Independence - how would you vote?

[caleyjaggi]

And this was before Rangers visited for a cup final.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/corrupt-manchester-police-conducted-hate-1942908

[Guest]

Stephen Hayes – who served as with Greater Manchester Police for 13 years – describes Glaswegians as “vermin” in his new book.

He's got a point tbf.

[Newbornbairn]

Can't blame Mancunians really.

[Ad Lib]

You mean the elderly.

Also, we're not in an age where owning a computer is at 100%. You can't just say "f**k the poor/old". Unless you're even more Tory than the Tories.

As a group in society, I hate the old. They're the real scroungers that have caused the decrease in the standard of living and life prospects of the current generation. I would abolish the state pension for those capable of working. No one has a right not to work at someone else's expense unless they specifically cannot by way of illness or disability.

I re-iterate that you don't need a computer. A fax machine will do. Failing that, they can send that incredibly rare letter by a courier, or by hand, or pay a fee to a private company who offers that service at its real market rate.

This isn't about accommodating these people's life choices to shun electronic communication. It's about telling them no one else is going to pay for their eccentric and antiquated drag on wider society.

[xbl]

As a group in society, I hate the old. They're the real scroungers that have caused the decrease in the standard of living and life prospects of the current generation. I would abolish the state pension for those capable of working. No one has a right not to work at someone else's expense unless they specifically cannot by way of illness or disability.

I re-iterate that you don't need a computer. A fax machine will do. Failing that, they can send that incredibly rare letter by a courier, or by hand, or pay a fee to a private company who offers that service at its real market rate.

This isn't about accommodating these people's life choices to shun electronic communication. It's about telling them no one else is going to pay for their eccentric and antiquated drag on wider society.

So speaks the voice of Liberal Britain. It doesn't do any harm to keep the post service, the cost is offset by profits off parcels, and older people quite clearly still enjoy sending cards and letters and the like. Its a bit like all the recent Lib Dem policies. Cuts that don't save any money (see the bedroom tax), carried out for the sake of ideology rather than for any actual good reason.

[Rabbi Williams]

I am very much for independence. I think it would definitely damage the rest of Britain but I believe Scotland would prosper. People say that oil won't last forever but they're constantly finding more and anyway Scotland isn't just an oil country, we have the ability to produce and manufacture. Without the influence of Westminster we can take a few steps back to the pre Thatcher days when we were an industrious nation and raise employment again. We also have a potential for a thriving tourist industry which those Neil Oliver ads don't do justice.

To be honest Britain's a sinking ship and the sooner we jump off the better.

[xbl]

Speaking of the Lib Dems, remember how certain people were jumping up and down, demanding that the SNP revealed their plan and their contingency plans?

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/scottish-independence-uk-right-not-to-negotiate-1-2960881

The UK Government is correct to refuse to plan for potential Scottish independence or pre-negotiate terms, Chief Treasury Secretary Danny Alexander has insisted.

Gotta love those Lib Dems!

[Ad Lib]

So speaks the voice of Liberal Britain. It doesn't do any harm to keep the post service, the cost is offset by profits off parcels, and older people quite clearly still enjoy sending cards and letters and the like. Its a bit like all the recent Lib Dem policies. Cuts that don't save any money (see the bedroom tax), carried out for the sake of ideology rather than for any actual good reason.

This is the thing though. If old people have a hobby they should pay for it themselves. Even allowing for your profit argument, it's a case for keeping the parcel service and the parcel service only. That would save actual physical money, because the letter service, uh, loses money.

This isn't rocket science. The "actual good reason" is that snail mail is a redundant method of communication, an inefficient method of communication, and a slow method of communication. It has zero utility. Even if the parcel service has a utility and is working well and should be kept by the state (though I'll argue separately that it shouldn't), the letter service MUST go.

Speaking of the Lib Dems, remember how certain people were jumping up and down, demanding that the SNP revealed their plan and their contingency plans?

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/scottish-independence-uk-right-not-to-negotiate-1-2960881

Gotta love those Lib Dems!

They're wrong and they should.

[renton]

As a group in society, I hate the old. They're the real scroungers that have caused the decrease in the standard of living and life prospects of the current generation. I would abolish the state pension for those capable of working. No one has a right not to work at someone else's expense unless they specifically cannot by way of illness or disability.

I re-iterate that you don't need a computer. A fax machine will do. Failing that, they can send that incredibly rare letter by a courier, or by hand, or pay a fee to a private company who offers that service at its real market rate.

This isn't about accommodating these people's life choices to shun electronic communication. It's about telling them no one else is going to pay for their eccentric and antiquated drag on wider society.

I wouldn't abolish it, but I would raise the age of retirement considerably. As a system, pensions were never designed to allow people to live without working for a good quarter of a century. There has to be a recognition that people live considerably longer and are on the whole far healthier, meanwhile, we live in a western society where physically demanding roles are on the decrease. It makes no sense not to ask these poeple to continue contributing to society past the age of 65.

[xbl]

I wouldn't abolish it, but I would raise the age of retirement considerably. As a system, pensions were never designed to allow people to live without working for a good quarter of a century. There has to be a recognition that people live considerably longer and are on the whole far healthier, meanwhile, we live in a western society where physically demanding roles are on the decrease. It makes no sense not to ask these poeple to continue contributing to society past the age of 65.

