All things Dundee FC

[This Charming Man]

If the current points return of an average 1.5 per game continues to the end of the season and the performances in general do not improve, maybe John Nelms will have a real wake up call when he surveys the Season Ticket uptake for next season. They're really getting off lightly on so many levels considering the fact supporters are not currently present at games.

If this season continues in the same vein, a third season under James McPake is completely unthinkable and today yet another available competent manager accepts a position elsewhere. 

Respect to the Americans for the financial backing however their commitment really deserves better. It's all in their own hands though.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

5 minutes ago, This Charming Man said:

Respect to the Americans for the financial backing however their commitment really deserves better. It's all in their own hands though.

American businessmen aren't noted for tolerating failure which is why a third season of McPake would be frankly incredible. I'm struggling to think of a single metric where you would give McPake a "pass" at best. In 40 leagues games over two seasons in the second tier, having been extremely well backed by the board with clearly the second biggest budget in both seasons, we have a goal difference of +1. 

As for the cups, last season he tactically shat it when 1-0 up against Aberdeen, we were emptied by Elgin out of the Challenge Cup and Motherwell cigared their way through our Scottish Cup tie. This season Hibs knocked us out of the League Cup barely breaking sweat and I hold little hope for the Scottish Cup tie either. 

Just what is Nelms seeing that literally no one else is? 

[Dundee-FC92]

Jim McIntyre is a better manager than Neil McCann and McPake combined. Anyone who argues with that fact is the reason these platforms are so painful to read sometimes.

McIntyre's won more as a manager than these two clowns ever will. 

His time at our club was poor but he didn't stand a chance with the absolutely woeful team he inherited and the fans on his back.

We had a stint where we looked good beating Hearts and Livi away and missing a last minute penalty to beat Killie at home. We took a big crowd to St Mirren and went ahead from Ethan Robson within a minute. The players on the pitch that day then didnt have the minerals which continued until the seasons end.

So easy to completely blame the manager and not look at any of the individuals that season.

McIntyres a w**k, I don't particularly like him, but Neil McCann and McPake simply arent football managers, McIntyre has been relatively successful.

Taking the length of tenures and margins of failure into account,  the blue tinted specs is the only reason people give McPake the edge.

Thank you.

[RawB93]

That's a bowfin' take, mate.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

NDD isn't all that far off tbh. Neil McCann is basically a TV pundit who fancies having a wee shot of being a Manager, and McPake is bordering on the worst we've ever had. McIntyre WAS a terrible choice by Nelms (shock) and the fact that Nelms didn't even do the most basic of research to realise why Dundee fans would be so opposed to Dodds coming along as assistance was remarkable. However, shite manager though he undoubtedly is, McIntyre has still achieved more than McCann or McPake in his utterly beige career. Any sort of favourable McPake versus McIntyre comparison needs filed in the bin also as McPake has thankfully never been let loose in the top tier, and probably never will be. 

The fact that we're actually having to debate whether Jim fucking McIntyre, a youth coach and a TV pundit are our worst managers is a damning indictment of Nelms in itself. Absolutely fucking tinpot stuff. 

[D TOTAL]

24 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

NDD isn't all that far off tbh. Neil McCann is basically a TV pundit who fancies having a wee shot of being a Manager, and McPake is bordering on the worst we've ever had. McIntyre WAS a terrible choice by Nelms (shock) and the fact that Nelms didn't even do the most basic of research to realise why Dundee fans would be so opposed to Dodds coming along as assistance was remarkable. However, shite manager though he undoubtedly is, McIntyre has still achieved more than McCann or McPake in his utterly beige career. Any sort of favourable McPake versus McIntyre comparison needs filed in the bin also as McPake has thankfully never been let loose in the top tier, and probably never will be. 

The fact that we're actually having to debate whether Jim fucking McIntyre, a youth coach and a TV pundit are our worst managers is a damning indictment of Nelms in itself. Absolutely fucking tinpot stuff. 

