Freedom Farter Posted May 2 Share Posted May 2 (edited) (https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/35-years-scottish-attitudes-towards-independence). Politics is fundamentally about society deciding how we distribute our collective resources among ourselves. If the distribution of those resources alienates enough people then they will look for change. This is what brought the Scottish independence movement into prominence and what remains the driving force behind it. Of course identity or other philosophical ideas come into it for many folk but material conditions will always remain at the root of it. Edited May 2 by Freedom Farter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi2 Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 Emma Roddick now wants a 'continued' union with England Post Indy. How does that work? Vote for us and we will get you Independe...no, that's not right..Vote for us and we will get you.. Shared Currency Shared Crown Shared Broadcasting Shared Defence/Foreign Policy Might park the nuclear weapons for you We might get some extra Social Security Powers Most importantly we can wave our own fleg. Still, when you have architect of the Vow Murray Foote as Chief Exec no surprise 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 Sorry, not interested in independence unless it involves retaking Derby. I'm off to vote Abla. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 57 minutes ago, Jedi2 said: Emma Roddick now wants a 'continued' union with England Post Indy. How does that work? Vote for us and we will get you Independe...no, that's not right..Vote for us and we will get you.. Shared Currency Shared Crown Shared Broadcasting Shared Defence/Foreign Policy Might park the nuclear weapons for you We might get some extra Social Security Powers Most importantly we can wave our own fleg. Still, when you have architect of the Vow Murray Foote as Chief Exec no surprise As far as I can see, this is just more ridiculous speculation from Jedi. As ever, there are no direct quotes, and I can't find anything online where recently demoted ex-minister Roddick says anything about currency, the crown, broadcasting, defence/nukes, social security or flegs. Pathetic, really. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 hour ago, Jedi2 said: Emma Roddick now wants a 'continued' union with England Post Indy. How does that work? Vote for us and we will get you Independe...no, that's not right..Vote for us and we will get you.. Shared Currency Shared Crown Shared Broadcasting Shared Defence/Foreign Policy Might park the nuclear weapons for you We might get some extra Social Security Powers Most importantly we can wave our own fleg. Still, when you have architect of the Vow Murray Foote as Chief Exec no surprise If I was a Nationalist, then I’d be raging with Roddick. One of the most baffling things I’ve ever heard from a politician. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 minute ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: If I was a Nationalist, then I’d be raging with Roddick. One of the most baffling things I’ve ever heard from a politician. Given that she never said any of the stuff ascribed to her by Jedi, do you want to try again? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 6 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said: Given that she never said any of the stuff ascribed to her by Jedi, do you want to try again? I wasn’t actually referring to what Jedi said, just her comments in general, as have been reported in that well known bastion of Unionism.. The National. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 (edited) 22 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I wasn’t actually referring to what Jedi said, just her comments in general, as have been reported in that well known bastion of Unionism.. The National. If you didn't intend to refer to Jedi's nonsense, why quote him? Anyway, which part of Roddick's statements in the National do you think I should be "raging" about? Please provide direct quotes from the National to illustrate your point. Would it be this? “What we have now is not a union. If you look at what we had when we were in the EU, the UK had the same voice as everyone else. Scotland doesn’t have that in the UK. If we had that cooperation with the rest of the UK, I would be well up for a union with our closest neighbours.” England is our nearest neighbour and the only one with whom we share a land border. It would be in both our interests to come to a cooperation agreement after independence which wouldn’t look anything like the current arrangement. Neither would one country govern the other - if either side wanted to resile, they could do so. However, if England chose not to come to an international agreement (like their Brexit lunacy), that would be their perogative. Obviously, our exports of water & power to them would be affected, but I'm sure they will cope. Edited May 17 by lichtgilphead expoerts! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 minute ago, lichtgilphead said: If you didn't intend to refer to Jedi's nonsense, why quote him? Anyway, which part of Roddick's statements in the National do you think I should be "raging" about? Please provide direct quotes from the National to illustrate your point. Would it be this? “What we have now is not a union. If you look at what we had when we were in the EU, the UK had the same voice as everyone else. Scotland doesn’t have that in the UK. If we had that cooperation with the rest of the UK, I would be well up for a union with our closest neighbours.” England is our nearest neighbour and the only one with whom we share a land border. It would be in both our interests to come to a cooperation agreement after independence which wouldn’t look anything like the current arrangement. Neither would one country govern the other - if either side wanted to resile, they could do so. However, if England chose not to come to an international agreement (like their Brexit lunacy), that would be their