Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[Bearwithme]

I would need to look at that balance sheet and list of creditors again that was posted yesterday but I didn't see a figure of £18M being owed to Whyte. It would have stood out like a sore thumb. So what you are saying is that another creditor of £18M needs to be added to those already staggering figures?

I don't know what might happen regarding it but it's a fact that Whyte did not eliminate the bank debt completely; rather he shifted it to his company (the former Wavetower if I remember rightly). What action might be taken over Whyte and his claims remains to be seen.

[PeeTeeJag]

So let me get this right.........

Can we now all shaft each other?

If thats the case is it now legal for me to keep my mate's car that he gave me whilst he's on holiday and only give him back the air freshener?

[Ivo den Bieman]

Only a wee gripe, but we've never been into administration. We just had a couple of cretins on the board who we needed to get rid of before they kicked us out of Stark's and turned it into flats.

But still, watching newsnight Scotland right now. Should be interest/hilarious

fair enough, I was confusing the "dubious Glaswegian owners" / Claude Anelka period with administration...

[Granny Danger]

I would need to look at that balance sheet and list of creditors again that was posted yesterday but I didn't see a figure of £18M being owed to Whyte. It would have stood out like a sore thumb. So what you are saying is that another creditor of £18M needs to be added to those already staggering figures?

It was suggested on one of last night's TV programmes that Whyte is not actually co-operating with Haudit & Daudit - the administrators that he appointed! I found that bizarre and wondered whether it would affect the legitimacy of any claim he subsequently made. Just another strange twist to this whole thing.

[Baxter Parp]

I'm i the only one that thinks that heads should roll at HMRC. Who the hell allowed Rangers to owe so much tax without pulling them up and taking them to court .At a time when we have radio adverts telling joiners and electricians to be good boys and declare any money made on the side,the're letting Rangers run up millions. What a fucking joke. As soon as any company owes ,say 500 grand in tax, then HMRC should be crawling over their arses

The very nature of tax avoidance means that it's hidden from HMRC. Some of the tax owed has already been taken to tribunal and the tax bill that Whyte has built up has been created in a very short time in tax terms.

[DensDerry80]

No, just getting things clear.

You can see why there was talking of "lessons not being learned" etc when it had happened before.

Can't you?

yes twice but survived both occasions thanks.................. hows your administration going?

But what i am getting at is that it is very unlikely that its just rangers (hearts) that have been using the tax man as a credit card and clearly the SFL and SPL and SFA etc do nothing about it.

[Bearwithme]

It was suggested on one of last night's TV programmes that Whyte is not actually co-operating with Haudit & Daudit - the administrators that he appointed! I found that bizarre and wondered whether it would affect the legitimacy of any claim he subsequently made. Just another strange twist to this whole thing.

Just to be clear, the administrators were appointed by the Court of Session and are accountable to it.

[Mark Connolly]

So let me get this right.........

Can we now all shaft each other?

If thats the case is it now legal for me to keep my mate's car that he gave me whilst he's on holiday and only give him back the air freshener?

No.

My understanding is that he would have to agree to that deal. If he doesn't, you need to go and get the car scrapped and rebuilt as a newcar, which could use the same number plates and VIN numbers, and then tell him to f*ck off.

[p&b is a disgrace]

fair enough, I was confusing the "dubious Glaswegian owners" / Claude Anelka period with administration...

With hindsight, we really should have opted for the administration option.

[Broken Algorithms]

fair enough, I was confusing the "dubious Glaswegian owners" / Claude Anelka period with administration...

Not to worry, we're currently looking at a £250k loss for this season and potential relegation. So we're not far away. My greatest fear is that Rangers get away scot free and then HMRC decide to make an example of clubs like Raith who are then forced into a situation where we can't maintain ourselves.

Aye, but back on topic. You really have to wonder how Rangers continue to teeter on the edge given the financial stakes involved. With such a vast debt to so many, it really unbelievable that people think things will all be rosey. Throw in the fact you have bidders who will surely be dissuaded by the figure emerging, and an owner who outright refuses to sell and it is a shitstorm that only one half of the Old Firm could manage to conjure up.

[WaffenThinMint]

It is OK to trade whilst insolvent so long as it is deemed to be possible to trade out of the insolvent position and/or to seek the protection of administration once the ability to trade out of the insolvent situation becomes impractical. With the big tax case not yet decided and the wee tax case only reacently 'agreed' it may be deemed that Rangers followed the rules. But all these things are judgement calls.

