~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 I don't drink, don't encourage others to drink. For me that is enough. As for putting you on a guilt trip, if there isn't any problem with alchohol consumption then there wouldn't be anything to feel guilty about. A massive difference between not encouraging people to drink and simply telling them they're not allowed to have a beer for having the cheek to be a football fan. Trust me, I have no guilt. just don't enjoy being preached to someone with a twisted sense of morality who seems to think the best way to win an argument is guilt trip them. Using that A&E analogy we might aswell ban driving, cycling, skiing, or anything else you deem as dangerous You're entire argument against lifting the ban is nothing more than you living in the past, unable to accept things have changed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 A massive difference between not encouraging people to drink and simply telling them they're not allowed to have a beer for having the cheek to be a football fan. Trust me, I have no guilt. just don't enjoy being preached to someone with a twisted sense of morality who seems to think the best way to win an argument is guilt trip them. Using that A&E analogy we might aswell ban driving, cycling, skiing, or anything else you deem as dangerous You're entire argument against lifting the ban is nothing more than you living in the past, unable to accept things have changed What a lousy argument. Tell you what, why don't we remove the drink drive limit if alchohol doesn't cause any problems. There is a difference between undertaking these activities and consuming a drug that impairs your judgement. I have no doubt that there are vast numbers of people that could go to the football, have a drink and enjoy it with no issues. At Peterhead it is entirely possible to do this just now with the social club. However, the people that act like total fuds are more often than not the ones that are intoxicated. You can make the arguement that things have changed, but what has changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 What a lousy argument. Tell you what, why don't we remove the drink drive limit if alchohol doesn't cause any problems. There is a difference between undertaking these activities and consuming a drug that impairs your judgement. I have no doubt that there are vast numbers of people that could go to the football, have a drink and enjoy it with no issues. At Peterhead it is entirely possible to do this just now with the social club. However, the people that act like total fuds are more often than not the ones that are intoxicated. You can make the arguement that things have changed, but what has changed? Your argument seems to be based on people somehow getting smashed within 2 hours on overpriced low alcoholic beer in a plastic cup. ludicrous argument, even more so when you're trying to compare having a beer watching a game of football with drinking and driving a fucking car. You ask how things have changed, football has never been safer. You have more women, children, families attending games than ever before, it's better policed and better stewarded than it ever was. Also, back in the "good old days" of the 70s, fans could pitch up in the stadium a few hours before kick off, with a crate of lager or bottles of spirits, get smashed. This is not what is being suggested. What is being suggested is a football fan having the same rights as someone going to a gig, festivals or to watch the rugby, having a choice for a beer if so desired. I used to live near Hampden, and I can tell you one thing, I've never seen anything worse than seeing grown women after a Take That concert outside the stadium struggling to walk, pished, pissing on the streets, causing an utter mess and getting into scraps with each other. Point being, you'll have fuds everywhere, not just at football games, yet someone it's only the football fans who seem to suffer from this archaic law, yet the rest of the UK and Europe can someone manage fine. Keeping in mind the ban forbids people having an alcoholic drink inside the stadium in view of the pitch, Nothing you can do about people going to the pub before or afterwards, unless you're suggesting we just close down pubs. A trip to A&E at the weekends would show you how much trouble they cause... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 I usually reach the game well oiled. Bring back smoking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddly optomistic Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Your argument seems to be based on people somehow getting smashed within 2 hours on overpriced low alcoholic beer in a plastic cup. ludicrous argument, This is not what is being suggested. What is being suggested is a football fan having the same rights as someone going to a gig, festivals or to watch the rugby, having a choice for a beer if so desired. I used to live near Hampden, and I can tell you one thing, I've never seen anything worse than seeing grown women after a Take That concert outside the stadium struggling to walk, pished, pissing on the streets, causing an utter mess and getting into scraps with each other. Does that mean that people can get smashed over a couple of hours at a Take That concert but it wouldn't be feasible at a couple of hours of football. Seems a bit contradictory. Presumably if people are scrapping outside a concert then the same would happen at football grounds. There are also stewards at concerts. Add in the factor of footballing rivalry and it seems likely that there would be more scraps. If you're argument is that people make an idiot of themselves at concerts then why can't football fans do it, doesn't seem very progressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddly optomistic Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 this thread's gone a bit off topic since it's supposed to be about Murphy. Maybe should get back to topic at hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 it, doesn't seem very progressive. Sorry, remind me why singling out football fans for a ban on alcohol inside the stadium in view of the pitch is deemed progressive? It's not as if it is something that would be seen to improve Scotland relationship with alcohol or paving the way forward for the rest of europe to follow suit. Appears to be draconian to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddly optomistic Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 When we have rugby and cricket casuals causing problems then we can ban them too. But thus far they don't seem to have a big issue. It's not draconian, it's common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkoRaj Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm sure you can't take alcohol to your seat at the football in England? So the most difference it will make will be an extra pint or 2 at ko and half time and a few hundred quid in the club's coffers. Sounds ok to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 When we have