When will indyref2 happen?

[Baxter Parp]

19 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Youre a diddy, im making the point that Scottish NHS via scottish government has a resilience/emergency planning responsibility and showed you one example of its sops one of which shows in section 2.5 that they are aware of the risk of pandemic flu. Youre having a mare.

It has a plan outlining what a health board should do in the event of a localised incident not a fucking national emergency. 2.5 doesn't plan for a pandemic, it points to lessons learned from one. You're just being blatantly dishonest now.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

It has a plan outlining what a health board should do in the event of a localised incident not a fucking national emergency. 2.5 doesn't plan for a pandemic, it points to lessons learned from one. You're just being blatantly dishonest now.

The sop i posted is from Ready Scotland, who are the people who plan for emergencies in Scotland, you said that emergency planning was reserved and attempt to put all the blame on Westminster. The particular SOP i highlighted is just one of many but its very clear that Ready Scotland had knowledge and learning from a previous flu pandemic, yet doesnt seem apparent in the pish poor initial response, you just carry on being an apologist. Its embarrassing as a yes voter to see someone like you so absolutely desperate to blame everyone but your side for something bad, is a lot of the blame at Westminsters feet, yes, but the Scottish government was clearly caught short, how you can argue against that is absolutely beyond me.

[Granny Danger]

On 09/05/2020 at 20:19, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Youre absolutely incapable of accepting that the scottish government isnt perfect. Yes certain things are devolved and reserved, im fucking patently aware of that, however ensuring adequate stocks of PPE would fall to the Scottish Government/NHS emergency planning, of which Scotland has a body called ‘Ready Scotland’. Their own website, their SOP’s recognise the necessity of Scotland public bodies to prepare for emergencies. In particular some of their literature talks about learning from influenza pandemic of 2009 and readiness from then https://www.readyscotland.org/media/1112/mpc_guidance_-_scotland_-_final_may_2014.pdf

Mate ffs im not saying the Scottish government are at Tory levels of incompetence but f**k me they were caught with their trousers down, have a bit of humility and just accept that they fucked it, running about with your fingers in ears singing ‘lalalala’ doesn’t help.

Are you saying that the Scottish Government rather than the UK Government is primarily responsible for pandemic risk assessment and planning?

 

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Are you saying that the Scottish Government rather than the UK Government is primarily responsible for pandemic risk assessment and planning?

 

Im saying that they both share responsibility for the pish poor response to this, both have had warnings over years that such an event was likely, both governments acknowledge that exercises and modelling into such events have taken place and have either grossly misinterpreted what would be required or ignored the findings. The poster I was replying to made out that planning for emergencies was an entirely reserved matter, when its not even remotely that cut and dried, as shown Scotlands government has its own resilience department whos job is to plan for emergencies within the public sector departments which are devolved, having first hand experience of the slow initial response and apparent lack of planning in my own public sector job and my wifes, i feel like I have to challenge this notion that the Scottish government have got their response right. I think the divergence from Bojo’s idiocy today and the continuance of the stay at home strategy is good but I still think it was too lax. When you have one small local authority area in Scotland, inverclyde population 75k with more deaths than a huge country, Australia 30million, that doesnt to me indicate a good response, especially coupled with the latters multiple direct links to the source of the outbreak both in business, travel and culturally, compared with the formers complete lack of all of these.

 

Yes i acknowledge budgetary issues are subject to westminster austerity etc but i dont think any one of the parties in power have come out of this having done particularly well. Im simply challenging this notion that everything bad thats happened is entirely westminsters fault and the snp are blameless, too many people not willing to see the full picture.

[Baxter Parp]

1 hour ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Im saying that they both share responsibility for the pish poor response to this

Yeah, that's shite.  You're saying the Scottish Government had a responsibility to maintain the UK's PPE emergency capability and that's just totally and completely wrong.

[Baxter Parp]

15 hours ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

The sop i posted is from Ready Scotland, who are the people who plan for emergencies in Scotland, you said that emergency planning was reserved and attempt to put all the blame on Westminster.

National emergency planning is reserved. You're conflating a local incident with a UK wide emergency dishonestly. I'm saying you're a fucking liar, if it helps.

[Granny Danger]

1 hour ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Im saying that they both share responsibility for the pish poor response to this, both have had warnings over years that such an event was likely, both governments acknowledge that exercises and modelling into such events have taken place and have either grossly misinterpreted what would be required or ignored the findings. The poster I was replying to made out that planning for emergencies was an entirely reserved matter, when its not even remotely that cut and dried, as shown Scotlands government has its own resilience department whos job is to plan for emergencies within the public sector departments which are devolved, having first hand experience of the slow initial response and apparent lack of planning in my own public sector job and my wifes, i feel like I have to challenge this notion that the Scottish government have got their response right. I think the divergence from Bojo’s idiocy today and the continuance of the stay at home strategy is good but I still think it was too lax. When you have one small local authority area in Scotland, inverclyde population 75k with more deaths than a huge country, Australia 30million, that doesnt to me indicate a good response, especially coupled with the latters multiple direct links to the source of the outbreak both in business, travel and culturally, compared with the formers complete lack of all of these.

 

Yes i acknowledge budgetary issues are subject to westminster austerity etc but i dont think any one of the parties in power have come out of this having done particularly well. Im simply challenging this notion that everything bad thats happened is entirely westminsters fault and the snp are blameless, too many people not willing to see the full picture.

I don’t think the Scottish government are ‘blameless’, once the dust settles we will need to look long and hard at the actions of both the U.K. and Scottish governments.