perogative. Obviously, our expoerts of water & power to them would be affected, but I'm sure they will cope. Because I was replying to him mate. It could actually be argued that you’re interrupting our conversation! I’m referring to the below: Quote SNP MSP: Scottish independence 'should not be end of union with UK' A FORMER Scottish Government minister has argued Scottish independence should not be the end of a union with the rest of the UK, adding this should form a key part of the case going forward 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 minute ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Because I was replying to him mate. It could actually be argued that you’re interrupting our conversation! I’m referring to the below: Ah yes, the little bit of the article that isn't behind the National's paywall. You haven't even read the whole article, have you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 minute ago, lichtgilphead said: Ah yes, the little bit of the article that isn't behind the National's paywall. You haven't even read the whole article, have you. No, I haven’t. Is The National lying? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi2 Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 (edited) https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-national-scotland/20240515/281586655698529inued' union with England Post Indy. All out of my own head. The comments aren't really Emma Roddick and Murray Foote isn't really the Chief Exec of the SNP, nor was he the editor of the Daily Record at the time of the Vow, but still... Edited May 17 by Jedi2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 Just now, CarrbridgeSaintee said: No, I haven’t. Is The National lying? Why not read the whole article and make your own mind up? Unfortunately, Jedi's attempt to link to it doesn't work, however. Typically incompetent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 3 minutes ago, Jedi2 said: https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-national-scotland/20240515/281586655698529inued' union with England Post Indy. All out of my own head. The comments aren't really Emma Roddick and Murray Foote isn't really the Chief Exec of the SNP, nor was he the editor of the Daily Record at the time of the Vow, but still... I see the paragraph before ‘What we have now is not a Union’ was left out by @lichtgilphead. I can’t think why. A real head scratcher that one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 1 minute ago, lichtgilphead said: Why not read the whole article and make your own mind up? Unfortunately, Jedi's attempt to link to it doesn't work, however. Typically incompetent. I just have. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi2 Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 'I would love an Independent Scotland to be in some sort of union or co-operation agreement with what is currently the rest of the UK' It 'wasnt' Emma Roddick that said this of course she was clearly misquoted in the article 'Some sort of union'....wild speculation on shared currency, crown, defence etc......wait a minute..that's what the White Paper proposed in 2014 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi2 Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/utterly-deluded-snp-msp-emma-32817931 The intellectual collusus @lichtgilphead has decreed that Emma Roddick didn't say any of these things though and we know the master of every subject is never wrong. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 (edited) 7 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I see the paragraph before ‘What we have now is not a Union’ was left out by @lichtgilphead. I can’t think why. A real head scratcher that one. Oh, is this the paragraph I should be raging about then? "“I don’t want Scotland to be independent and then act on our own, I want us to be a voice on the world stage and promote international cooperation,” Roddick told The National. “It would be daft not to include England, Wales, and Ireland in that. I would love to have an independent Scotland be in some sort of union or cooperation agreement with the rest of what is currently the UK." Why should this have me "raging" Do you think I want Indy Scotland to act like North Korea? Edited May 17 by lichtgilphead 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 6 minutes ago, Jedi2 said: 'I would love an Independent Scotland to be in some sort of union or co-operation agreement with what is currently the rest of the UK' It 'wasnt' Emma Roddick that said this of course she was clearly misquoted in the article 'Some sort of union'....wild speculation on shared currency, crown, defence etc......wait a minute..that's what the White Paper proposed in 2014 Did Emma actually say anything about shared currency, crown, defence etc? Please quote her. 2 minutes ago, Jedi2 said: https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/utterly-deluded-snp-msp-emma-32817931 The intellectual collusus @lichtgilphead has decreed that Emma Roddick didn't say any of these things though and we know the master of every subject is never wrong. Jedi's quoting the Express now! Hard borders all the way! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted May 17 Share Posted May 17 10 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said: Oh, is this the paragraph I should be raging about then? "“I don’t want Scotland to be independent and then act on our own, I want us to be a voice on the world stage and promote international cooperation,” Roddick told The National. “It would be daft not to include England, Wales, and Ireland in that. I would love to have an independent Scotland be in some sort of union or cooperation agreement with the rest of what is currently the UK." Why should this have me "raging" Do you think I want Indy Scotland to act like North Korea? No, I don’t. I’d expect Nats to be raging, because what she is saying will lose the SNP votes. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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