appeasement and should be about reparations. Stitch up disguised as reformation. And from page 1: I've just posted my own note of caution on the main thread. It seems that administration is a facility for football clubs to largely dodge responsibility for financial imprudence. I'm no expert on the process, but it seems to me that Whyte has had this one up his sleeve for a while. Whether he is looking for personal gain is another question, but I suspect that Rangers as an entity will suffer a mere flesh wound regardless. How will it pan out? It wouldn't surprise me if Whyte has someone in the wings who will swoop in and assume ownership of Rangers for a song, but this time, minus the crippling debts. Whyte will get his 'cut', and Rangers will still be in a position to operate at a financial level way beyond the rest of Scottish football, Celtic excepted. It is sickening to contemplate, but they'll steer a way through this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Leitch Loyal Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Perhaps St Anthony's could ground-share. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrpaddyx Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Neither of whom have any input to the SPL board. Wel,l unless they go back to the COS! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 It might not matter to you because you haven't shelled out thousands of pounds following your club who were competing in a competition where the club winning everything was cheating. Really? Since when were Arbroath not involved in Scottish football? I clearly said in that post that on the sporting side, Rangers need to be punished. However, there is nothing to be gained further on the financial side. The taxman has won. From a football perspective, case closed on that score. All that is left is the sporting penalties. I mean if it comes out that Walter Smith received millions in EBTs, then so what? What does that change? No, the club should be hit with sporting sanctions, but when it comes to EBTs and tax etc. Then the taxman is taking care of all that by pursuing the individuals responsible. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Leighton Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Perhaps St Anthony's could ground-share. Nah, Benburb. At least the seats would be the right colour for them! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dee eff cee Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Having read a couple of the papers this morning, some thoughts are: Dont'cha just love the "Green needs to listen to the fans" stuff about Team Cardigan? If that's the case, why does the MSM still insist other SPL chairmen shouldn't listen to therir fans? (See phrases like Aberdeen being "bounced" into voting No. Is that the same "bouncing" that we call democracy or customer views?) The (yet another) new Murray at Ibrox is still whinging about the "hysteria" and "already had enough punishment" , with "99.9% innocent". The only penalties others have made them pay are 10 points, so get a grip. You've still not been punished for the EBT / dual contracts cheating (and, for example) Sally's "transparency" outburst. There are suggestions that Green invites Team Cardie to sit round a table at Ibrox for a meeting. Love to be a fly on the wall for that one. Can you picture Cardie Man finally realising, while sititng in the boardroom, that he is there as a guest and may never, ever again get back inside the business area of Ibrox, unless Green condescends to let him in? "Do you take sugar in your tea, Mr Smith? Do you want a look round for old time's sake? We're planning on making a few changes" Also read that Roger the Rabbit feels "Rangers need to show some contrition and go down to Div3 etc". Who'd of thought we'd hear that sort of sense from a former football administrator? Lastly, some Rangers fan in a broadsheet article ends up with "you don't get a safer pair of hands at Rangers than Walter Smith". Someone should point out to him that he was at the heart of Rangers while they surged into unmanageable debt and controversial contracts with SDM. It really is a farce. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florentine_Pogen Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I've just posted my own note of caution on the main thread. It seems that administration is a facility for football clubs to largely dodge responsibility for financial imprudence. I'm no expert on the process, but it seems to me that Whyte has had this one up his sleeve for a while. Whether he is looking for personal gain is another question, but I suspect that Rangers as an entity will suffer a mere flesh wound regardless. How will it pan out? It wouldn't surprise me if Whyte has someone in the wings who will swoop in and assume ownership of Rangers for a song, but this time, minus the crippling debts. Whyte will get his 'cut', and Rangers will still be in a position to operate at a financial level way beyond the rest of Scottish football, Celtic excepted. It is sickening to contemplate, but they'll steer a way through this, ably aided and abetted by a compliant, spineless SFA which itself has Campbell 'Quisling' Ogilvie as it's figurehead.. Added that bit which you forgot. Don't forget folks, this is Scotland. This is Banana Republic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I actually think the EBTs thing needs to be put to bed to an extent. There are two aspects of it. Firstly, the SPL/SFA/whoever sporting investigation DOES need to continue, and Rangers need to be penalised for that. So dont get me wrong there. However, when it comes to hectoring Walter Smith and Ally McCoist about them, we're done with that. It doesnt affect Rangers any more. That is partly why HMRC wanted the club liquidated. They can carry out their investigation, and punish those that were responsible. It isnt illegal to receive ebts as far as I know, and this aspect of it is no longer relevant to the newco Rangers. So I think this side of the story isnt really a big deal. Fucksake, it is illegal to use EBTs as part of a contractual wage. Learn it, hug it close, don't forget