Macintyre has over 400 games of management experiences, I’d bet my left nut if Mcpake or McCann had that many games under their belt they would be a vastly superior manager to Macintyre, Mcpake is still very new with this being his 2nd season in the job with any preparation pretty much fecked from the get go and will make mistakes but after 400 games he’ll be 10x the manager Macintye is

[Ludo*1]

37 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

NDD isn't all that far off tbh. Neil McCann is basically a TV pundit who fancies having a wee shot of being a Manager, and McPake is bordering on the worst we've ever had. McIntyre WAS a terrible choice by Nelms (shock) and the fact that Nelms didn't even do the most basic of research to realise why Dundee fans would be so opposed to Dodds coming along as assistance was remarkable. However, shite manager though he undoubtedly is, McIntyre has still achieved more than McCann or McPake in his utterly beige career. Any sort of favourable McPake versus McIntyre comparison needs filed in the bin also as McPake has thankfully never been let loose in the top tier, and probably never will be. 

The fact that we're actually having to debate whether Jim fucking McIntyre, a youth coach and a TV pundit are our worst managers is a damning indictment of Nelms in itself. Absolutely fucking tinpot stuff. 

Out of interest, have you got a personal thing with McPake? I know he's shite but you've had it in for him from the start and you even admitted you've barely watched Dundee! Not judging, just genuinely wondering.

[Ludo*1]

Speaking of personal, I woke up to 15 notifications this morning thinking I'd posted something really profound that people were deeply engaged with, but nah, just NDD having a late one.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Ludo*1

[Dundee-FC92]

9 hours ago, RawB93 said:

That's a bowfin' take, mate.

How far did you expect McIntyre to beable to turn it around? 

In one of McCanns final home games in defeat to Kilmarnock we had in the squad:

Kerr
Inniss
Spence
Andrew Boyle
NGwatala
Nabi 
Madianga
Calvin Miller
Mendy
Jesse Curran

Unsurprisingly not one of these players have went onto better over the last few years because every single one of them is absolutely garbage for a team aiming for the top 6 (Nelms and McCann's aim at the seasons beginning).

From the ruins McCann left us in anyone would've found it hard to keep us up. After Scott Wrights free kick at Livi we were closing in on the teams above us and it looked like we were staying up. Some comments from this site after the Livi win:

'If that's been McCanns team we'd have  been beaten by 3 or 4'

'Regardless, out of the relegation spots and we have a team we can have some belief in. Bring on the Hibees!'

'We would not have won that game under McCann. The players today have more pace, more aggression and more confidence, more fight than the boys of Mcann in general.'

It absolutely went downhill not long after this game, but McIntyre came in and had us at a point of looking like staying up from McCanns car crash of a start. He didn't do all bad; he was just part of a series of inept appointments from Nelms. Who wouldve thought when he went we'd be handed James McPake to take us back up.

It's easy to forget how bad McCanns team was that season. I made it to most games of that few months to start the season and I've genuinely never seen such shite. The fallacy of good football being played is a nonsense aswell.

McCann is the worst manager of my lifetime. The only slack I'll give him is that he isn't even a manager and was thrown in by Nelms.

Thank you.

[Dundee-FC92]

1 hour ago, Day of the Lords said:

NDD isn't all that far off tbh. Neil McCann is basically a TV pundit who fancies having a wee shot of being a Manager, and McPake is bordering on the worst we've ever had. McIntyre WAS a terrible choice by Nelms (shock) and the fact that Nelms didn't even do the most basic of research to realise why Dundee fans would be so opposed to Dodds coming along as assistance was remarkable. However, shite manager though he undoubtedly is, McIntyre has still achieved more than McCann or McPake in his utterly beige career. Any sort of favourable McPake versus McIntyre comparison needs filed in the bin also as McPake has thankfully never been let loose in the top tier, and probably never will be. 

The fact that we're actually having to debate whether Jim fucking McIntyre, a youth coach and a TV pundit are our worst managers is a damning indictment of Nelms in itself. Absolutely fucking tinpot stuff. 

If we were to compare who was more suitable to take us up in the Championship then in would be McIntyre. Not that I'd want that to ever happen, but it can't be argued.

We were happy to promote McPake and say have a go to him though. This attitude was the same from many fans on here who gave him a season to bed in when we had a budget to take us up (like this season). 