I do think that since pandemic planning is not devolved and that successive Conservative governments have apparently ignored the findings of Operation Cygnus then they are primarily responsible.  I don’t know if the devolved administrations were even involved in Cygnus or made aware of its findings.

It does seem to be he case, as was claimed in the ST expose a couple of weeks back, that whilst a pandemic was officially accepted the most serious threat to the U.K. in reality it’s seriousness was downplayed and sufficient planning and resources were not put in place to tackle such an event. 

Add that to the policy of austerity, that you yourself refer to, I think it’s quite obvious where the majority of the blame for our unpreparedness, and the consequences of that unpreparedness lies.

 

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

National emergency planning is reserved. You're conflating a local incident with a UK wide emergency dishonestly. I'm saying you're a fucking liar, if it helps.

No im clearly not, Im saying that the Scottish Government has a resilience agency that undertakes Scottish Planning for emergencies. Scotland has its own public health strategies as health is devolved. Im aware that the SOP i posted (its one of many) was advice for local health boards, i wasnt claiming it to be anything other than that, however it does clearly indicate that Scotland was aware of the risk of pandemic flu from previous outbreaks and would have been aware of op cygnus also.
Scotlands health boards, government departments police and fire all have requisite emergency planning departments, I know this because i’ve worked with them, so how that makes me a liar is entirely beyond me.
You’re shouty angry man rhetoric is tiresome.

[Baxter Parp]

2 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

No im clearly not, Im saying that the Scottish Government has a resilience agency that undertakes Scottish Planning for emergencies. Scotland has its own public health strategies as health is devolved. Im aware that the SOP i posted (its one of many) was advice for local health boards, i wasnt claiming it to be anything other than that, however it does clearly indicate that Scotland was aware of the risk of pandemic flu from previous outbreaks and would have been aware of op cygnus also.
Scotlands health boards, government departments police and fire all have requisite emergency planning departments, I know this because i’ve worked with them, so how that makes me a liar is entirely beyond me.
You’re shouty angry man rhetoric is tiresome.

National (UK-wide) emergencies are reserved. Your determination to conflate local incidents with a UK-wide pandemic is disingenuous at best and utterly dishonest at worst.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

National (UK-wide) emergencies are reserved. Your determination to conflate local incidents with a UK-wide pandemic is disingenuous at best and utterly dishonest at worst.

Scotland has its own public bodies who were not ready for this pandemic, bodies such as Police Scotland, The Scottish NHS and Ready Scotland, show me how its the UK government’s responsibility to plan for the response of devolved organisations? Actually don’t show me, I genuinely give up debating people like you, youre just as bad as the raging brit-nats.

[Baxter Parp]

6 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Scotland has its own public bodies who were not ready for this pandemic, bodies such as Police Scotland, The Scottish NHS and Ready Scotland, show me how its the UK government’s responsibility to plan for the response of devolved organisations? Actually don’t show me, I genuinely give up debating people like you, youre just as bad as the raging brit-nats.

Scotland is not responsible for being ready for UK-wide emergencies, full stop. Preparation for UK-wide emergencies is the responsibility of the UK government as that is a reserved power. You've decided not to understand this because you're a dishonest f**k.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Scotland is not responsible for being ready for UK-wide emergencies, full stop. Preparation for UK-wide emergencies is the responsibility of the UK government as that is a reserved power. You've decided not to understand this because you're a dishonest f**k.

Which UK bodies do the planning for the devolved Scottish Police, Fire, NHS and social care which is operated different in Scotland? Im genuinely curious?

[Baxter Parp]

6 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Which UK bodies do the planning for the devolved Scottish Police, Fire, NHS and social care which is operated different in Scotland? Im genuinely curious?

UK bodies don't do planning for local services, that's what the document you linked to was all about.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

UK bodies don't do planning for local services, that's what the document you linked to was all about.

Would that be the local health boards who are responding to the pandemic? Who plans for social care? Who plans for the police and fire response? The ‘local services’ youre talking about, would these be devolved services? You know the ones which werent ready and were caught short?

[Baxter Parp]

1 minute ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Would that be the local health boards who are responding to the pandemic? Who plans for social care? Who plans for the police and fire response? The ‘local services’ youre talking about, would these be devolved services? You know the ones which werent ready and were caught short?

Jesus f**k, I despair. Do you not know the difference between a local incident and a UK-wide emergency?  For the nth time, national emergencies are reserved . The UK govt and the UK govt alone is responsible for preparing for a UK-wide emergency.  You're welcome to provide any fucking evidence to the contrary. Anything at all.  Anything.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Jesus f**k, I despair. Do you not know the difference between a local incident and a UK-wide emergency?  For the nth time, national emergencies are reserved . The UK govt and the UK govt alone is responsible for preparing for a UK-wide emergency.  You're welcome to provide any fucking evidence to the contrary. Anything at all.  Anything.

Mate you dont get it at all. Public bodies in Scotland make their own plans for emergencies. Thats why Scotlands response is now diverting from the rUK.

It’s also why the public body i work for is now undertaking a review of its response to aid future planning.

[Baxter Parp]

Just now, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Mate you dont get it at all.

Mate, you've got nothing.  ScotGov isn't responsible for the national stock of PPE in any shape or form. You're nothing but a concern troll.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Mate, you've got nothing.  ScotGov isn't responsible for the national stock of PPE in any shape or form. You're nothing but a concern troll.

Lololol ok.

[Baxter Parp]

2 minutes ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

Lololol ok.

Quite.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Quite.

Aye