rugby and cricket casuals causing problems then we can ban them too. But thus far they don't seem to have a big issue. It's not draconian, it's common sense. Can't help but notice you didn't answer my question as to why a ban on alcohol inside the stadium in view of the pitch is progressive? anytime now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm sure you can't take alcohol to your seat at the football in England? So the most difference it will make will be an extra pint or 2 at ko and half time and a few hundred quid in the club's coffers. Sounds ok to me. Correct, you're allowed to have a beer in the concourse, i've yet to seen fans rioting inside the stadium on a drunken rampage. Keeping in mind English fans history with hooliganism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddly optomistic Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 It's clearly reduced trouble at games over the years. If you don't believe that then your deluded. Can't help but notice that you didn't comment regarding that people get drunk at concerts but it wouldn't happen at football. Or that if they scrap outside Take That concerts why they wouldn't scrap outside football stadiums where rivalries are in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 23, 2014 Share Posted December 23, 2014 It's clearly reduced trouble at games over the years. If you don't believe that then your deluded. Can't help but notice that you didn't comment regarding that people get drunk at concerts but it wouldn't happen at football. Or that if they scrap outside Take That concerts why they wouldn't scrap outside football stadiums where rivalries are in place. I've came to the conclusion. you're either a troll or an idiot. My point regarding the concert, which isn't nearly as well policed or stewarded as a football match is you can't single out football fans for such a ban yet allow other forms of entertainment continue. So, what is it, you want to ban all alcohol and pubs, or just any event with a number of people attending Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 I've came to the conclusion. you're either a troll or an idiot. My point regarding the concert, which isn't nearly as well policed or stewarded as a football match is you can't single out football fans for such a ban yet allow other forms of entertainment continue. So, what is it, you want to ban all alcohol and pubs, or just any event with a number of people attending Make the choice - an afternoon down the pub on a Saturday or go to the footy knowing that you will have to abstain for a couple of hours. Why does it involve banning alchohol and pubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oddly optomistic Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 I've came to the conclusion. you're either a troll or an idiot. My point regarding the concert, which isn't nearly as well policed or stewarded as a football match is you can't single out football fans for such a ban yet allow other forms of entertainment continue. So, what is it, you want to ban all alcohol and pubs, or just any event with a number of people attending You know that's what not what I said. The fact remains that concerts are not plagued with casuals causing problems. As I said earlier if there are issues at rugby or cricket then look at them etc. I also believe I said at the beginning of this conversation that it was my opinion. I'm not an expert and neither of you. If you choose to think that anyone that has a different opinion to you is a troll or an idiot then that's your prerogative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Make the choice - an afternoon down the pub on a Saturday or go to the footy knowing that you will have to abstain for a couple of hours. Why does it involve banning alchohol and pubs. Haven't you seen the damaged it causes at weekends in A&E? You still haven't explained why it's necessary for football fans to be banned from having a drink within the stadium in view of the pitch? Why don't you see weekly drunken riots in England or across europe, since these people are allowed a low alcoholic beers in plastic glasses? Realistically, during a game, how many drinks could 1 person have during a game, after having to queue up, maybe 2? Enough to cause a chain reaction that would lead to carnage within the stadium? Remember, this is 2014, we are not discussing the events of the 1970s when not only football, but society was different. I'll wait for a detailed answer destroying my argument. Anything less would just come across as straw clutching, living in the past. Keeping in mind the argument is about allowing fans to have a beer while watching the game, not about society larger problem with alcohol, unless you can prove the football ban somehow has changed our attitudes towards alcohol? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Haven't you seen the damaged it causes at weekends in A&E? You still haven't explained why it's necessary for football fans to be banned from having a drink within the stadium in view of the pitch? Why don't you see weekly drunken riots in England or across europe, since these people are allowed a low alcoholic beers in plastic glasses? Realistically, during a game, how many drinks could 1 person have during a game, after having to queue up, maybe 2? Enough to cause a chain reaction that would lead to carnage within the stadium? Remember, this is 2014, we are not discussing the events of the 1970s when not only football, but society was different. I'll wait for a detailed answer destroying my argument. Anything less would just come across as straw clutching, living in the past. Keeping in mind the argument is about allowing fans to have a beer while watching the game, not about society larger problem with alcohol, unless you can prove the football ban somehow has changed our attitudes towards alcohol? Why do you need alchohol at football? It really is that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugster Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 Why do you need alchohol at football? It really is that simple. You dont, and I don't think anyone is saying you do. It's not quite that simple. You don't "need" pies, bovrils, programmes, soft drinks, etc. They are there as a choice for the consumer and an income stream for the clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodoffBaldrick Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 You dont, and I don't think anyone is saying you do. It's not quite that simple. You don't "need" pies, bovrils, programmes, soft drinks, etc. They are there as a choice for the consumer and an income stream for the clubs. None of the alternative examples you give above have got any connotations with violence though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaikuHibee Posted December 24, 2014 Share Posted December 24, 2014 It's Gers-Celtic games. Ignore it all you want folks. That's why there's a ban. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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