The clubs an absolute joke and has been for many a year. There's no end in sight until we have change from top to bottom. It's as simple as that.

If we sneak up in the play offs this season we'll come straight back down.

McPake has to go immediately.

Thank you.

[capt_oats]

18 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

Stephen Robinson can want what he wants. There's not a chance he'll get a club that can achieve more than top 3.

Like Tommy, he'll soon grow desperate, apply for our job and be overlooked by Nelms because Bobby Geddes has been here a while.

Ironically I think that with Keyes/Nelms seemingly willing to continue to throw money into a massive pit Robinson would be very interested in what they had to say (before he was overlooked for Bobby Geddes). Especially if the Campy project ever actually happens.

In fairness to RG what he's saying is pretty much how Robinson's set his stall out since he resigned. To the surprise of absolutely no one he's been very much focussing on how he'd taken Motherwell as far as he could - hence the 3rd is Motherwell's ceiling line - and less so on having Motherwell sitting 10th in the league without a win in 9 or whatever it was.

You're right though, what he says he wants and what's offered to him are two very different things. I wouldn't go as far as to say you've "no chance" but I think he'll definitely give his next job a lot of thought given his relative experiences at Oldham and Motherwell.

The main difference between him and TW (IMO) is he probably has better options and a shot of getting a gig in England with more of a willingness to take it. Bearing in mind local press down there were reporting that a completely different Tommy Wright had interviewed for the Motherwell job I don't think it's a stretch to say that the actual one doesn't exactly have a profile down there.

Though he's distancing himself from it now through his time at Motherwell Robinson was constantly being linked with English jobs - Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Luton etc I don't think those links were quite the "surprise" he was trying to present it as when he was on Sportsound the other week.

It wouldn't be a massive surprise to me to see him pitch up at a Preston or a L1 side with promotion aspirations like Ipswich.

Edited February 8, 2021 by capt_oats

[harry94]

Quality reporting, going to buy a subscription so I can learn what happened.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

3 hours ago, D TOTAL said:

Macintyre has over 400 games of management experiences, I’d bet my left nut if Mcpake or McCann had that many games under their belt they would be a vastly superior manager to Macintyre, Mcpake is still very new with this being his 2nd season in the job with any preparation pretty much fecked from the get go and will make mistakes but after 400 games he’ll be 10x the manager Macintye is

Can't wait for the Championship playoffs in 2029-2030. 

3 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

Out of interest, have you got a personal thing with McPake? I know he's shite but you've had it in for him from the start and you even admitted you've barely watched Dundee! Not judging, just genuinely wondering.

Nothing personal at all. When you've followed Dundee over many years through such boardroom clusterfucks as Cook, Drummond, Dixon, the Marrs and Melville, and probably a few others I've blanked/forgotten, it is incredibly frustrating that in this period of relative calm at boardroom level, we're continuing to employ a poor manager, especially when one was recently available who most of us agree would have done a much better job. 

Perhaps I've forgotten that eternal frustration is a key requisite for supporting Dundee 

[RawB93]

1 hour ago, harry94 said:

Quality reporting, going to buy a subscription so I can learn what happened.

DUNDEE man (20) learns this ONE trick that makes coaches HATE him!

[Crawford]

39 minutes ago, RawB93 said:

DUNDEE man (20) learns this ONE trick that makes coaches HATE him!

About coughed up my lung and it's not the rona. Thanks for that 

[realmadrid]

While McPake is punted surely Charlie Adam will take over, if he's not already in charge. 

Probably a better network of contacts and someone who actually cares about your club.

[RossBFaeDundee]

10 minutes ago, realmadrid said:

someone who actually cares about your club.

You could criticise McPake's coaching and managerial abilities all you want, and about most things you'd be right, but you can't pretend he doesn't care about the club.

[Derry Alli]

1 hour ago, realmadrid said:

While McPake is punted surely Charlie Adam will take over, if he's not already in charge. 

[RossBFaeDundee]

Jordon Forster self-isolating as a precaution. Imo he should be isolating as a precaution until the end of the season.

[Boo Khaki]

Well he spends plenty of time socially distancing himself from opposition forwards anyway.

Baddum-tish, here all week, etc etc