It would take HMRC all of a morning's work to phone around the creditors, ask them how long they've been owed that money, and if even a quarter have been owed for over 6 months, they can file charges for trading whilst insolvent, especially with Haudit and Daudit admitting the club's only bringing in a million a month.

Succulent lambs to the slaughter...

[MEADOWXI]

£93 million pounds, I wonder how many schools have went without books, or hospitals without a full staff to fund Rangers?

Or if you fancy being overly emotive these troops that keep getting pararded round Ibrox.

How much frontline military equipment could have been bought.

They pander to the loyal to Crown corwd and then hinder thoese truly defending it

Maybe the RFFF could donate some much need body armour to the troops of the Crown.

[Spain]

The very nature of tax avoidance means that it's hidden from HMRC. Some of the tax owed has already been taken to tribunal and the tax bill that Whyte has built up has been created in a very short time in tax terms.

It's also worth noting that with regards the EBT's, this was a loophole in tax law that was being exploited. EBT's aren't actually illegal, it's the method of which money was extracted from them which was the issue. Everyone knew it at the time that it was only a loophole, but still it was there, so people used it. What no-one realised at the time was that the loophole could be closed retrospectively. Many have avoided the fines and interest by having to return the monies back into the EBT's. These monies can then still be removed after, but only at that persons relevant tax rates.

[7-2]

My thoughts exactly.

I'm not too bothered that someonelike Chick didn't ask the hard questions when nobody else was either- auditorsetc.

It bothers me greatly. He is paid by the tax funded BBC, the organisation that spends millions promoting it's world wide news service as the last bastion of impartiality, so it is his duty to ask questions to help reveal the truth.

His failure to do this doesn't just show him up to be the snivelling little rat that he is but also highlights the BBC's failure to carry out it's tax funded purpose and reveal what they and the whole of the Glasgow, and probably Scottish, media undoubtedly knew.

The BBC are as guilty as sin as being part of what is a major institutional cover up of the goings on at Ibrox and shows how rotten to the core the public and private sector corridors of power in Scotland are.

History is one thing but it has now been taintedfor 20 years.

So the first hundred or so years of blatant sectarianism is ok as they paid their billys bills? Every moment of this vile institution's history is tainted.

[Spain]

Also, to point out that Rangers were only found to be doing this because of Harry Rednapp is ludicrous. HMRC have found thousands upon thousands of firms up and down the country who have used the scheme. Even little companies up here in the Highlands. They investigated everywhere. Rangers were going to be found no matter what.

[Hipster Dufus]

Just to be clear, the administrators were appointed by the Court of Session

...at the request of Craig Whyte, no?

He started this thing and asked that D&P were assigned/given/tethered to this Blue Nightmare.

[Mark Connolly]

It bothers me greatly. He is paid by the tax funded BBC, the organisation that spends millions promoting it's world wide news service as the last bastion of impartiality, so it is his duty to ask questions to help reveal the truth.

His failure to do this doesn't just show him up to be the snivelling little rat that he is but also highlights the BBC's failure to carry out it's tax funded purpose and reveal what they and the whole of the Glasgow, and probably Scottish, media undoubtedly knew.

The BBC are as guilty as sin as being part of what is a major institutional cover up of the goings on at Ibrox and shows how rotten to the core the public and private sector corridors of power in Scotland are.

I don't know if you listened to Sportsound last night, but if you did, you would have heard Chico and Roddy Forsyth blaming the Business Editors, saying that it wasn't the job of football journos to look into the business side.

[Raith Against The Machine]

With hindsight, we really should have opted for the administration option.

It certainly looks that way. A ten point deduction in any of the seasons 2004-05, 05-06, 06-07 or 07-08 wouldn't have changed the league the team was playing in and offloading a load of debts at a fifth of their true value would've been handy.

[Granny Danger]

Glasgow honours for former Rangers manager Walter Smith. It is one of the city's highest honours and is presented to a person or group deemed to have "brought distinction and honour to Glasgow".

LINK

You have to love the timing.

[Mark Connolly]

It certainly looks that way. A ten point deduction in any of the seasons 2004-05, 05-06, 06-07 or 07-08 wouldn't have changed the league the team was playing in and offloading a load of debts at a fifth of their true value would've been handy.

Interesting viewpoint, Mr Whyte.......