it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingrodent Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Malcolm Cohen of BDO who are liquidating the old company has said: "It's important to understand that the appointment of liquidators will not mean the end of football at Ibrox – only the end of the company that ran the club". Also, Lord Glennie in his Court of Session ruling described the old company as one that "presently operates" the football club. Now the football club will be operated by a new company. Well then, it seems pretty straightforward - if Zombie Rangers are an entirely new club with no history, they won't have to pay back any of the money Dead Rangers stole, because that cash was stolen by a club that no longer exists. If I Can't Believe It's Not Rangers are the same club as Dead Rangers, then they should have to start paying back those ripped-off millions. Let's see what happens, eh? If the new owners draw up a debt repayment scheme and actually repay their creditors, that would be strong proof that they're still the RFC that won those titles. Maybe they're thinking about the best way to make amends as we speak. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Well Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Really? Since when were Arbroath not involved in Scottish football? I clearly said in that post that on the sporting side, Rangers need to be punished. However, there is nothing to be gained further on the financial side. The taxman has won. From a football perspective, case closed on that score. All that is left is the sporting penalties. I mean if it comes out that Walter Smith received millions in EBTs, then so what? What does that change? No, the club should be hit with sporting sanctions, but when it comes to EBTs and tax etc. Then the taxman is taking care of all that by pursuing the individuals responsible. Seriously, I would imagine his reputation would be high on the list of changes. The taxman said it was wrong and have hit Rangers with a massive bill, they have appealed this. Walter Smith was the manager in that very club for many years when this was going on. I am sure his reputation should be above reproach if he continues in any form within Scottish Football. The same goes for Ally. Ask any persons wrongly accused of a crime and then ask them if it matters that they were found not guilty and their reputation restored. They have not been accused of it yet but mud sticks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p&b is a disgrace Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I've seen no evidence that Walter was involved with EBTs, only shit-stirring from Celtic fans etc. Certainly he wasn't on the BBC's list of beneficiaries. Anyway, EBTs were a common tax planning device and the tribunal is still to give its ruling on how Rangers/Murray Group ran theirs. As for "newco" there's a clue in the name. New company, not new club. More MSM peddled pish. HMRC have ruled against the deceased club known as Rangers FC. We are currently awaiting the outcome of the appeals process. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) SSN just confirmed Rangers won't be in the fixture list tomorrow Going to have "TBC" instead Edited June 17, 2012 by Enrico Annoni 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustyarabnuts Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Club 12 is what SPL using in the fixture list sounds like a youth club 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeeTeeJag Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 I actually think the EBTs thing needs to be put to bed to an extent. There are two aspects of it. Firstly, the SPL/SFA/whoever sporting investigation DOES need to continue, and Rangers need to be penalised for that. So dont get me wrong there. However, when it comes to hectoring Walter Smith and Ally McCoist about them, we're done with that. It doesnt affect Rangers any more. That is partly why HMRC wanted the club liquidated. They can carry out their investigation, and punish those that were responsible. It isnt illegal to receive ebts as far as I know, and this aspect of it is no longer relevant to the newco Rangers. So I think this side of the story isnt really a big deal. Its not hectoring, it's trying to get answers to questions that should be asked. Rangers (Sally) are wanting transparency but only as long as it doesn't mean THEY have to be transparent. It is basically financial doping, and the way it was used at Ipox was illegal. Maybe Sally and Watty didn't know that it was illegal, but all those that received the EBTs must have thought it a little odd that they were getting these "loans" yet didn't have to pay it back. If my company had offered me an EBT and said that I didnt have to pay it back or I could pay it back sometime in the future I would be wondering exactly what was going on. The agents of players must surely have known. And how much has been paid back to pay off these loans. Not a single penny. Rangers - The Enron of Scottish Football 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozam76 Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Club 12 is what SPL using in the fixture list sounds like a youth club I think that's what New Rangers will be using in their fixture lists. As posted earlier, SPL will be using TBC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthBank Posted June 17, 2012 Share Posted June 17, 2012 Real interesting point was made by Yorkston on Sportsound yesterday afternoon. Apparently Petrie produced a paper a few months ago for the SPL Board advocating setting up SPL TV and ditching Sky. Yorkston stated the figures stacked up and there was a good reception to the proposal. In fact it was reckoned that they could produce more cash via SPL TV. He said that people didnt want to go down that route at the time as it seemed like a bit of initial work and the SKY deal was easy to to just sign it.. So maybe the SPL do not need SKY anyway? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted June 17, 2012 Author Share Posted June 17, 2012 Club 12 - St Mirren's bitches since 2012. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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