I'd also raise it somewhat. Times have changed. And like motorway speed limits, they should be amended to reflect modern realities.

I wouldn't axe a service that costs us no money, just to be cruel though.

[Ad Lib]

I'd also raise it somewhat. Times have changed. And like motorway speed limits, they should be amended to reflect modern realities.

I wouldn't axe a service that costs us no money, just to be cruel though.

The letter service does cost us money. See my signature.

And it's not "to be cruel" let alone "just" to be cruel. It's to modernise, economise and shape a society where the old are not given disproportionate privilege.

[xbl]

The letter service does cost us money. See my signature.

And it's not "to be cruel" let alone "just" to be cruel. It's to modernise, economise and shape a society where the old are not given disproportionate privilege.

These are weasel words. You should just stick to "cruel". It is more accurate.

[speckled tangerine]

Ad Lib is talking shite here. Let's punt off the Universal Service Obligated any address for a uniform price service we have now in favour of the private sector.

Over 1 million Scots are being ‘routinely ripped off’ by unfair delivery charges because of where they live, according to new evidence published today by Citizens Advice Scotland.

• At least 1 million Scots face surcharges, late delivery or are refused delivery altogether when they try to buy goods online.
• Consumers in Scotland’s island communities face a postcode penalty of nearly £19 extra (£18.60) to deliver goods they buy online – that’s a 500% mark up on the standard delivery price.
• Consumers in the Highlands are charged an extra £15 per delivery on average
• Of the 534 retailers whose policies we investigated, 335 of them (63%) charged extra for delivery to certain parts of the UK. 72% of those surcharges applied to consumers in Scotland, indicating that Scottish consumers are disproportionately affected by delivery surcharges.
• 55% of retailers who restricted the areas of the UK to which they would deliver refused to deliver goods to any Scottish islands, disadvantaging the estimated 100,000 people who live in island communities.
• Ofcom’s latest statistics show that UK shoppers spent an average of £1000 on online shopping on 2011
• 85% of the consumers who responded to our survey said they would warn family and friends against using a retailer with unfair delivery practices
• 34% of retailers we investigated said that delivery would take longer for consumers in some parts of the UK. 39% of these retailers took an extra three or more days to deliver to consumers in certain parts of Scotland, with some customers waiting as long as 35 extra days for delivery compared the rest of the UK.
• A quarter of retailers who told their consumers that delivery could take longer to them did not specify how long it would take. In addition, 44% of retailers who took longer to deliver did not specify which parts of the country were affected
• • 69% of retailers we investigated did not offer delivery by Royal Mail, despite the Royal Mail’s universal service obligation meaning that delivery by this method costs the same across the UK
  • 63% of the retailers who charged extra for delivery to some locations did not offer delivery by Royal Mail.

And just how much more does this cost us for this accident of Geography?

These “postcode penalties” are outlined in the table below.

Area affected Average additional price Average percentage mark up Highlands £15.23 195% Scottish Islands £18.60 508% Highlands and Islands £13.19 243% all offshore areas (UK) £16.03 331% Highlands and Islands + Northern Ireland £12.32 216% mixed areas (inc. Scotland) £12.06 260% mixed areas (not inc. Scotland) £15.42 303% Northern Ireland £9.29 127%

If it ain't broke. Don't fix it.

We'll end up with a shite service, at a greater price than before. Just like the Railways, Water south of the border etc etc.

[Ad Lib]

It's not the problem of people who live in cities if other people insist on stretching infrastructure by living in b*****d teuchter outposts.

[speckled tangerine]

It's not the problem of people who live in cities if other people insist on stretching infrastructure by living in b*****d teuchter outposts.

f**k me mate, are you sure you actually support independence? Sounds almost like....

It's not the problem of people who live in cities LONDON if other people insist on stretching infrastructure by living in b*****d teuchter Northern Provincial outposts.

You sound like Reynard FFS.

[Ad Lib]

f**k me mate, are you sure you actually support independence? Sounds almost like....

You sound like Reynard FFS.

I have no time for country folk who whinge about how terribly expensive their lives are. They chose to live there.

[Baxter Parp]

f**k me mate, are you sure you actually support independence? Sounds almost like....

You sound like Reynard FFS.

I'm guessing it's a wind-up, nobody with an IQ above seventy believes that pish.

[Desert Nomad]

 

And probably cut jobs as income falls and the need to be more competitive rises. Could be a quandary for postal workers, if any details are forthcoming prior to the referendum. 

Give us the technology that's out there then. It seems to have been rumbling on for years now that "modernisation" needs to happen. Er OK invest then. I'd certainly be happy to be rid of some of the backwards c***s in my work, all of whom will vote No incidentally.

[xbl]

I have no time for country folk who whinge about how terribly expensive their lives are. They chose to live there.

I'd call it a wind up, but it does seem to fit with existing Lib Dem and anti-Scottish policy, so it seems to match reality.Gotta love those Federalist Scottish Lib Dems, looking to decentralise everything except where people live.

[Bad Day]

As an English guy who's lived in Scotland for 15 out of 20 years do you think i should get a vote?

I don't think i will vote but i don't think Scotland should be independent. Salmond is also a plank.